Justify atheism. Please

[hutash]

I was going to quote a couple people here. but,

You ever been in real trouble ? Really jammed up and scared.?

I remember years back I crashed my motorcycle, 120 MPH and ended up in a ditch.
I looked up at the sky and said, "God please help me"
and I am an atheist?

What is real?

That brings up an interesting point...

Last December I crashed a car off the freeway at 70 mph. Something broke in the right rear suspension, and pitched me off the freeway totally out of control. As the car started to slide I was heading right for a light stanchion. It was going to hit me right at the divers side door, the weakest point of impact. It was the first and only time I seriously thought that I was going to die. Not maybe, but that this was it. The interesting thing was how clear everything was in the one to two seconds this all went down. As I was sliding into the pole I thought this is exactly how a World Rally co-driver died a few years ago when they pitched of the road and had a side impact into a tree, hence why I figured that I am going to die. No thought of god, or please help, etc, just, "well I guess that's it."

Turns out the impact was just behind me on the B pillar, side airbags deployed, the light stanchion broke away and I ended up nearly upside down in a bunch of eucalyptus trees, but managed to not hit the trunks, just a bunch of branches. Walked away without a scratch, just two little bruises. I never felt there was a miracle or "somebody" was looking out for me. What I did think when I saw where the light pole snapped off, and how the airbags deployed, etc was "damn I'm glad engineers no what they are doing."

Not the slightist inkling of religion ever crossed my mind. So, yeah I'm and atheist, but it is not a belief system, but just an application of common sense and reason.

[snoqpass]

This place needs some miracle water

http://peterpopoff.org/portfolio/widget-2/

[jono]

Anyone ever had an atheist knock on thier door in an attempt to convert them?

I expect OP is more referring to SJW atheists than door knockers. Proselytizing with modern technology is a little different, after all. How do the Scientologists do it?

[GeezerSteve]

How do the Scientologists do it?

marketing, mostly, often very deceptive, i.e., like most religions

[uglymoney]

I consider myself atheist. In other words I do not believe in a god and I make no apologies for that or give two fucks how people judge me or read into my lack of belief in god or almost total disinterest in religion. My only real interest in religion stems from my desire to understand people.

It does not mean I couldn't be persuaded with evidence or an acid trip that there is something more out there. It does not limit my universe or my dimensions to what I can see and feel. Nor does it mean that I shun or judge religious or god fearing people beyond the normal stereotyping of all people that I fight as best I can to keep in check. I just don't care because I consider it nonsense. Agnostic is too apologetic for where I am at.



Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[mcski]

Inside we both know what's going on. We know the game and we're gonna play it.

[uglymoney]

That brings up an interesting point...

Last December I crashed a car off the freeway at 70 mph. Something broke in the right rear suspension, and pitched me off the freeway totally out of control. As the car started to slide I was heading right for a light stanchion. It was going to hit me right at the divers side door, the weakest point of impact. It was the first and only time I seriously thought that I was going to die. Not maybe, but that this was it. The interesting thing was how clear everything was in the one to two seconds this all went down. As I was sliding into the pole I thought this is exactly how a World Rally co-driver died a few years ago when they pitched of the road and had a side impact into a tree, hence why I figured that I am going to die. No thought of god, or please help, etc, just, "well I guess that's it."

Turns out the impact was just behind me on the B pillar, side airbags deployed, the light stanchion broke away and I ended up nearly upside down in a bunch of eucalyptus trees, but managed to not hit the trunks, just a bunch of branches. Walked away without a scratch, just two little bruises. I never felt there was a miracle or "somebody" was looking out for me. What I did think when I saw where the light pole snapped off, and how the airbags deployed, etc was "damn I'm glad engineers no what they are doing."

Not the slightist inkling of religion ever crossed my mind. So, yeah I'm and atheist, but it is not a belief system, but just an application of common sense and reason.

Hutash I have had similar life bending moments and god never crosses my mind. When I busted myself up a couple years ago and was contemplating my future I was flabbergasted at a woman friend we know who told me it was all gods plan and I should just roll with it. What? Not how I think.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[BigDaddy]

Hutash has had a tough year... damn. And yes, the "God did this or that" comments are amusing. I let them slide and shrug a little inside...

Exactly.
Let’s party bro [/spicoli]

Seriously. Come visit.

I need a Kalmus 5.2 session or two this summer. Will definitely keep in touch.

[GeezerSteve]

In other words I do not believe in a god and I make no apologies for that or give two fucks how people judge me or read into my lack of belief in god or almost total disinterest in religion. * * *

It does not mean I couldn't be persuaded with evidence or an acid trip that there is something more out there. It does not limit my universe or my dimensions to what I can see and feel. * * * I just don't care because I consider it nonsense. Agnostic is too apologetic for where I am at.

Per classic definitions, you sound more agnostic than atheist.

The classic shorthand definitions:
-- an atheist denies the existence of a deity
-- an agnostic denies the knowledge of a deity

T. H. Huxely, who coined the term "agnostic," observed:

Agnosticism is of the essence of science, whether ancient or modern. It simply means that a man shall not say he knows or believes that which he has no scientific grounds for professing to know or believe. Consequently, agnosticism puts aside not only the greater part of popular theology, but also the greater part of anti-theology.
* * *
Agnosticism, in fact, is not a creed, but a method, the essence of which lies in the rigorous application of a single principle * * * Positively the principle may be expressed: In matters of the intellect, follow your reason as far as it will take you, without regard to any other consideration. And negatively: In matters of the intellect do not pretend that conclusions are certain which are not demonstrated or demonstrable.

[TBS]

That brings up an interesting point...

Last December I crashed a car off the freeway at 70 mph. Something broke in the right rear suspension, and pitched me off the freeway totally out of control. As the car started to slide I was heading right for a light stanchion. It was going to hit me right at the divers side door, the weakest point of impact. It was the first and only time I seriously thought that I was going to die. Not maybe, but that this was it. The interesting thing was how clear everything was in the one to two seconds this all went down. As I was sliding into the pole I thought this is exactly how a World Rally co-driver died a few years ago when they pitched of the road and had a side impact into a tree, hence why I figured that I am going to die. No thought of god, or please help, etc, just, "well I guess that's it."

Turns out the impact was just behind me on the B pillar, side airbags deployed, the light stanchion broke away and I ended up nearly upside down in a bunch of eucalyptus trees, but managed to not hit the trunks, just a bunch of branches. Walked away without a scratch, just two little bruises. I never felt there was a miracle or "somebody" was looking out for me. What I did think when I saw where the light pole snapped off, and how the airbags deployed, etc was "damn I'm glad engineers no what they are doing."

Not the slightist inkling of religion ever crossed my mind. So, yeah I'm and atheist, but it is not a belief system, but just an application of common sense and reason.

A few years ago at a family reunion a cousin was telling my brother an I about a recent near fatal crash. He fell asleep at the wheel and went off the road into a steep wooded ravine. He managed to avoid any bodily injury.

“My guardian angel was watching over me” he said

Brother and I looked at each other for a second and burst out laughing.

“What’s so funny?” He asked.

I said “how come your guardian angel let you fall asleep and run off the road in the first place?”

Brother said “ your guardian angel is a retard. Time to trade up”

[Buster Highmen]

FWIW, I had a bad seizure years ago and thought I was dying.

It was the most painful thing I've ever been through and the only time I ended up in the ICU.

So as I wandered in and out of consciousness, finding myself in catscan tubes, ambulances and ICU, I just remember thinking that if this was it, I was OK with it. I remember that feeling of peace some people have described in near death experiences and basically being pretty happy and feeling lucky in the life I'd experienced.

The big light and all that happened, but I don't remember thinking it was some deity, just peace. I can understand how people that think more belief based attach a religious experience to it. I just didn't.

[jono]

Nor does it mean that I shun or judge religious or god fearing people beyond the normal stereotyping of all people that I fight as best I can to keep in check.

How much would you say is "normal?"

[uglymoney]

How much would you say is "normal?"

How lazy of a brain is normal? Getting to know every single person is a lot of work/impossible. Understanding that isn't hard but keeping the brain from lazily dividing everyone into buckets takes work.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[highangle]

Don't confuse believing with thinking, they are 2 very different modes of conceptual honking.

I've said this before: I hoped that the enlightenment was the beginning of people beginning to value the process of scientific thinking, the nature of scientific theory over the modes of belief. All the cool shit that science has brought about is based on looking at wads of data, where we have to have a very flexible grip on what that data "means", and coming up with models that allow us to manipulate the phenomenon that data supposedly represents. I still think quantum mechanics and one of it's crown jewels, the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle is a summit of human thought.

Theories are supposed to be challenged. Belief is not, even though lots of believers claim that beliefs should be challenged, but there's no basis for challenging a belief.

Faith, hope and dreams all have their place in the stadiums of mental activity and for a lot of people, they serve a function.

So, I think Atheism is a belief. Agnosticism is a theory.

As usual, I like what the Rev had to p00t. I guess the thing I find most attractive about theories and Agnosticism is the sense of wonder.

I do think we've rescinded into modes of belief more now that the informational age and fake news has hit.

Agnostics don't believe in God. Atheism is a prerequisite for agnosticism.

[Peruvian]

This I believe

[kathleenturneroverdrive]

I don’t get the rampant militant atheism these days.

That is absolutely not a thing in the real world.

And FYI to everyone responding to this thread seriously - Core Shot is just about a Pizzagater. You can’t reason with stupid.

Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[hutash]

A few years ago at a family reunion a cousin was telling my brother an I about a recent near fatal crash. He fell asleep at the wheel and went off the road into a steep wooded ravine. He managed to avoid any bodily injury.

“My guardian angel was watching over me” he said

Brother and I looked at each other for a second and burst out laughing.

“What’s so funny?” He asked.

I said “how come your guardian angel let you fall asleep and run off the road in the first place?”

Brother said “ your guardian angel is a retard. Time to trade up”

I got a similar line from people after all the shit that has happened to me recently. "Wow, your guardian angel is really looking out for you." My reply has been, "I wish he would have intervened a little earlier and prevented my house from burning, or the car from crashing." Seems to me he's not doing a very good job.

And, fuck god if this is all his plan. It's enough to make me not believe in god if he is such a vindictively little fuck.

[uglymoney]

Per classic definitions, you sound more agnostic than atheist.

The classic shorthand definitions:
-- an atheist denies the existence of a deity
-- an agnostic denies the knowledge of a deity

T. H. Huxely, who coined the term "agnostic," observed:

I get bored with the details on this stuff but based on that I am both but far closer to an atheist. I will 99.999% die denying the existence of a deity. That doesn't leave much wiggle room but maybe that is all it takes. I am more comfortable knowing that I am stuck in a deep rut of circular thought which is possible to break out of somehow and see more, understand more than I do now because that much is clear.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[GeezerSteve]

Agnostics don't believe in God. Atheism is a prerequisite for agnosticism.

Nah and nah, unless you're making up your own definitions

[k2skier112]

Anyone ever had an atheist knock on thier door in an attempt to convert them?

I have Freedom From Religion handouts to give to those spreading the word.

It's baffled me why those that believe in an invisible man in the sky say those that don't believe have to prove the nonexistence.

[hutash]

Agnosticism is just atheism lite.

[riser4]

[Rip'nStick]

No it's not. Atheism is without god(s), agnostic is without knowledge. Even hardcore believers are atheists about all gods but one. I just take it that last step. The best evidence points to no god, so that's where I go. If better evidence is presented I will change...nothing radical about that, or gravity for that matter.

But do you know for certain. And what is your definition. A divine intelligence controlling you or the environment?

One could argue that the number of information/interactions on Earth are than synaptic level of human brain, and it appears to be a fairly self regulated system that survives outside threats like big rocks.

Collects energy and uses it for complexity kind,of like us.

I think you would agree on all that. You and I just don't think God would be human like in the sense of our pettiness.

What God would ask Abraham to kill his child to prove faithfulness. What an asshole move

Its all about the definition. I am an atheist, agnostic, or true believer depending on definition of God.

But all the main religions on earth are nuts, Buddhism isn't a religion.

[Supermoon]

Humans are hardwired to need to believe in a religion. For some, that religion is atheism.

[Rip'nStick]

BTW when in deep shit, I always tell God I am his humble servant and I will continue to do good things for mankind and this planet if we can just move an inch. I have received these blessing and continue on my mission to do good.