Ukraine

[farmguy]

on top of that every conflict the USA has entered/started in the last 50 years has been left as a steaming pile of dogshit, worse off then the countries were before. Maybe the USA should start playing by the same rule book we like to write.

The problem IS the rule book!

[SoVT Joey]

The problem IS the rule book!

1000000%

either stay out of the wars, or leave it looking like the face of mars. Nothing left.

[skifishbum]

well yeah yur gonna be soli underwhelmed if ya cant nut up the gnar to git up the goods


but kudos for not dexcuntin up the booter like this thread

maybe make it off the front side and the main street nastar course next time

[Cono Este]

Zelensky has promised a weapon to every man or woman who wants one.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ns-2022-02-24/

Thoughts?


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[SoVT Joey]

Zelensky has promised a weapon to every man or woman who wants one.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ns-2022-02-24/

Thoughts?


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

gonna be interesting when the government wants them all back after the war…

[TAFKALVS]

Zelensky has promised a weapon to every man or woman who wants one.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ns-2022-02-24/

Thoughts?


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

I'm somewhat surprised that they waited until now to hand out guns.

[Dexter Rutecki]

I don't think lack of guns will be the problem over there, if it really comes down to it.

I'd like to know how far Putin takes this--I don't think he's delusional enough to think he could truly occupy the whole country, and he personally remembers how Afghanistan went, so...this is probably just Crimea 2.0 (and death by 1000 cuts to Ukraine?).

[dunfree]

Turn off MSNBC and look at a map. We play war games a few hundred miles from the Russian capitol. If that isn't aggression I don't know what is.

lol. Dude, stop eating Russian propaganda and fox bullshit. This ain’t the us fault. Putin invades & kills it’s what he does.


There really are some deeply stupid people on this board

[::: :::]

This is true. Well said.

The Mexicans seem to invade peacefully. And the Canadians just cross the border to shop or go to FL for 4 months.

What soup is that?

https://www.thespruceeats.com/easy-a...le-soup-995385

[Hood26]

Turn off MSNBC and look at a map. We play war games a few hundred miles from the Russian capitol. If that isn't aggression I don't know what is.

Russia has been trying to eradicate Ukrainian people, Ukrainian language, and Ukrainian religion for centuries. Russia has wanted Ukrainian land extract food from for centuries. Go read of the Holodomor and then tell me Putin’s aggression has anything to do with American military preparedness.

Russia has been the bully playing the victim since the time of Napoleon.

I am a student of history and I am watching Sky news at the moment. I will flip over to Fox soon to see their RT influenced spin soon.

[Hood26]

Under the Soviet System, Ukraine received 16% of the allocated resource and produced 17% of the industrial output and 21% of the agricultural output.

Russia today wants to steal Ukraine because it is the breadbasket of Central Europe.

[Yukonrider]

Putin invades & kills it’s what he does.


There really are some deeply stupid people on this board

If you think the United States has the moral high ground on the invading and killing front then I agree with your second statement.

[LongShortLong]

Zelensky has promised a weapon to every man or woman who wants one.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ns-2022-02-24/

Thoughts?


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

A military attack against us, the people of this world, by a dictator hmm. I think we ought to be providing that weapon, probably wielding it*.

* Probably, b/c "hang together or hang separately" seems to apply. However, I'm not an international relations expert and there may be a better way to counter.

[highangle]

If you think the United States has the moral high ground on the invading and killing front then I agree with your second statement.

Pure Soviet whataboutism is obvious rhetorical trash. Are you trying to make a "Both sides are the same!" point in support of Putin and his actions in Ukraine?

Is that what you're here for?

[frorider]

lol. Dude, stop eating Russian propaganda and fox bullshit. This ain’t the us fault. Putin invades & kills it’s what he does.


There really are some deeply stupid people on this board

Anyone else notice that a lot of pundits predicted Putin would create a a false flag event to ‘justify’ his aggression, but then he said Fuck It and just invaded?

Meanwhile in Russia

On Tuesday, Yuri Dudt, one of Russia’s most popular media personalities, said he “did not vote for this regime” and its need for an empire and felt ashamed, in a post that received almost a million likes in 24 hours.

A fresh poll by the independent Levada Center released on Thursday showed that only 45% of Russians stood in favour of the recognition move that preceded Thursday morning’s dramatic events.

“I didn’t think Putin would be willing to go all the way. How can we bomb Ukraine? Our countries have their disagreements, but this is not a way to solve them,” said Muscovite Ksenia.

But outcries of anger were not only felt on the streets of Moscow, where the Guardian did not encounter support for the military assault.

Russia’s cultural and sporting elite, usually firmly behind Putin and often called upon by the president during election campaigns to gather popular support, also expressed their deep worries about Russia’s invasion.

Valery Meladze, arguable the country’s most beloved singer, posted an emotional video in which he “begged” Russia to stop the war.

[dunfree]

Anyone else notice that a lot of pundits predicted Putin would create a a false flag event to ‘justify’ his aggression, but then he said Fuck It and just invaded?

Meanwhile in Russia

They tried to create several false flags, that were laughably bad, and didn’t get coverage. I mean the guy blew up apartment blocks to start a war in Chechenya this isn’t out of character

Yukonrider - if you think there is no difference get the fuck out.

[highangle]

Anyone else notice that a lot of pundits predicted Putin would create a a false flag event to ‘justify’ his aggression, but then he said Fuck It and just invaded?

They tossed a few out there, but none of them got any traction. Remember last week when "peaceful Russians were being shelled from the Chernobyl Zone"? mmmyeah

[summit]

A Russian controlled "demilitarized" Ukraine is exactly what Russia needs if they later wish to threaten Europe, particularly the Baltics, the obvious next move to "get NATO off our doorstep" and also establish a land corridor to the Kaliningrad enclave. This would complete Putin's post Soviet empire dreams.

Ukraine can be remilitarized just like the Rhineland was in 1936 to keep NATO forces divided in the prelude to the next Russian invasion.

It might come in concert with China moving on Taiwan, or it might not, with China merely paying Russia off for holding Western forces in Europe to counter Russia rather than deploying against China, potentially forcing a settlement giving up support for Taiwan.

The future is interesting in the Chinese proverbial sense.

We must absolutely do everything possible to ensure Ukraine remain free west of the Dnieper and that east of the Dnieper is a quagmire of insurgency to keep the Bear ensnarled. Everything possible that is except overt combat against Russian forces.

Fuck Vladimir Putin. Godspeed Ukraine. Remember the Holodomor and stack the Russian bodies deep.

[summit]

Fighting amongst ourselves is what the Russian, Chinese, Iranian, and NK info-ops against the West have been working hard on for over a decade (and really much longer). They have been extraordinarily successful as our vision has become insular and driven by the latest tweet and a focus on legitimate domestic problems has allowed our enemies to maneuver to dominate first the edges of the free world, and then the sphere of Allies that have allowed our culture to progress to the point where we can care and correct domestic injustice. Now we have to rise above domestic tribalism and attend to existential matters. We must rally first around our flag, then around our closest allies, then our treaty partners, and then the free world.

Or shortsighted culture must look up from tomorrow and look at next decade. Dictators can do that because they assume they will be around then. We can too, if we demand it of ourselves and our leaders. The fate of the free world is at a balance point. We can push the scales and hold the line, or we can begin an unstoppable slide into decades of darkness, turmoil, and war.

Realize that the differences at home are nowhere near the differences abroad. Spend five minutes looking at the fates of dominated nations and know what I mean. There is a cost to stand, but the cost of falling is much higher and more permanent. So fuck your domestic tribal identities that our foreign enemies demand we focus on. Join hands, stand for freedom, liberty, and the rule of law.

Fuck Putin and Fuck Xi

[frorider]

They tossed a few out there, but none of them got any traction. Remember last week when "peaceful Russians were being shelled from the Chernobyl Zone"? mmmyeah

Nope I didn’t see that. Although I did read today about a shelling last week of a nursery in Donbas that was an attempted false flag.

[oldnew_guy]

30 years of western aggression and marginalization against Russia have culminated in this. The finger is to be pointed at all politicians who propped up cold war politics, and profited off the fear of the Russian bogey man.

Does that finger also point at everyday Ukrainians who made it pretty clear in2014 they don’t want to be part or or a puppet state to Russia?

[Yukonrider]

Pure Soviet whataboutism is obvious rhetorical trash. Are you trying to make a "Both sides are the same!" point in support of Putin and his actions in Ukraine?

Is that what you're here for?

Where I stand on the whole issue is that I don't condone Russia's actions, but I believe they are justifiable.

And I generally like to highlight the glaring double standards that Americans ignore in regards to foreign countries flexing their muscles. We have fought (and lost) several unjust wars in the past decades. Our indignant response to Russia's actions is somewhat tone deaf to our own previous actions.

[dan_pdx]

Now we have to rise above domestic tribalism and attend to existential matters. We must rally first around our flag, then around our closest allies, then our treaty partners, and then the free world.

Or shortsighted culture must look up from tomorrow and look at next decade. Dictators can do that because they assume they will be around then. We can too, if we demand it of ourselves and our leaders. The fate of the free world is at a balance point. We can push the scales and hold the line, or we can begin an unstoppable slide into decades of darkness, turmoil, and war.

Well said

[Mazderati]

I guess RU has Chernobyl now which is nice?

[406]

Fighting amongst ourselves is what the Russian, Chinese, Iranian, and NK info-ops against the West have been working hard on for over a decade (and really much longer). They have been extraordinarily successful as our vision has become insular and driven by the latest tweet and a focus on legitimate domestic problems has allowed our enemies to maneuver to dominate first the edges of the free world, and then the sphere of Allies that have allowed our culture to progress to the point where we can care and correct domestic injustice. Now we have to rise above domestic tribalism and attend to existential matters. We must rally first around our flag, then around our closest allies, then our treaty partners, and then the free world.

Or shortsighted culture must look up from tomorrow and look at next decade. Dictators can do that because they assume they will be around then. We can too, if we demand it of ourselves and our leaders. The fate of the free world is at a balance point. We can push the scales and hold the line, or we can begin an unstoppable slide into decades of darkness, turmoil, and war.

Realize that the differences at home are nowhere near the differences abroad. Spend five minutes looking at the fates of dominated nations and know what I mean. There is a cost to stand, but the cost of falling is much higher and more permanent. So fuck your domestic tribal identities that our foreign enemies demand we focus on. Join hands, stand for freedom, liberty, and the rule of law.

Fuck Putin and Fuck Xi

Well said. Hopefully West goes all in on sanctions asap, take the domestic hit as soon as possible. Spin up domestic production and normalize higher prices.

Odds Taiwan makes it to end of year? Is there anything we can do against China?