Shit you built with your own two hands (picture thread)

**Buster Highmen** · 08-10-2021, 06:49 PM

Second floor 2x8 joists going in. 10.5 ft span.
Progress impeded by lack of 4x8 hangers with a top flange dealio.

#dreamshack

**jackstraw** · 08-11-2021, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by Buster Highmen

Second floor 2x8 joists going in. 10.5 ft span.
Progress impeded by lack of 4x8 hangers with a top flange dealio.

#dreamshack

What's on the 2nd floor? If bodies, I'd throw some blocking in-between the joists to help stiffen her up. 2x8 is sufficient for the span, but blocking will lessen the bounce.

**Mustonen** · 08-11-2021, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by jackstraw

What's on the 2nd floor? If bodies, I'd throw some blocking in-between the joists to help stiffen her up. 2x8 is sufficient for the span, but blocking will lessen the bounce.

Weird place to keep your bodies, and I think you’ll find that the smell ruins the vibe of the #dreamshack. If you can’t bury them in the backyard, liv2ski knows a good place.

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by jackstraw

What's on the 2nd floor? If bodies, I'd throw some blocking in-between the joists to help stiffen her up. 2x8 is sufficient for the span, but blocking will lessen the bounce.

Sleeping loft. 4' tall in back, 8' tall in front. Sloped shed roof.
There may be stiffening and bouncing going on up there, so I will take your advice.

The design includes a stairway wrapping around the back corner, so I am planning on using 2 4x8s to border the stairwell. Finding the hangers with the top flange has been a challenge. We debated doing the usual joists on the topcap, but that makes wall building round that back stairwell corner a lot harder than using joists.

Thanks. I'm a compl33t newb at this shit.

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Mustonen

Weird place to keep your bodies, and I think you’ll find that the smell ruins the vibe of the #dreamshack. If you can’t bury them in the backyard, liv2ski knows a good place.

The voice of experience? Uff da.

**jackstraw** · 08-11-2021, 12:44 PM

Originally Posted by Mustonen

Weird place to keep your bodies, and I think you’ll find that the smell ruins the vibe of the #dreamshack. If you can’t bury them in the backyard, liv2ski knows a good place.

Vapor barrier between floors will help for a short time and keep some of the oozing from seeping thru.

**RootSkier** · 08-11-2021, 12:46 PM

Buster, you are inventing a new style of framing. I like it, even though it seems like an absolute shit ton of extra work.

**jackstraw** · 08-11-2021, 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by Buster Highmen

Sleeping loft. 4' tall in back, 8' tall in front. Sloped shed roof.
There may be stiffening and bouncing going on up there, so I will take your advice.

The design includes a stairway wrapping around the back corner, so I am planning on using 2 4x8s to border the stairwell. Finding the hangers with the top flange has been a challenge. We debated doing the usual joists on the topcap, but that makes wall building round that back stairwell corner a lot harder than using joists.

Thanks. I'm a compl33t newb at this shit.

I'm an ancient carpenter from my winter ski days, so I'm rusty on what's current. But you can just double up 2 -2x8's to head off the stairwell. You should be able to find joist hangers for that, but with the covid supply shitshow who knows. Next shack sit the floor joists on top of the walls. You'd still need hangers to head off the stairwell, but not for every joist.

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by RootSkier

Buster, you are inventing a new style of framing. I like it, even though it seems like an absolute shit ton of extra work.

I don't know shit and grant that I'm doing it weird, hopefully over engineered (rhymes!). I expect muffled and overt laughter, but hey, I'll learn something. Your shit is so tight, I should be embarrassed, but fuck it, I'm a washed up programmer who wants something useful to build.

I did the 2x10 headers all around since there's going to be a lot of glass (recycled full light wood doors) rather than just over the "windows".

**fatnslow** · 08-11-2021, 12:56 PM

Will you be able to finish framing and sheet everything in before it starts raining ?

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 12:56 PM

Originally Posted by jackstraw

I'm an ancient carpenter from my winter ski days, so I'm rusty on what's current. But you can just double up 2 -2x8's to head off the stairwell. You should be able to find joist hangers for that, but with the covid supply shitshow who knows. Next shack sit the floor joists on top of the walls. You'd still need hangers to head off the stairwell, but not for every joist.

That's what I'm doing: putting 2 2x8s together with wood screws, alternating sides. Just found some 4x8 hangers online and ordered them.

Anyway, yeah, if I'd done the joists on top of the cap, that makes the back corner of the stairwell trickier.

With hangers, I can put the second floor wall footer on top of the topcap.

Unless of course I'm missing something totally obvious.

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 12:59 PM

Originally Posted by fatnslow

Will you be able to finish framing and sheet everything in before it starts raining ?

Good question. My son is still home (heads back to Reed in 2 weeks for start of sophomore year, already being groomed by faculty for Watson and Fullbright). So I'm hoping to get the second story walls up before he goes. After that, the birdmouthed roof rafters shouldn't bee too hard and I think I understand how to do the roof framing. Once that's done, hopefully I'll have a sheeting party (Norse?) before the rains start.

**wendigo** · 08-11-2021, 01:01 PM

say it with me now "sheathing" - cool looking place, building stuff sure is satisfying when most of the day is spent on a computer

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 01:05 PM

well, sheath, then.

Yeah, our house is small for a family of 4, so visitors (like Dibs) have had to sleep on the couch. Now we will have some crash space and a place where our teenagers can have friends over without the inconvenience of dealing with the 'rents.

It's 12' x 10', with a sleeping loft and lots of glass. The view out the back is down a super cool, mossy natural alley of sitkas, broadleaf maples, cedars and doug fir.

I loved building software, but now very few places are doing system development, drivers, busses, etc and they all want fresh meat rather than the sinewy cranky old stuff.

**old_newguy** · 08-11-2021, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by Buster Highmen

That's what I'm doing: putting 2 2x8s together with wood screws, alternating sides. Just found some 4x8 hangers online and ordered them.

Anyway, yeah, if I'd done the joists on top of the cap, that makes the back corner of the stairwell trickier.

With hangers, I can put the second floor wall footer on top of the topcap.

Unless of course I'm missing something totally obvious.

My recollection of code is that screws are too brittle for attaching two joists together and that nails are preferable. I did something similar for a deck with 2x10s a few years back and I seem to recall the code specified nails and a mailing pattern.

(I realize you aren’t building to code necessarily, but it can still be a good guide.)

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 01:10 PM

Originally Posted by old_newguy

My recollection of code is that screws are too brittle for attaching two joists together and that nails are preferable. I did something similar for a deck with 2x10s a few years back and I seem to recall the code specified nails and a mailing pattern.

(I realize you aren’t building to code necessarily, but it can still be a good guide.)

OK, thanks, I'll do both.

I thought if I did 2 1/2 inch screws from either side, that would be sufficiently burly for inside application. I could do bolts too with massive washers.

**Not DJSapp** · 08-11-2021, 01:59 PM

Yup. For shear loads, nails bend, screws snap (or split the wood). Your structure is going to move with the seasons, so you want your fasteners to move with it. Back those screws out. This isn't a case where more is better.

**::: :::** · 08-11-2021, 02:07 PM

not exciting reading, but for ref...prescriptive wall code WA residential
https://up.codes/viewer/washington/w...construction#6

chap 8 is roof

**Mustonen** · 08-11-2021, 02:10 PM

Nails over screws x whatever. Screws are shit for shear strength. Make sure you didn’t use screws for your hangers, either…..

Sister those joists with a bunch of nails. 3 per 16 inches is standard, I think. I like angling them in alternating directions, so if you looked at them from the top or bottom with an x ray you’d see an X. That’s almost certainly unnecessary, though.

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by Not DJSapp

Yup. For shear loads, nails bend, screws snap (or split the wood). Your structure is going to move with the seasons, so you want your fasteners to move with it. Back those screws out. This isn't a case where more is better.

Well, awrighty then.
I haven't screwed, nailed, bolted, glued or lesbostrapped the 2x8s together yet. I'll nail them.
Any wisdom on bolts with washers?

**Mustonen** · 08-11-2021, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by Buster Highmen

Well, awrighty then.
I haven't screwed, nailed, bolted, glued or lesbostrapped the 2x8s together yet. I'll nail them.
Any wisdom on bolts with washers?

Bolts are tough.

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by Mustonen

Nails over screws x whatever. Screws are shit for shear strength. Make sure you didn’t use screws for your hangers, either…..

Sister those joists with a bunch of nails. 3 per 16 inches is standard, I think. I like angling them in alternating directions, so if you looked at them from the top or bottom with an x ray you’d see an X. That’s almost certainly unnecessary, though.

Everything so far is nails except bolts, nuts & washers for the 2x12 foundation supports.
I ran bolted 2x12 ground treated lumber on brackets mounted on ez-tube pylons.

I'll take the joists to the nail salon for the X treatment.

Thanks again! You fuckers rawk.

**Not DJSapp** · 08-11-2021, 02:16 PM

Originally Posted by Mustonen

Nails over screws x whatever. Screws are shit for shear strength. Make sure you didn’t use screws for your hangers, either…..

Sister those joists with a bunch of nails. 3 per 16 inches is standard, I think. I like angling them in alternating directions, so if you looked at them from the top or bottom with an x ray you’d see an X. That’s almost certainly unnecessary, though.

Nitpicky engineering point here: screws are superior to nails in pure shear strength. Screws are (generally) made of harder steel which is less ductile and more brittle. This means more strength and less bending. Until they break. A nail which is bending inbetween two boards is actually more difficult to remove and it will not break.

**Buster Highmen** · 08-11-2021, 02:19 PM

Shear strength is not sheer strength. Got it.
I'll depart the Enginerding Nail Salon now.

**Mustonen** · 08-11-2021, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by Not DJSapp

Nitpicky engineering point here: screws are superior to nails in pure shear strength. Screws are (generally) made of harder steel which is less ductile and more brittle. This means more strength and less bending. Until they break. A nail which is bending inbetween two boards is actually more difficult to remove and it will not break.

Intredasting. Is the point of confusion “safe” or “recommended” shear load vs. absolute shear strength? Because all the stuff I’ve ever seen has nails as significantly superior in that regard for equivalent diameter fasteners.