Antiwork

[donutlynx]

First of all - USFS HR sucks. Like, really sucks. Some years it was hard to even onboard people and get them paid. I knew people that went past several paycheck dates without pay.

Couple things-

First is that fire seasons are longer.

There is also a 10 year strategy to massively increase fuels treatment, so at least some of those people would be working on fuels projects, planning, etc.

At the core, FF can't pay their bills and the feds are hemorrhaging staff to state/local/private outfits or totally different jobs, who pay better, have better benefits, better work/life. So seemingly part of the theory in addition to pay increases is to have them work more across the year so they have consistent pay.

Yep. And BLM HR isn't much better (maybe worse). Our WLFF folks that are coming onboard FT/Perm are branching out into timber, silviculture/forestry, engineering tech, and fuels tech work outside of fire season. I think it's great if the WLFF folks are interested in working year-round, and welcome the extra human power.

[Meadow Skipper]

Yep. And BLM HR isn't much better (maybe worse). Our WLFF folks that are coming onboard FT/Perm are branching out into timber, silviculture/forestry, engineering tech, and fuels tech work outside of fire season. I think it's great if the WLFF folks are interested in working year-round, and welcome the extra human power.

Yep.

[donutlynx]

^^Also gives WLFF personnel opportunities for OJT and a path to transition out of WLF if they want to settle down and start a family, etc. Or continue doing both. Stability can be good for people.

[subtle plague]

But then who donates the money for the trauma wing at the hospital he works in?

The state. The donations are called taxes I guess. But that's communist antics...

[subtle plague]

Isn’t capitalism all about the balance between profit and costs? Why shouldn’t capitalists use that calculation when it comes to their labor.

No no no!
If workers do that it's communism. Unlike state bailouts they are suuupeer shoe string frontier spirit and should endorsed because Profits should be Private and losses public!

[Boosh]

cant take credit for this, but a rant from Tim Dillon I heard on his podcast a while back about work was hilarious:

there's honestly nothing better than being at a dead end job with a bunch of other losers. you roll out of bed, listen to your favorite morning show while you sit in traffic, get in to the office, open a folder, read an email, bitch about your boss with your coworkers, take a little break and smoke a cig outside, what else would you do with your time anyways??.. you basically become war buddies with the other people in your shitty jobs, you get cocktails with your team after work and talk trash about the other people in the office who aren't there!.. people have to work, they need to provide for their families, not everyone can be millionaires or billionaires, someone's gotta be the cog in the machine and take on these lackluster menial roles.. what about going to a corporate convention every once in a while? that's always nice! going to a multi-day company training, hitting the shitty hotel bar and trying to get laid with some bimbo from accounting at a run-down Hilton Garden in bumfuck Ohio, that's the pinnacle of life right there. the happiest you'll ever be in your life is at a dead end job, there is seriously nothing better than laughing with your work buddies about wishing your boss would get shot in the head, talking about the good old days at the company, saying "it's not what it used to be" while you chomp down your crappy catered sandwiches at lunch, these corporate moments are actually beautiful, people don't know how lucky they are to have a mundane life of nothing, someone bringing donuts into the office on a Friday morning is truly peak civilization, don't you think people in third world countries would rather be bored at work than struggling to survive? people in war torn countries would 1000% percent rather have to choose which coffee creamer to use instead of suffering through the shit they deal with on a daily basis. You get tickets to a ball game every once in a while, that's it, that's the best it'll ever be, the boring dead end corporate job is an accomplishment that you should be happy about!

[Mazderati]

https://fortune.com/2024/02/16/nike-...-john-donahoe/

He feels really bad about it, though.

[warthog]

Isn't getting laid off peak antiwork?

[dan_pdx]

https://fortune.com/2024/02/16/nike-...-john-donahoe/

He feels really bad about it, though.

"I ultimately hold myself and my leadership team accountable".

It's funny, because some people would say that firing other people because you fucked up is the opposite of holding yourself accountable

[old goat]

Doing something bad and then saying you feel terrible about it is the ultimate example of making it all about you instead of about the person or people you harmed. Do something to make it better. Or STFU and hide.

[skaredshtles]

"I ultimately hold myself and my leadership team accountable".

It's funny, because some people would say that firing other people because you fucked up is the opposite of holding yourself accountable

Read this article that made me think very much the same thing...

https://www.westword.com/restaurants...rhood-19467957

[MontuckyFried]

Copy/paste from the Shit That Annoys You thread...

Corporations: "DoN'T BlaME uS! TheRE'S a [fill in the blank job] ShoRTaGE!!!
Also those same corporations: [use overly aggresive ATS, ie auto-resume shredders] [demand wild unicorn list of job requirements that nobody could possibly fulfill] [receive thousands of applications, reject 100% of them, repost the same mythical jobs repeatedly]

Then Boomers be like: "NoBoDY waNTS to WoRK theSE daYS! Lazy millennials!"

Seriously, though. This one's starting to piss me off. Industry I'm in (and everyone else) is proclaiming to the public that they have labor shortages across the board (including my job), but behind the curtain I was straight up told in an interview that the applicant pool is (supposedly) very competitive and it's an employer's market now. Yet many of those supposed positions remain unfilled. WTF is going on? I think these assholes be lying. Keeps profits higher if they can keep work force artificially low. These days making each employee do the work of like three people. Then tell the world that there's supposedly a labor shortage. Hmmm.....

[Danno]

Read this article that made me think very much the same thing...

https://www.westword.com/restaurants...rhood-19467957

goddam that dude is an idiot, I am sorry for his (former) employees but glad he went out of business.

[MontuckyFried]

Well, I'll be. Was screwing around with Google's new Gemini AI chatbot and it actually churned out a pretty good answer for me! Seems we're not the only ones noticing corporate America's bullshit. Even artificial intelligence has noticed! When will all the morans in the C-Suites and HR get the memo?

My question: If there is a labor shortage, why do companies reject most applicants?

You're right, it can seem paradoxical that companies reject applicants while also claiming a labor shortage. There are several reasons why this happens:

-Unrealistic Expectations: Some companies might have unrealistic expectations for candidates, seeking perfection in terms of experience, education, or salary expectations, leading them to reject qualified applicants who don't meet every single criteria.

-Poor Hiring Practices: Inefficient or biased hiring practices can lead to qualified applicants being overlooked or discouraged from applying, further contributing to the perceived labor shortage.

-Structural Issues: Sometimes, the "labor shortage" might be more about companies offering low wages, poor working conditions, or limited benefits, making them less attractive to potential employees.

-Focus on Quantity over Quality: In some cases, companies might prioritize filling positions quickly over finding the best fit, leading to high turnover and perpetuating the perception of a shortage.

It's important to remember that the "labor shortage" narrative is complex and nuanced. While there are genuine challenges in some areas, it's not always a straightforward picture of employers struggling to find any workers. By addressing the factors mentioned above, companies can improve their hiring practices, attract more qualified candidates, and potentially alleviate the perceived labor shortage.

HA! I KNEW IT!

[Foggy_Goggles]

No one has figured out that the only winner in the raise-the-minimum-wage game is the government. They make more — minimum-wage earners make more — but then are faced with everything becoming more expensive. They don't get ahead. Only the [government] gets a raise. I think it's silly that wealthy libs don't get that

Well I'm not a wealthy lib but I don't get it either.

[skaredshtles]

Well I'm not a wealthy lib but I don't get it either.

Srsly. That dude is a fuckin' moran.

[nickwm21]

Meh…..

There’s a true labor shortage at the direct cost / actual production level of the economy. You know, the jobs that you actually have to do stuff in person to get paid; the jobs that are actual work; plumbers, teachers, nurses, millwrights, truck drivers, janitors, pilots, cooks etc…

The jobs that are not actual work…. Those jobs where you pretend to do something from behind a computer screen… that’s where corporations are playing the games you describe…



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[altacoup]

^^^
Those are the same jobs that will be eliminated by AI.


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[Mazderati]

Meh…..

There’s a true labor shortage at the direct cost / actual production level of the economy. You know, the jobs that you actually have to do stuff in person to get paid; the jobs that are actual work; plumbers, teachers, nurses, millwrights, truck drivers, janitors, pilots, cooks etc…

The jobs that are not actual work…. Those jobs where you pretend to do something from behind a computer screen… that’s where corporations are playing the games you describe…



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Mike Rowe, everyone.

[Skistack]

goddam that dude is an idiot, I am sorry for his (former) employees but glad he went out of business.

My office is a couple blocks from there.

There’s still plenty of restaurants in LoDo that seem to have figured out how to make it work post-pandemic. Maybe that douche just sucks at running a business.


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[MontuckyFried]

Meh…..

There’s a true labor shortage at the direct cost / actual production level of the economy. You know, the jobs that you actually have to do stuff in person to get paid; the jobs that are actual work; plumbers, teachers, nurses, millwrights, truck drivers, janitors, pilots, cooks etc…

The jobs that are not actual work…. Those jobs where you pretend to do something from behind a computer screen… that’s where corporations are playing the games you describe…

Boolsheet! When times were tougher a few years back, I applied for truck driving jobs (I have a CDL), aircraft maintenance and all manner of airport jobs (my degree actually involves aviation after all), seasonal work at FedEx/UPS, janitor jobs and stocking at local grocery and hardware stores, the works. It was brutal. Online application process probably got me ATS cock-blocked for all of them. Eventually got a gig as a fork lift operator at a major factory here but the pay was pretty crap ($12/hour). As to the pilot thing, was recently talking to a friend of a friend at a gathering who had his license, all the ratings, etc. Has spent a fortune in training. Said he's been getting plain rejected from everywhere. They want everybody to come in fully trained on whatever particular airframe. Whereas back in the day, if you met the primary requirements, they'd train you up from there. MOST companies used to act that way. Nowadays, nobody seems willing to train personnel for technical jobs. You better come in loaded with ALL your education, tech training and multiple years of experience (for entry level somehow). The requirements for everything are insane now. They want unicorn candidates even for "real" work with the exception of the most bottom of the barrel (pay-wise) jobs.

Pre-covid days, sure. It was easier to get the jobs you mentioned for sure. Covid had a few awful effects, though. It made EVERYBODY push online-only applications, even for entry-level basic jobs, and then after everybody got shit-canned for a while there, the companies realized JUST how far they could push things with skeleton crews. Was even true for me on the assembly line. Coworkers told me our jobs used to have triple the manpower. They actually ramped up production pretty good and we crushed it by working our dicks off, BUT I'd see the customer in the press occasionally complaining about "worker shortages." There are lines of people trying to get work at this plant so there is certainly no shortage of labor here, so I can safely call bullshit on them at least.

Many companies these days are rocking the MOST minimal of staffing and loving every bit of the profitability. It's intentional. Profits and CEO compensations are way, WAY up over these last few years. They cry about inflation (sure, that's a factor), while seeing record quarterlies. Hmmmm.....

[MontuckyFried]

Might've burned a bridge today, but it was kind of satisfying, not gonna lie. So some of you may remember how I was offered a new gig recently but with THE most bullshit contract I've ever seen in my life. Overly broad terms, insane non-competes, crap about how they can not pay you for pretty much any reason, super one-sided. So I kicked it back to HR with my requested revisions and some questions where I needed some clarity on some of the more questionable items. Anyway, their response was there would be no revisions allowed and pretty much take it or leave it. So, I told them I needed some time for further consultation on it.

Well, this is pretty rad, but during my continued review and redlining, the President of said company was on a podcast with an attorney discussing what? Contract negotiations! Ya don't say. In this discussion, he was saying that clients bring him contracts (much like mine) and when things are too one-sided or overly broad without good definitions, he will run through it striking things out, making amendments, whatever. He said when they tell HIM it's a take it or leave it situation and he can't revise, then he will walk away from it. O rly? So I kicked back my requests one last time, and told them how there's no way even their own President would sign such a bullshit contract as is by his own standards, and included the link to the pod. Said I'd maybe still be interested in the position, but only if they'd be willing to negotiate the terms of the contract. Just got a response which was pretty much the standard "We wish you the best." Ha!

I've been doing this long enough to see how it plays out when things go south on a project. They throw guys like me under the bus all the time, despite the problem being caused at the direction of the company. This sets them up to get off scot free while destroying the lowest man on the totem pole. Gotta love how it's perfectly acceptable in the corporate world for lawyers and executives to negotiate terms, but us peons gotta just suck it up and take it without lube. Screw 'em.

[Mustonen]

Well, you can’t ignore the power dynamic. They can tell you to fuck off and it will cost them nothing. The next guy will take a swing at the contract and give it a go. Why would they sacrifice their position for an - at best - unknown? What’s their upside? Also, The managers responsible for your contract aren’t even playing the same game that the CEO is.

[jono]

Sometimes you just can't come to terms. If the other side is intent on burning through fools and taking maximum advantage of them the best you can do is not be one of them. There are other opportunities.

[MakersTeleMark]

That's why they are a functioning company and you are looking for a job. If you were smart you would have taken the job, and if things went south, sue them for any employment violations.

But alas, you are just going to make a point only to yourself that no one will hear. Way to stay on point of the thread though.