Water.....

[fastfred]

so outside of buena vista colroado is a well and a pump
all day long trucks line up and fill with water they drive the water two hours down to denver
nestle packages the water in plastic bottles and sells it as mountain spring water under one of there many labels
the bottles are put on trucks delivered and sold in stores all over the country
once used most of the bottles become trash some are recycled

this is the world we live in and we all allow it to happen
global warming is a lie the shortage of colorado river water is a lie
it's a lie because no one is doing anything about it and we are not concerned as a country or a the human race
we buy electric cars put in solar panels buy wind credits and bring our own bags to the grocery store we talk about how we care about the environment so that makes everything ok

well it doesn't it's bullshit
consumption is what is killing the environment and using up water
if you actually give a shit about the enviorment and care
we will ban all forms of private vehical use electric don't get a pass
everyone will be forced to only have 250 sq ft or less of in door living space
air conditioning will be banned
in door heat can be set at no more than 55 degrees
any outdoor water will be banned
cows will be banned

the states invovled in the colorado river basin were suppose to have a new agreement and water cutting measures completed a week ago
but since powel and mead are not really at all time lows these states have refused to provide any use cutting ideas

if anyone has ever ridden a bike around metro phoenix you should there are canals and canals of water all over that city flowing with massive amounts of water
other than the dried up salt river there is no reason why that much water should be flowing in a city at the bottom of a bowl in the middle of the desert

[Core Shot]

Fred. You’re drinking a lot of WEF koolaid there.

Can’t blame you. Too many people here.
And yet, at the same time they say conserve and have 1.2 children. They also say come on in migrants and have five plus kids.
Cognitive dissonance is the way.

[Foggy_Goggles]

If there is one thing I've learned from this thread, it's that we can all do better. I mean, in order to make it all about us, fine tune our finger pointing and totally mask our hypocrisies we are gonna have to sharpen our pencils.

OK, first is understanding the difference between ranchin', cowboyin' and rodeoin'. Seconding is to figure out water water rights your water comes from and what's its augmentation plan, if any is. Third, and for sure most important, is too make sure the footwear matches both the pants and the political ideology. Nobody like a fake. Bolo ties are for seasoned professionals, second generation only.

Sometimes you even need to keep a wardrobe change in the car, get tips from your local County Commissioner. If order to be pro-environment masked as an anti-development flyfisherman or vis versa you are gonna have but on the Wranglers and Wellingtons and fight with the ranching community to keep the water instream for their hay meadow so you can poke trout it the face. But then, after lunch, you'll need to put on you Mountain Hardware adventure pant and Altras for the PZ commission meeting. Why you ask, please the rancher wants to sell is water rights do a developer, possible even for "affordable housing". But even though the water taps are owned by the district and are available for sale you need to oppose this.

Its hard. Ask me how I know.

[muted reborn]

There's mention of secondary water up there ^^, what's the deal with that, is there a second water pipe running to SLC homes? Is that a common thing if so? Never heard of that.

It’s a separate water pipe that is unmetered and untreated for irrigation. Typically gets turned on in April and off in October. Before the last two years no one really made a mention of how much you used, total free for all. In the last two years they have started it later and turned it off earlier and added limits to how much you can water (currently at two days a week, and 20 to 40 minutes per zone depending on sprinkler head type). Although It seems to be totally unenforced as my neighbor waters everyday.

It’s very common here although most of the water companies (typically the secondary water is not municipal, but owned privately or through a co-op) are getting grants to add meters to each house. New homes that get added will have meters from the start.

mostly canals up north ogden way and south/jordan draper way but most of its pipes now
we have water rights from lcc creek and white pine res
dating from 1909 thru
https://www.southdespainditchcompany.org/
most is thru similiar "ditch/canal" companies
https://www.waterrights.utah.gov/can...nal_owners.asp

So if you have rights to pump from a canal in Utah, this is considered secondary water here? And some (or a lot?) houses have pipes from these canals that their irrigation is tied to? Sorry for you guys having to talk slow to me. We don't have any secondary pipes at my house in Millcreek from 1948, is that rare?

There's canals here though, my place use to be a big orchard so they are probably left over from that. One canal runs 5 feet parallel to my backyard property line, and why we have a rat infestation when it starts running in May. Another canal is drained above ground across the street in the front - very very often it runs strongly as a small creek for blocks before it goes in a drain. I have to leap across it to go to my neighbors house, and I have long legs. It's completely ruined peoples sidewalks. Maybe this is very common here for all canals but it's usually buried so we don't see the waste? I guess it's filling the salt lake as Dan said, so I shouldn't care.

[Dantheman]

maybe you missed the post where I said I use about 35000 gallons in the summer months for irrigation? And before you pitchfork me, yes I am cutting back on watering, ripping out grass, creating shade, and installing rain water storage.

edit - also the more I poop the better the lake will be in the coming years

https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-...reat-salt-lake

No pitchforks planned, sorry for the implication


Saw this today, I didn't realize things were this bad in the NE: https://www.msn.com/en-us/weather/to...ht/ar-AA10Jd0U

[Ted Striker]

Sidetrack, but it is actually pronounce poe-table water, not pot-able water. The later is becoming more common because people think that it means the water is safe to put in a pot for cooking, etc.

I think Alex Trebek is the only person I've ever heard pronounce it correctly.

[Danno]

I'm no wordmaster, but saying it's pronounced "poe-table" isn't right either, because that indicates that syllables 2/3 are pronounced "table", i.e. "tay-bull", when it is actually pronounced "POE-tuh-bull". Unless I'm wrong. In which case someone is likely to point that out with a profanity-laced angry invective.

[oldnew_guy]

If you plug it into Google it will pronounce it for you….

[riser4]

It's all about the EMfassis on the correct syllables.

[east or bust]

Has desalination for the west coast been proposed yet? Is there a legit reason not to do it or just NIMBYism?

Large scale desal uses a shit ton of electricity. That’s the largest hindrance currently.

In the next 20 years with the expected progression of nuclear SMRs I’d think it will become a much more viable option.

I’m sure there are other downsides, but right now it’s the power input needed.

[PB]

Which is easier/cheaper - desal or reclaimed sewage/waste water? (Neither of which, it would seem, are up to the task of supplying ag water)

[Danno]

If you plug it into Google it will pronounce it for you….

except google spells it out this way "pow·tuh·bl". And everyone here knows that "pow" is not pronounced "poe". So can google be trusted?

[skaredshtles]

I'm no wordmaster, but saying it's pronounced "poe-table" isn't right either, because that indicates that syllables 2/3 are pronounced "table", i.e. "tay-bull", when it is actually pronounced "POE-tuh-bull". Unless I'm wrong. In which case someone is likely to point that out with a profanity-laced angry invective.

You're not wrong.

[Danno]

Which is easier/cheaper - desal or reclaimed sewage/waste water? (Neither of which, it would seem, are up to the task of supplying ag water)

Uh, we already reclaim waste water pretty much EVERYWHERE. Unless you live in the first stop of the water from from the mountains, you're very likely drinking reclaimed waste water. So I'm gonna go with that being the easier/cheaper one.

[Woodsy]

I prefer Quaffable.

About the CO River, etc.

Humans, especially politicians don't change shit till they have to.

This check has been in the mail for decades, nobody cared

[oldnew_guy]

So can google be trusted?

Ok, my search gives me the Merriam-Webster version.

There is a little button you can click and it will play a recorded pronunciation.

Clearly google can’t be trusted with anything.

[GiBo]

Uh, we already reclaim waste water pretty much EVERYWHERE. Unless you live in the first stop of the water from from the mountains, you're very likely drinking reclaimed waste water. So I'm gonna go with that being the easier/cheaper one.

Yup. The utility I work for discharges an average of 33 MGD of treated wastewater into the San Joaquin river. Then we take 30 MGD out downstream at our intake pump station and treat it at our water treatment plant for drinking water.

[old goat]

Interesting project that is moving forward for funding

https://www.fema.gov/case-study/kern-county-california

In order to store more water don't you have to have more water to store? There are something like 18 dams in Kern County. I'm pretty sure none of them are filled to the brim. If we do get a wet year those reservoirs will get filled and then, if there's any excess water it can be pumped into the aquifer, which is unlikely to happen more than once in a blue moon, if ever. Making more storage doesn't make more water.

How is it that killing cows and bulls and eating them uses more water than keeping them alive and cycling water through them to drink milk? It would seem to me that the milk industry uses a lot of water too, if not more than the beef industry..

Beef uses 4 times the water per gram of protein and 5 times per calorie, compared to milk. You could have looked that up easily. https://waterfootprint.org/en/water-...imal-products/

so outside of buena vista colroado is a well and a pump
all day long trucks line up and fill with water they drive the water two hours down to denver
nestle packages the water in plastic bottles and sells it as mountain spring water under one of there many labels
the bottles are put on trucks delivered and sold in stores all over the country
once used most of the bottles become trash some are recycled

this is the world we live in and we all allow it to happen
global warming is a lie the shortage of colorado river water is a lie
it's a lie because no one is doing anything about it and we are not concerned as a country or a the human race
we buy electric cars put in solar panels buy wind credits and bring our own bags to the grocery store we talk about how we care about the environment so that makes everything ok

well it doesn't it's bullshit
consumption is what is killing the environment and using up water
if you actually give a shit about the enviorment and care
we will ban all forms of private vehical use electric don't get a pass
everyone will be forced to only have 250 sq ft or less of in door living space
air conditioning will be banned
in door heat can be set at no more than 55 degrees
any outdoor water will be banned
cows will be banned

the states invovled in the colorado river basin were suppose to have a new agreement and water cutting measures completed a week ago
but since powel and mead are not really at all time lows these states have refused to provide any use cutting ideas

if anyone has ever ridden a bike around metro phoenix you should there are canals and canals of water all over that city flowing with massive amounts of water
other than the dried up salt river there is no reason why that much water should be flowing in a city at the bottom of a bowl in the middle of the desert

That's the optimistic scenario, which depends on people being willing to accept government control and regulation on a massive scale. The more likely scenario is more like Mad Max.

[californiagrown]

it is actually pronounced "POE-tuh-bull".

touche, you wordmaster, you.

Funny enough i grew up saying it the correct way, and then when i started my career dealing with it, everyone around me said it the wrong way and so i slip up all the time saying pot-able.

[bodywhomper]

In California, some of the research and growing practices for improving water quality and availability is “nature based” watershed restoration (eg forest and meadow restoration) and floodplain restoration.

There are several desal projects in planning or operations in SoCal. Energy use, NIMBY, and permitting are the biggest challenges. A lot are looking at Santa Catalina island as an example of success.

The federal gov is set to list several populations of the foothill yellow legged frog for protection under the federal endangered species act. Two reasons for known decline of those populations are managing hydrology in waterbodies for energy, water deliveries, and recreation in a manner that flushes individuals and eggs downstream, and for environmental releases that have been required to occur for management and protection of federally protected salmon and steelhead trout fisheries. As soon as the frog species is listed, things should get interesting.

[Toadman]

The Mississippi River makes a lot more sense.

There's an article somewhere on the internetz by a former hydrologist engineer that talked about the amount of energy that would be needed to pump water over the mtns to get the water into the Western CO river watershed. Seems like it would be quite expensive, even if they were to use a combo of solar, and wind and fossil fuels to power the pumps. IIRC, he said that if they had started on a project like that 50 years ago, it probably would have helped mitigate a lot of flooding damage over that time frame, and obviously the time value of money being what it is, would have been cheaper to have built out.

[BCMtnHound]

Which is easier/cheaper - desal or reclaimed sewage/waste water? (Neither of which, it would seem, are up to the task of supplying ag water)

Not sure of the energy requirements of each but desal results in mtns of salt that is very hard to store and at quantity is toxic to the environment (both terrestrial and aquatic).
Ignoring the chemicals aspect (household, industrial, pharmaceuticals) in wastewater, most of the biowaste after treatment can be used in agriculture in some manner.

Maybe if that salt could be used in some kind of battery or some such, it wouldn’t be such an issue in the desal calculation.

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Let’s rob Peter to pay Paul

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Not sure of the energy requirements of each but desal results in mtns of salt that is very hard to store and at quantity is toxic to the environment (both terrestrial and aquatic).
Ignoring the chemicals aspect (household, industrial, pharmaceuticals) in wastewater, most of the biowaste after treatment can be used in agriculture in some manner.

Maybe if that salt could be used in some kind of battery or some such, it wouldn’t be such an issue in the desal calculation.

I wonder what they do with all the salt from the desalination facilities in Saudi Arabia and other gulf states? When I was there in 90/91 the scale was mind boggling.

[Ted Striker]

Desal now, resal as the North Pole ice cap, Antarctic ice sheet, and all the glaciers melt. Problem solved!