What did I do wrong on a pow day?

[ALFONSO618]

I recognize that I may be opening myself up to all kinds of criticism, which is fine, but I feel I need some answers to my recent experience.

Personal Specs:
6’3 and 185lbs

I own a couple skis: 188 Praxis MVP, FRS and recently scooped up a 2018 BC 120 in the 192 length with some STH2s.

They are mounted -2cm from rec and even there I was surprised at how centered they felt.

I skied them in 3” dust on crust with my kids and had a blast but the dilemma came when the storm hit a couple days later…

It snowed a glorious 14” overnight at Grand Targhee and because of the fun I had with my kids and the extra length of the BC they seemed like the natural choice for a blower pow day…

We got up and hit Dream Catcher before it was tracked but the entire time I felt like I was skiing too backseat because my tips were constantly under the snow and my legs were gassed from fighting the poor stance. I never felt like I could get forward and press into the boot. I felt like a total noob who had never skied pow before!

Was this a result of a center mounted-ish ski? Incredibly fluffy snow? Bad skiing?

I have skied lots of pow skis from Protests, JJs, hellbents, magic js, kartels 116 and I never felt tip dive or any issues staying afloat. Then again, I have never skiied 14” of fluff, but these Bent Chet’s had me fearing for my life on going over the handle bars!

Am I simply more of a traditional stance skier who got into a switch based ski and I would have been better off skiing my FRS instead? Protest?

Sorry for the book but I’m hoping someone can give me some advice.

Thanks for the help


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Shorty_J]

Light dry snow is the likely culprit.

That kind of blower pow is great for photo ops but I prefer powder with a little more density because you float more and can actually get some g forces going on the turns.

Sent from my SM-A536W using Tapatalk

[2FUNKY]

Blower pow? Press the tips and giv’er. Who cares if they’re under the snow. As long as they get some resistance on them so you don’t go over the bars. Also Protesteses!
I as Shorty j said, like my snow with some body.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[El Chupacabra]

Don't look down at your ski tips while skiing. It doesn't matter if the tips are under the snow if it's blower fluff - if it doesn't feel like the skis are getting pulled by the tips deeper into the snow, then they aren't, so just keep going.

[ALFONSO618]

Haha I figured I might be told not to look down and I was trying pretty hard but every once and a while I felt like I was gonna catch and go over… usually 120mm planes up well and then ya charge it or whatever. Would my experience have been better/easier on 192 Protests? DPS 138 Spoons? Donner Party?


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[toast2266]

Just to clarify, by BC 120, you mean the Bent Chetler 120? (because BC stands for all sorts of things in the ski world).

But yeah, the Bent Chetlers have a super progressive mount point, a decent amount of tip taper, and a relatively wide tail, all of which are going to assist with tip dive. Even at -2, you're still forward of most other pow skis (with exception of the "very jibby" category).

[ALFONSO618]

Just to clarify, by BC 120, you mean the Bent Chetler 120? (because BC stands for all sorts of things in the ski world).

But yeah, the Bent Chetlers have a super progressive mount point, a decent amount of tip taper, and a relatively wide tail, all of which are going to assist with tip dive. Even at -2, you're still forward of most other pow skis (with exception of the "very jibby" category).

Yes, that was what I meant. They’re the 2018 edition before they super lightened them up


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[bfree]

It may just take some time to get used to them. Learn where their limits are. Pressure the tips until you do go over the bars (okay preferably just before that) to learn where the limit is.

Sometimes that's the trouble of having a big quiver. I find I do better with just two skis in the (downhill) quiver. You need to put many days on the skis to learn how they handle. Now I know my 98mm cambered skis so well that I can ski all kinds of pow and snow with them.

Maybe they're not your style, but I don't think I'd give up on them or change anything based on one day in conditions you're not used to.

[XXX-er]

I tried sinking the tips on my Lotus 120's by just leaning forward all the way in pow , there did not seem to be a limit cuz they never sunk, I figured it had something to do with the 600mm of early rise

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

As others have pointed out: When it's truly blower...like 4-5%...it doesn't really matter what skis you are on, you are skiing the pre-storm layer anyway. Just think, "I'm skiing IN this snow, not ON the snow".

BUT I think it's just being on new weird skis and not your technique really.

[EWG]

Just to clarify, by BC 120, you mean the Bent Chetler 120? (because BC stands for all sorts of things in the ski world).

But yeah, the Bent Chetlers have a super progressive mount point, a decent amount of tip taper, and a relatively wide tail, all of which are going to assist with tip dive. Even at -2, you're still forward of most other pow skis (with exception of the "very jibby" category).

I'll double down on this. I have a pair of Line Mordecai's that when I got them were mounted near dead center. I loved them, but damn the balance point was small. Easy to pitch forward. I later moved them 4cm back and now feel great on them. Still a very progressive mount point and still a symmetrical ski, so really easy to get the "over the bars" feeling, but much more stable.

On the Bents that you have, though I have not skied them, I believe they are a quite progressive ski - not just a progressive mount point. They want to be skied in a centered, balanced stance. On hard snow they sort've make you self correct if you are too far forward or back, cause you can feel the ski flex, but in 3D snow it'll test your fore-aft balance point. That's because the soft snow can let them pitch forward and back.

Next time to take them out in powder, concentrate on finding the balance point where your weight is centered between the heel and ball of your foot. See if that helps. You will be trying to let them surf. Good luck.

[toast2266]

Next time to take them out in powder, concentrate on finding the balance point where your weight is centered between the heel and ball or your foot. See if that helps. You will be trying to let them surf.

Just to add to that, if you're trying to ski a more progressive ski with a more traditional boot that has a fair amount of forward lean, you'll have a really hard time doing this. Racier boots with more forward lean just don't make it very easy to ski with that kind of centered stance, and you'll torch your quads trying.

[ALFONSO618]

Just to add to that, if you're trying to ski a more progressive ski with a more traditional boot that has a fair amount of forward lean, you'll have a really hard time doing this. Racier boots with more forward lean just don't make it very easy to ski with that kind of centered stance, and you'll torch your quads trying.

Never really thought about that… my boots are atomic Hawx xtd ultras with the wtr sole.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[ALFONSO618]

As others have pointed out: When it's truly blower...like 4-5%...it doesn't really matter what skis you are on, you are skiing the pre-storm layer anyway. Just think, "I'm skiing IN this snow, not ON the snow".

BUT I think it's just being on new weird skis and not your technique really.

Yah I think I was having a hard time processing what was happening cause under the 14” was what felt like an ice rink and the speed was ridiculous. I should have just trusted the skis to do their job and not freak out about the snow on top


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Bandit Man]

Progressive mount skis suck in deep snow, even at -2-cm. What is the recommended on a BC120? -3-cm? So you were at -5-cm? Yeah…that’s a problem.

[2FUNKY]

I’m still over here trying to figure out what made him grab those and not the Protest. Makes nonsense.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Bushwacka]

DO you have video?

Ramp angle/forward lean being wrong can cause this.....

So can being to progressive.

[Bandit Man]

I’m still over here trying to figure out what made him grab those and not the Protest. Makes nonsense.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

100% this!!

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Ski moar


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[margotron]

Another vote for skiing style. My bents love light powder. But they want balance. Just stand on them. You’re surfing, not leaning into the front of your boots

[skialpy]

DO you have video?

Ramp angle/forward lean being wrong can cause this.....

So can being to progressive.

I had a set of dukes with zero ramp angle and they kept me in the back seat feeling like a gaper. I added a shim under the heel and they skied great. Use some calipers to measure the toe vs heel height compared to your other skis. If the bindings are mounted forward of the recommended line that could also be the culprit.

[ALFONSO618]

I’m still over here trying to figure out what made him grab those and not the Protest. Makes nonsense.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

I sold my protests like a fool


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[ALFONSO618]

I had a set of dukes with zero ramp angle and they kept me in the back seat feeling like a gaper. I added a shim under the heel and they skied great. Use some calipers to measure the toe vs heel height compared to your other skis. If the bindings are mounted forward of the recommended line that could also be the culprit.

I’m -2cm from rec line


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Djongo Unchained]

Ski moar


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

This...
OP, if this is the first time you've skied 14" of light powder ever, your problem is that you need waaaay more mileage in the pow.
Targhee is a good place for that.

yer gonna get a huge variety of pow densities, and a centered stance ski is asking for hurdles.
Skis that submarine constantly are a non starter in powder.

I ski on the other side of the range and have skied powder a few times.

[EWG]

This...
OP, if this is the first time you've skied 14" of light powder ever, your problem is that you need waaaay more mileage in the pow.
Targhee is a good place for that.

yer gonna get a huge variety of pow densities, and a centered stance ski is asking for hurdles.
Skis that submarine constantly are a non starter in powder.

I ski on the other side of the range and have skied powder a few times.

Pretty sure you’ve logged more hours in powder than you’ve logged in your car.