Pyramid style shelters

[fleaches]

So I'm looking into getting a pyramid style tent, mostly for snow camping. There's a lot out there, from ~$250 offerings from MSR to $1k DCF tents from HMG. I'm thinking I want something roomy (4P) and las light as possible, but is DCF worth the money? Anyone have any experience or advice here? Do mids actually suck for some reason? Not in a super big hurry to buy one but some of the labor day sales have me thinking...

Thanks all!

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[zion zig zag]

Andrew Skurka posted a video recently of DCF shelters failing in a hailstorm where silnylon shelters held up ok. Apparently DCF isn’t very puncture resistant? I only scanned the conclusions but you may want to dig into that.


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[zion zig zag]

Also, check out Seek Outside tents, they seem to be pretty popular.


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[Rob Stokes]

I've got a sil nylon Oware that has been great for a bunch of years and use. Would recommend putting them on your list.

They come in a bunch of sizes (8x8, 9x9, 10x10 etc) and my 9x9 fits 4 nicely.

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[Blaster]

I like mids and these are the considerations I weigh when deciding what tent to bring.

How much of an issue will condensation and bugs be? I’m mostly in the drier Sierra Nevada and almost always use a mid but try to bring a double walled tent if I’m going on a longer trip elsewhere where things are really wet. You can certainly manage the condensation but it takes more work. Condensation plus bad bugs is a big pain because you’ll want to pitch the tent higher to allow air flow and will want to sleep in a headnet.

The shape of mids is great for volume per weight but you do loose more space than you might think near the inside edges due to the angle of the walls, this is a bigger issue when you are fighting condensation.

DCF is a bit less packable than silnylon. I tested out both the hyper light and black diamond 4 person mids in the yard. while the hyper light was a larger tent, the pack size per square foot of material was a little more than the BD.

While mids to take a bit more skill to pitch then a regular tent, the bigger pain is their larger footprint compared to other dome tents. It’s certainly workable but more of a pain in places where you need a good setup due to managing condensation or bugs.

I am a big fan of the bd beta light. The mosquito net skirt works well and the living space space feels a lot more like the 4 person mega mid than an actual 2 person tent. IMO The two pole design of the beta light keeps the favorable weight of the one pole mids but gives you steeper walls and more tent volume higher up while sitting. The new polyester material for the light blue bd tents largely prevents the sagging issues the older sil nylon had which was kind of sucky.

[fleaches]

Good info so far, thanks!

I have a bunch of other tent styles (free standing, trekking pole, hammock, tarp) and am a big believer in bringing the right tool for that particular trip. The trips I have in mind for a mid are mostly like march-may in the Sierra, maybe cascades or sawtooths. So probably not too many bugs, and potential for some heavy wet storms.

I did see that BD is making their mids with sil poly now, that always seemed like good compromise to me but I don't personally have much experience with it.

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[skis_the_trees]

I’ve got an original Chouinard Megamid and a copy from a now defunct Canadian brand. They are awesome shelters for winter/snow use. Would def recommend a mid for the trips you reference above.


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[kootenayskier]

I’ve used my original Chouinard Mid a couple of times a year for however long that’s been. Works great for lightweight ski traverses (fits 3 people) and whenever you have the time and energy to dig out a proper base setup. Also works well as a cook tent for base camp trips. I’m probably going to replace it with a fancy (half the weight of the BD version) HMG ultra-mid 4, only because I’m cashed up and am losing confidence that the fabric is storm-worthy after so many years. I’m sure any of the cheaper alternatives are fine, as it’d be pretty difficult to fuck up a mid.

[uglymoney]

Andrew Skurka posted a video recently of DCF shelters failing in a hailstorm where silnylon shelters held up ok. Apparently DCF isn’t very puncture resistant? I only scanned the conclusions but you may want to dig into that.


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Link?


https://www.instagram.com/p/ChSsxZqo...d=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

Was it .75 DCF?

We bought a DCF MLD tarp this year. I was impressed with how well it sheds rain...as in you can press up against it for hours and stay dry.

Looking at the video that does not look like our .75 fabric. Looks like lighter and thinner. MLD is closing out .55 because the material is 'too fragile to be sustainable or something along those lines'...

https://m.facebook.com/groups/Mounta...9925229132726/

I can't find the actual posts where Ron Bell have told us the reason for discontinuing the .55 edit..."DCF SHELTER DESIGN NOTES

We specialize in All Season Shelters and no longer offer DCF shelters in the ever so slightly lighter and much more fragile .5 or .67 versions. Compared to .5 and .67 DCF, the .8 DCF is 2X stronger and offers a 3X longer service life.

We feel that now is the time in lightweight shelter evolution to shift emphasis away from the only (very) slightly lighter DCF versions to the longer service life and more Ecologically Sustainable .8 All Season DCF. "

I wish Andrew had said thickness in IG post. Comment suggests .51

Thanks for heads up. I'd have been a little more worried about our new tarp if I hadn't watched the video to see how thin that one was.

[BFD]

Mids are ok for cooking and hanging out. they do not cut it in a snowstorm. If you are in the sierra with good weather will work fine. Wet heavy snowfall and you will be evacuating.

[davjr96]

I have an MSR Front Range Mid + bug net and really like it. Mid only for winter but will occasionally use the bug net in summer, especially when car camping in a front country site (I don't have a dedicated tent for that). I recently camped in Mammoth lakes in a 30ish hour rain storm, really hard at times, using both pieces and was bone dry inside the whole time. That was the storm that flooded death valley and caused a bunch of road washouts.

I am very happy with it for the price.

[fleaches]

I have an MSR Front Range Mid + bug net and really like it. Mid only for winter but will occasionally use the bug net in summer, especially when car camping in a front country site (I don't have a dedicated tent for that). I recently camped in Mammoth lakes in a 30ish hour rain storm, really hard at times, using both pieces and was bone dry inside the whole time. That was the storm that flooded death valley and caused a bunch of road washouts.

I am very happy with it for the price.

How's the sag on that one when wet? I can't tell what material it is made of primarily, it lists sil poly and sil nylon both.

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[kootenayskier]

Mids are ok for cooking and hanging out. they do not cut it in a snowstorm. If you are in the sierra with good weather will work fine. Wet heavy snowfall and you will be evacuating.

Perhaps Sierra snot storms are different beast, but my Mid has handled numerous significant dumps of the BC variety.

[davjr96]

How's the sag on that one when wet? I can't tell what material it is made of primarily, it lists sil poly and sil nylon both.

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There is definite sag but it was not enough to touch the inner bug net or cause issues. When the bug net is installed 4 people seems like a stretch though. They have to really like each other... For 2 it is a palace ad or 3 it would work. Does not apply without the bug net, 4 goes fine.

Here's a pic from the end of that rain. Some of the sag is due to the stakes I was using not holding well in the sandy ground.

[riff]

I’m using an HMG mid with bug netting around the base for everything these days, and love it despite some tradeoffs, mostly already mentioned. But, here’s my list:
Pros-
Light
Waterproof for real
Lots of room, especially 4p
Dcf doesn’t sag when wet
Frost shakes off easy
Open the doors on nice nights, lovely spacious area for cooking. Ventilation adequate for cooking with the door shut

Cons-
Bulkier when packed than silnylon. Condensation when truly damp.
Gotta protect sleeping pad
$$$$$
Be sure the corners are anchored really well in storms


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[BFD]

Perhaps Sierra snot storms are different beast, but my Mid has handled numerous significant dumps of the BC variety.

I do not own one. Have been on trips where they have been used. Saw one collapse in a storm when in our VE 25 we just knocked the snow off from the inside and let it build up on the sides. Steeper side walls on the dome allow it to handle snow better than the pyramid angle. Another trip we used one as a kitchen but collapsed it during the storm when not being used. I appreciate that they are light and definitely have a place but have personally witnessed failure when a dome tent had no issues.

[rod9301]

I used to have a bd light mid.

Sold it because it took a lot of time to dig z proper platform, and set it up.

I calculated the energy expended to set it up and compared it with carrying ab extra 1.5 lbs and the heavier tent won. ( Tarptent 2 person tunnel style).

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