brettf Enduro SL Review Thread

[brettf]

Disclaimer: I am very opinionated about bikes. I'll try to keep it so you don't have to take everything with a grain of salt. I'll try to keep opinion and thoughts about other bikes out of it… and yes, this review is very long.
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Okay... So I bought one. I've been eying the Enduro SL since they announced the geometry and the weight. I finally got it, promptly threw on a better front tire (Specialized Enduro 2.4”), seat (some crappy old WTB from a busted-down single-speed), and an adjustable seatpost (Maverick Speedball), and I was off.

Background
I figure it is always good to get some background on a review so you know what angle you are getting info from… so here’s my background; I've been riding bikes for years. I've become pretty good at riding trail bikes up and down but have only really started to not suck at riding DH bikes in the last season. I used to think that I would be good at riding DH on full king-hell-heavy-pig bikes because I could descent fast on trail bikes, but I'd blow fast corners all the time, not be able to carry momentum, no flow, no jumps... I'm getting it now. Not awesome, but better. I’m starting to get that endorphin rush from flowing down trails… you know the one. Same as the powder rush.

I earn probably 95% of my turns or more. So I think I have a much more XC oriented background than someone like kidwoo who gave an awesome review on his SL. It is important to me to have a bike that climbs very well and descends very well. I will eat some climbing performance for descending, but it needs to be able to do both well as I’m going to spend lots of hours climbing. Also, it needs to be light enough to climb in the middle ring for all but the steepest climbs. The SL is kind of one of those bikes in that rare niche that is really built for people who want to rip a descent but need to climb to get there. There are some other bikes out there that fit this, but I don't think any do it so blatantly as the Enduro SL with its relative light weight, aggressive (slack) angles and mean-as-hell low bottom bracket.

I have about 12 hours on the bike right now. Most of my time was spent climbing (unfortunately, that's how it goes, right?) That's three rides by my count. So, yes, this is still an initial impression. I'll post updates as I go.

So... the bike, the build, and the parts:
I got a screaming deal on it to begin with. I bought the "comp", which is the most “entry” of the levels. If I keep the bike (more on that later), there are a number of changes I'll make. It is a decent build and a reasonable pricepoint at retail compared to other offerings, but still a pretty penny. Since there are parts that I'd replace if I bought any build level, the Comp was the best bang-for-the-buck for me. I'll save my comments on the components for later.

The Ride - Climbing:
The bike climbs. It even climbs reasonably well for what it is. But climb like a cracked-out mountain goat it does not. It is very climbable in the 'firm' setting in the shock, but feels uber-dead. I have a strong dislike for platform valved shocks. They always seem to feel dead... this bike is no exception unfortunately. Sitting and spinning with the shock set to wide open (term used very loosely with propedalish shocks) gets you where you want to go pretty well with minimum suspension feedback robbing you of your energy. You can even still stand and sprint climb if you are smooth. Caveman mashing at a full stand turns the bike into a jackhammer slopping around in wet cement. You might make that mistake once... but probably not twice. You can behave like a caveman with the shock set to firm all you want though - it'll take it and get you where you want to go. Just don’t expect an active rear-end while doing it.

The fork has the travel adjust on it so you can slam the fork down an inch or so to reduce the front-height, and the head-tube angle respectively. It is nice, but I find that this bike's tendency to bob a little makes you want to leave it high so you can do the tightrope balancing act that keeps your rear wheel weighted properly for traction. I did find myself using it a couple of times on short, very steep climbs that required visiting grandma.

Which brings me to the weight. This setup weighs in at barely over 30lbs. If you are coming from a hardtail, this thing will feel like an 80lb bike... if you are coming from another squishy rig, you'll notice that it climbs more easily than you'd expect, but the weight is still present. I think at 30lbs, you have a pretty climbable bike. But my personal threshold for being able to climb fast on a bike is just about that. Any heavier, and I sit and spin in the granny gear all day. And take forever to climb. So I'm pretty happy with this weight. Some better parts will help the reduce it a little, but it is reasonable as is.

The Ride – Descending:
This bike is devilishly confident at high speeds. The slack angles and balance of the bike just lure you into going faster and faster. Tight trails are not what this bike is about. You’ll get through, but the slack ht just begs for a little more daylight and higher speeds. The low BB really lets you get down and dirty through high-speed corners and feels well planted when pumping it through corners and down the trail.

The fork is so stiff you’ll think it popped some little blue pills and pulled you through that rock-garden with one-hand. Very impressed by the fork and its feel. I thought it would feel like air-forks of old, but it already feels great. Supple (very supple for an air fork), very adjustable, and stuff… good combo. Plus it is relatively lightweight. Stoked! I really thought this might be the weak point… It isn’t a butter-smooth coil fork, but it is damn good and a real surprise to me.

HOWEVER. I really am disappointed in the rear shock. It feels very dead to me, even when descending, and I can’t seem to tune any improvement into it by setting it up differently. I’m almost to the point where I want to find a better rear shock… but I’m going to properly break it in and give it a chance. It does climb well… and the adjustability of the propedal (or whatever spesh calls it) is nice. I just tend to like wide-open shocks and well-designed suspension linkages better. We’ll see how it goes. A positive note about the rear-end: the linkage back there provides a lot of rigidity in the rear-end, which is really nice. Although the rear wheel is crap and flexes a bit… but that can be replaced.

Overall descending. Despite my lack of enthusiasm for the shock, the bike gets me down the trail fast. Very fast actually. Aside from it sounding like a rattle-trap with the Rear Der. Slapping around a lot (fully cross-chained I can’t get enough tension in the system to keep the rear der from making a racket – need to check chain length and see if I’ll get some better results by shortening it), the bike does rip. I can’t help but think a putting a better shock on there will help things… but I’ll give this a chance. One issue I have with the frame is the seat-height when descending. <rant>I ALWAYS drop my seat when descending… well, except for when I raced XC… but that is it. I ride XC with a bunch of folks who think it is a crutch and that you should learn to rip descents with the seat high… I never see them while descending. Ever. You are sooo much faster with a low seat. Do it. That’s all about that.</rant> I can’t get the seat as low as I’d like on this bike. A low-profile seat, careful seatpost measurement and cutting, an adjustable seatpost all help this. I’m close now, but still a little higher than I’d like.

This bike eats up rough descents just as you’d expect from a 6” bike. Even better than expected maybe. Very smooth (if a little dead/hollow in the rear from the shock) and fast. Throw it into a good corner, counterweight, and it’ll rip right through. The front end is way stiff and it holds its line soo well in the chunder.

Another couple of quick notes about the fork: Specialized put some thought into the through-axle. You use a 6mm allen (I think it is 6 anyway) for the pinch bolts and the axle itself so you don't need more than one key like say, a Boxxer. I find this very convenient. Adjustments on the fork for compression/climbing height/rebound are very easy to make and have positive clicks and a limited number of turns for adjustment. They designed this fork for quick adjustment and real-world trail use. Good work on these features Specialized.

Continued...

[brettf]

Setting up:
Setup is interesting with this bike. There’s a little sag-o-meter thing that comes with the bike that allows you to measure shock sag on the rear. It is a good starting point, but like I said, I haven’t been really happy with the shock anyway… so whatever, I’m still tweaking it.

Setting up the fork is super-easy. Put some air in there around whatever is recommended and then play with it. Add/remove from there and find your sweet spot. I had to play with the crown and the fork legs to find a front-end height I was happy with. Dual crown forks have this adjustability and this fork is no exception. There are some marks on the legs that help you find where your happy place is. I started with the front end pretty low and worked my way up pretty high…

For those of you interested, here are my reviews of the components:

Components:
Brakes - Avid Juicy Fives: I hate Juicy 5s. Actually, I hate the Juicy 7s too. I've owned and ridden at least a few pairs of Avids and have sold them all except for one pair sitting in a box as a backup. Don't get me wrong, they'll stop you... I just can't stand the way they feel. I'm extremely picky with my brakes, and the Juicy 5s on this bike don't cut it. Too squishy, bite too hard unexpectedly, and generally have a crappy feel. Bottom line, they get the job done, but they aren't the hot sh!t. I also don’t think an 8” rotor is needed on this bike. I’ll be putting a 7” on it when I get new brakes. 6” rear as well. Don’t let marketing hype fool you on big rear rotors. I would run a 6” on my Demo if I didn’t have an 8” on there when I bought it used. (rear! I'll take a huge rotor up front on my DH bike thankyouverymuch).

Drivetrain - Truvativ Stylo, SRAM x7 shifters, x7 FD, X9 RD:
I'm very happy with SRAM shifting, as I've always thought I'd be... but always had hookups on Shimano parts so I've been using those. The SRAM parts have simple, quick shifting that hasn't let me down yet. I think (correct me if I'm wrong) that the 2007 X7 shifters are the same as 2006 X9 shifters... so they are a good weight, and seem to perform well. The cranks are fine. A little heavy and maybe not as strong as I'd like (maybe they are?)... I really don't know anything about them except they do well. Time will tell.

Wheels - Spesh 'STOUT' front hub with 25mm through-axle. Don't remember which rims, crappy rear hub:
If I keep this bike, I'll get a Hadley rear hub and relace the front and rear with nice, strong, light rims that I can run tubeless. The stock rear wheel is a POS. It almost negates the stiffness of the rear end of the frame because it is so flexy. I hate it. The front seems fine. Decent hub, the rims are okay... but that rear. Ugh.

Bottom Line:
This is a good bike. It climbs okay, descends well, and has a good balance and feel to it. They built this bike with descending in mind and it shows. There are a couple of gripes I have that may, however, result in me selling it and trying something else. I don’t like the seat-height. I’d like to be able to get it lower. I’m a fan of uninterrupted seat-tubes and wish the Specialized had one. I don’t like the rear shock but don’t know that I want to throw another shock at it. It doesn’t climb as well as I’d like. It is okay, but unlike certain designs, it catches on rough stuff instead of blowing through or even building momentum while climbing rough trail. The bike does descend, well, however, and that may just keep me hooked.

I need more time on the bike. I’m a firm believer that it takes 100 hours or so to really get a feel for a bike and to be able to control it with your mind bullets. I have mixed feelings about it now, but wouldn’t be surprised if I like it more as I get more time on it… just like every other full suspension bike I’ve owned...

Anyway, hopefully you made it through this novel. Go ride!

[uncle crud]

Brett, that's one seriously knowledgeable review. SUPER valuable. Thanks.

(PS: Your review sounds like how I describe my 2005 Turner 6-Pack, minus the numb platform feel -- my DHX Coil has been tuned by PUSH to soften the ProPedal platform and give more activity -- and my 6-Pack climbs very well but probably feels a bit different than the Enduro SL on the descent)

[Rontele]

Nice review, but you should have gotten a 6.6

[LeeLau]

That is one thorough review; any feelings on the proprietary nature of the front hub? Would tightening up spokes on the rear make things better?

[Sutter]

Wow, awesome brett, thanks for putting that together for everyone. You have me seriously thinking hard about riding a bike I've never considered before.

[brettf]

That is one thorough review; any feelings on the proprietary nature of the front hub? Would tightening up spokes on the rear make things better?

I haven't put much thought into the front hub. It's pretty... and looks burly. I'm amazed at how the front wheel seems stiffer than the rear. Even with properly tensioned spokes... (one of the first things I did as I think this bike just sat on the sales floor for sometime and only got ridden around a couple of times... no real good tensioning/trueing of wheels until I got my hands on it - it was way out of whack, interestingly). It is really hard to exert enough pressure on a wheel off a bike to flex it, but abusing the wheels off the bike can be fun...

Back to the front hub though. I haul the bike on a tray on a hitch platform or in the back of my truck, so taking the wheel off isn't an issue for transport for me - I don't think anyone makes a fork-up type mount of any sort for that 25mm through-axle yet, so that could be an issue for some.

I do really like the through-axle though and how it threads in on one side (I think this action is identical to the Fox forks?). You use a 6mm key to turn the entire axle in and out of the threads on the opposite fork leg... (hard to explain, but if you've seen it, you know what I'm talking about).

So... as far as it being proprietary, I dunno - I'm a little indifferent I guess. We'll see if 25mm becomes a standard size at all in the future. Hard to know. I thought 24mm would be after Maverick started using it, but it didn't seem to catch like wildfire exactly... The 20mm on the Boxxers that I've had is nice for consistency's sake, but I hardly ever need to remove those wheels... and it was nice to be able to throw a wheel from a QR20 fork on a Boxxer when I needed to... Can't do that with this bike, unfortunatly, I'm stuck with the size... we'll see how it works out.

But like I said, I really like that the pinch bolts on the lowers and the through-axle use the same size hex, not that I really answered your question at all

[kidwoo]

So I have a much more XC oriented background than someone like kidwoo

Wanna bet?



Nice review man. Quite complete.


If that rear wheel bugs you, just rebuild it with better spokes. I've never kept a specialized built wheel with any of their bikes I've owned. They're shite. I actually reused the stock rim and re-built the rear with dt swiss 2.0/1.8s and I'm content.

[brettf]

Wanna bet?

True. Assumption.... Perceived based on the radness in your posted videos

[brettf]

If that rear wheel bugs you, just rebuild it with better spokes. I've never kept a specialized built wheel with any of their bikes I've owned. They're shite. I actually reused the stock rim and re-built the rear with dt swiss 2.0/1.8s and I'm content.

I'll likely go with a slightly wider rim as these are just a tad narrow for my taste... but that's just the picky rider in me. I'll ride this for a while until I decide that I really do like the bike a lot... or not. And until I can afford a Hadley/good rim combo...

[kidwoo]

I'll likely go with a slightly wider rim as these are just a tad narrow for my taste... but that's just the picky rider in me. I'll ride this for a while until I decide that I really do like the bike a lot... or not. And until I can afford a Hadley/good rim combo...

Sounds like a plan.


I call dibs if you decide to sell it. I've got a friend in need.

Plus I want to set the record for the most outlandish dibs ever called.


edit: where did you end up leaving your fork crowns? I've got mine at exactly 151mm above the seal

[Rontele]

edit: where did you end up leaving your fork crowns? I've got mine at exactly 151mm above the seal

This thread is about to turn into a techy Enduro SL circle jerk

[Tap]

This thread is about to turn into a techy Enduro SL circle jerk

aren't you due to buy a new bike or something in the next 5 minutes?

[Rontele]

aren't you due to buy a new bike or something in the next 5 minutes?

I take the Fifth Amendment.

[brettf]

Sounds like a plan.


I call dibs if you decide to sell it. I've got a friend in need.

Plus I want to set the record for the most outlandish dibs ever called.


edit: where did you end up leaving your fork crowns? I've got mine at exactly 151mm above the seal

I'll measure later. I think it's a bit higher than that probably based on... well, nothing really. I suck at eyeballing measurements like that. I'll get back to you...

[Son1cdeth]

Nice review Brett.

Looking at getting a 6+ inch bike next year. Looks like I'll have to demo an Enduro.

[TRON]

Nice review. I couldn't agree more in regards to the rear end, laterally plenty stiff but it rides like a pair of salomons w/ more than 60 days on them...dead! I'm looking around for a new rear boinger but nothing has jumped out at me yet and im a bit leary of the dhx air. Im glad you like the fork, sounds like you got one of the good ones, I did not. I put a lyric 2 step on and am loving it! Great fork on that bike.

[dfinn]

Nice review. I couldn't agree more in regards to the rear end, laterally plenty stiff but it rides like a pair of salomons w/ more than 60 days on them...dead! I'm looking around for a new rear boinger but nothing has jumped out at me yet and im a bit leary of the dhx air. Im glad you like the fork, sounds like you got one of the good ones, I did not. I put a lyric 2 step on and am loving it! Great fork on that bike.

any chance you got a before and after weight with that fork?

Kidwoo and a couple other people have said good things about the RP23 on SLs. I'm keeping my eye out for one of those and then I'll have the AFR as a backup.

[TRON]

Im pretty sure the lyrik is listed as about a quarter lb. heavier. RP3, interesting, a far better pricepoint too...

[kidwoo]

I can highly suggest the RP3 (RP23 if buy a new one now).


All the 'dead, platform etc' complaints people seem to have about the AFR sound like another language to me.

A buddy of mine with another enduro hopped on my bike and the first thing he said was 'wow.......this shock feels so normal'. So........I'm sure my bike feels different than stock.

[Rontele]

brett,

i have a RP23 laying around I am happy to give to you if the shock sizes are the same (7.875 x 2.25)

[dfinn]

brett,

i have a RP23 laying around I am happy to give to you if the shock sizes are the same (7.875 x 2.25)

dude, dibs if for some crazy reason he doesn't want that. that is the same size as the enduro by the way. Hell, I'd even pay for it if you wanted to sell it.

[TRON]

woo, What hardware (if any) did you need to installthe rp3. I guess where im going w/ this is, is the stuff on it gonna work or do I need more(bushings etc.)

[kidwoo]

woo, What hardware (if any) did you need to installthe rp3. I guess where im going w/ this is, is the stuff on it gonna work or do I need more(bushings etc.)

You will need new bushings.


I would have bet one of my arms that the spec shock used standard sized fox eyelets.........it doesn't. It's a bigger diameter DU bushing (manitou maybe?)

If you want I can measure them. My shop has a big box of fox reducer bushings so I found the ones that work pretty easily. If you don't have access to a bunch of that stuff, it might create a headache.

But I'd definitely get that shock.

[Rontele]

dude, dibs if for some crazy reason he doesn't want that. that is the same size as the enduro by the way. Hell, I'd even pay for it if you wanted to sell it.

I will let you know. He won't be getting it for scott-free