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Thread: Antiwork

  1. #26
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    I think the part that jump-started many people is being told they were essential during the pandemic but still being treated like shit.

    If your job is essential to the welfare of others, you should be paid a living wage, no matter how menial or low-skill that job is.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    the common theme to address the problems/issues that "antiworkers" experience is generally passive aggressive- to check-out and work less or stop working as opposed to actively trying to fix the issue (unionization, contacting corporate, talking to your boss/HR, switching companies, becoming the boss, etc)
    Uh, they are switching companies but shockingly the new place has the same shitty boomers that were at the other place. I've tried to fix the issues and get gaslit by the other boomers/entrenched employees. Contacting corporate or talking to your boss/HR.

  3. #28
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    Also, record corporate profits after government bailouts.

    If the owner(s) took government money and are using it for discretionary spending, perhaps distribution to the workers would change their attitude toward the bosses.

    I am looking forward to what Fred has to say.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulster2626 View Post
    Nothing makes people want to be slaves to the corporate overlords more than a boomer telling them their concerns aren't valid.
    No one wants a lieutenant commanding the army though, so...

  5. #30
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    Well Bob, it's like this. It's a question of motivation.
    "We don't beat the reaper by living longer, we beat the reaper by living well and living fully." - Randy Pausch

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toadman View Post
    Well Bob, it's like this. It's a question of motivation.
    Damn entitled Gen Xers and their not looking inward to fix their own problems.

  7. #32
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    Antiwork

    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    generally acting as though the low-skill low-pay job someone holds
    Iíd love for people that say this to go work ďlow skilledĒ jobs like Walmart cashier, wait staff, ditch digger, etc. it might not take the same skills you have but it takes a lot of other skills. The same people that scream at 16-year olds for not giving them the right size scoop of ice cream wouldnít last 15 minutes as a fry cook.

    And yeah, we realized how much of our life depends on these low wage ďlow skillĒ folks early pandemic. And then we ignored that, kept paying and treating them like shit, and now complain that theyíre lazy and asking for too much (even though the modern world wouldnít keep going without their labor)

  8. #33
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    Companies are trying to pump their ďwe are a great place to workĒ reputation so hard right now, without having any actual substance behind it. My company has hired so many Talent Acquisition and Hr people to ďtell our storyĒ, yet we suspended the 401k match for almost a year during Covid, then reinstated it 30% lower than pre-pandemic and had no raises in 2021 then 3% in early 2022.

    Iím pretty sure that is going to speak much louder than any other ďStoryĒ the marketing folks put together.


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  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Falcon3 View Post
    I’d love for people that say this to go work “low skilled” jobs like Walmart cashier, wait staff, ditch digger, etc. it might not take the same skills you have but it takes a lot of other skills.
    Didnt everyone work these jobs for years on end? I certainly did, usually a couple of them at the same time. Its low skill, low pay work. Ditch digging/brick laying is fucking brutal work and deserves a helluva lot more respect than a starbucks barista, or a pizza maker at papa murphys IMO.


    Where do you think the bootstrap trope came from? It came from people who worked low-skill, low-pay jobs who then pulled on their bootstraps.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    Didnt everyone work these jobs for years on end? I certainly did, usually a couple of them at the same time. Its low skill, low pay work. Ditch digging/brick laying is fucking brutal work and deserves a helluva lot more respect than a starbucks barista, or a pizza maker at papa murphys IMO.


    Where do you think the bootstrap trope came from? It came from people who worked low-skill, low-pay jobs who then pulled on their bootstraps.
    Lol. “High skill” jobs can be some of the biggest waste of space jobs around. If I ever drive a cab I’d like to punch Thomas Friedman in the nuts for convincing an era that “high skill” = “high value”. You want the latter, the former isn’t a great predictor.

  11. #36
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    Antiwork

    The thing is, there are no bootstraps anymore. Boomers took every advantage and program they could get (given to them by their parents), raped the planet, slashed their own taxes, and threw all the boots away. Then complain that other generations are entitled. Fuck them all.

    My wife and I both work full time, have no kids, have made not perfect, but good financial decisions, weíre lucky enough to have few student loans, but we are still worse off than either of our families growing up where we all survived on one income. The problems arenít individual, they are endemic to the system.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    Didnt everyone work these jobs for years on end? I certainly did, usually a couple of them at the same time. Its low skill, low pay work. Ditch digging/brick laying is fucking brutal work and deserves a helluva lot more respect than a starbucks barista, or a pizza maker at papa murphys IMO.


    Where do you think the bootstrap trope came from? It came from people who worked low-skill, low-pay jobs who then pulled on their bootstraps.
    Congrats! You got out. Iím sure itís 1000% because of your intrinsic awesomeness and had nothing to do with:

    Access to education
    Access to healthcare
    Explicit/implicit biases of people who hired you/taught you
    Race


    Fuck even just using the zip code people grew up in you can pretty accurately tell what their economic outcome will be. Iím sure thatís because those people in those zip codes are just way better at bootstrapping and the other zip codes are just lazy right?!?

  13. #38
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    Ditches get dug with diesel fuel these days...most times it's diesel + compression, like a trackhoe engine, but sometimes it's diesel + ammonium nitrate...


  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by highangle View Post
    Ditches get dug with diesel fuel these days...most times it's diesel + compression, like a trackhoe engine, but sometimes it's diesel + ammonium nitrate...

    Iím pretty sure that video is just those worms from Tremors

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    Didnt everyone work these jobs for years on end? I certainly did, usually a couple of them at the same time. Its low skill, low pay work. Ditch digging/brick laying is fucking brutal work and deserves a helluva lot more respect than a starbucks barista, or a pizza maker at papa murphys IMO.
    respect because it's physical? what makes that more deserving of respect?
    completely arbitrary, imo

    people deserve respect because they are people & for how they treat other people, not the role they may play

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    tone deaf bosses
    You got this part right.


    Quote Originally Posted by Falcon3 View Post
    Access to education
    Access to healthcare
    Explicit/implicit biases of people who hired you/taught you
    Race


    Fuck even just using the zip code people grew up in you can pretty accurately tell what their economic outcome will be.
    AKA baseline socioeconomic status.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by neufox47 View Post
    Companies are trying to pump their “we are a great place to work” reputation so hard right now, without having any actual substance behind it. My company has hired so many Talent Acquisition and Hr people to “tell our story”, yet we suspended the 401k match for almost a year during Covid, then reinstated it 30% lower than pre-pandemic and had no raises in 2021 then 3% in early 2022.

    I’m pretty sure that is going to speak much louder than any other “Story” the marketing folks put together.


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  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Falcon3 View Post
    Congrats! You got out. I’m sure it’s 1000% because of your intrinsic awesomeness and had nothing to do with:

    Access to education
    Access to healthcare
    Explicit/implicit biases of people who hired you/taught you
    Race


    Fuck even just using the zip code people grew up in you can pretty accurately tell what their economic outcome will be. I’m sure that’s because those people in those zip codes are just way better at bootstrapping and the other zip codes are just lazy right?!?
    No denying i had intrinsic advantages doled out by the universe through no fault of my own. All 4 of the ones you listed. 100%.

    Where we may disagree is the level to which my apparent "success" has been due to natural talent + work ethic vs due to being a white middle class male in america, and then why that matters in what should be a competitive meritocratic environment like the workforce? But, we are getting off topic.

    The biggest thing that bothers me about the "antiwork" movement is the passive aggressive approach to dealing with the problem, and the sense of being entitled to a middle class living (instead of working your ass off to earn it).

  19. #44
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    During the pandemic, I heard a Kroger exec say in an interview about raising employee pay "What the public doesn't understand is that while Kroger Co. is doing very well, profitability at the store level is not where we'd like it to be."

    He said
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Seeker of Truth. Dispenser of Wisdom. Protector of the Weak. Avenger of Evil.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunfree View Post
    Anti-antiwork is hilarious
    I believe it's called bootlicking.
    I ski 135 degree chutes switch to the road.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by ::: ::: View Post
    respect because it's physical? what makes that more deserving of respect?
    completely arbitrary, imo

    people deserve respect because they are people & for how they treat other people, not the role they may play
    Its totally arbitrary, and personal. I respect the work of someone when i can understand how hard it is, or how much talent it took. Im guessing that you hold more respect for work of someone who does the hardest job you ever did, than the work of someone who does the work of the easiest job you ever did, right? That's all i was saying.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    The biggest thing that bothers me about the "antiwork" movement is the passive aggressive approach to dealing with the problem, and the sense of being entitled to a middle class living (instead of working your ass off to earn it).
    Would you respect the movement more if it focused on direct action?

  23. #48
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    Antiwork

    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    The biggest thing that bothers me about the "antiwork" movement is the passive aggressive approach to dealing with the problem, and the sense of being entitled to a middle class living (instead of working your ass off to earn it).
    I appreciate your honesty and ability to reflect on your situation. Itís not common.

    Iíd push back on this idea you should be willing to work your ass off to earn a basic middle class life.

    It wasnít that long ago (1990s?) when anybody that even tried a little could live a decent life. From the 1940s to 80s-90s anybody could go get a factory job stamping widgets and it came with pension, enough earnings to support you and maybe even your family, and have a decent vacation once a year. That possibility has been stolen from most of us.

    The basic social contract has been broken by the ruling class of politicians and businesspeople. That hard work is commensurate with outcomes. Well itís not anymore. Sure there are people that do well but for your average American, the benefits of the grind donít match up with what it costs.

    People in the younger generations can no longer look forward to the basic dignities of a developed society. They canít afford a home. Shit they canít afford an apartment without roommates. They canít afford to have kids. They canít afford medical care. Even the people that do work their ass of arenít that much further ahead. And the society that took that away from them now spits at them for being lazy and entitled.

    Itís about time someone stood up and tried to change things. Iím nearing 40 and have a comfortable government job with pension and good benefits but Iím with them 100%.

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by abraham View Post
    Would you respect the movement more if it focused on direct action?
    Im solution oriented to a fault. And yes, direct action would take work to carry out... so that would be antithetical to them.

  25. #50
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    Ditch digger, you say?

    Move upside and let the man go through...

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