If only there was something we could do...

[XXX-er]

It's a little more nuanced than what's been said in the thread. Just among my friends & relatives in Canada there are four distinct groups. First, and by far the largest is the 'don't have guns or have any interest them'.

The second is, owns hunting guns, uses them, and got very hot under the collar from about the late 90s, and all the way through the 2000s when the federal government implemented stricter laws that covered literally all guns, including hunting, antiques, and collectibles. Eventually the government abandoned the parts that were considered to be overreach. (The don't really hunt, but live in the middle of nowhere, so need one folks are basically in the same group as the hunters)

The third and much smaller group wants to abolish all guns, and the even smaller fourth is envious of America, complete with competitive shooting, collecting and fetishizing.

yeah not really much of a gun culture ^^ thats probably pretty accurate, everyone might know A rabid gun nut but only one

Myself and my 14 yr old kid did a weekend FAC course back in the day cuz he was competing in Biathalon so we were really a very different demographic from the rest of the class

junior could have pretty much just challenged the exam but there was a whole classroom full of folks who weren't that bright

and now they all gun owners out there

[BCMtnHound]

It can’t be emphasized enough, however, that Canada has a long track record of denying their people access to sidearms. Long arms like rifles, shotguns and the like are not so much an issue with the exception of the nuances of the semi-auto variety, and we have mag limits for that instance (and an ongoing fight to keep the semi-autos cause we do have a few mass shootings as well). But the handguns are very restricted, including storage, transport, acceptable use, up to foregoing the right to be able to refuse entry of law enforcement to enter your home, at any time, to check on the status and storage of said restricted weapon.

Most of our unregistered guns come across the boarder illegally, bought legally in places like Texas.
https://www.cbc.ca/newsinteractives/...-path-of-a-gun

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Duh. Finally someone got my sarcasm.

Unicorn? Woooosh

I had considered that you were being sarcastic but given your posting history I discarded the thought that you might actually be funny.

The big black dildo is a good analogy for people with the black rifle fetish, it’s a proxy for their small limp dicks

[leroy jenkins]

My point is that there aren’t any significant laws yet. When mass shooters can legally acquire assault-style firearms then there aren’t enough laws to prevent that. I say that in good faith.

And reinstating the assault-style weapon ban is good place to start. Let’s give it a try - if it doesn’t work, we can take the next step.

At what point do you say that there are too many mass shootings? Too much gun violence? Answer in good faith please

But if someone has no previous record, either criminal, mental health, or like red flags in social media statements to friends etc, how do you prevent them legally acquiring a gun?

Its kind of a moot point as many mass shooters HAVE a previous record of mental health issues and threats of violence, and under our current laws, shouldn't be able to get a firearm. However, the ATF doesn't know these things. They aren't omniscient. Many mass shooters were previously reported to police or the FBI, who did nothing or close to nothing.

This problem is not going to be solved by limiting the rights of sane safe peaceful people with no problematic history. Its a problem of police and fbi's failing.

Any violence is too much violence. However, the world isn't a perfect place, and we're never going to legislate it into being one. Hence, there needs to be a balance between the rights of citizens and freedom to and freedom from. If the world remains a place where there is potential for violence, then people should have the right to protect themselves.

Besides, when governments go on a rampage the death tolls go into the tens of millions. All murders in the US since WWII don't add up to even close to as many people as have been killed by stalin hitler and mao. If you want me to answer in good faith, you cannot just dismiss this . This does not happen to armed societies. Go ahead and mock me with snark and sarcasm because you can't just admit ok yea, you've got a point with this.

[mcski]

Just the opposite. Few have documented issues. Thats why safe and sane people have no problem forgoing dick compensation toys. Back in the day, police were generally pro gun control because it makes sense

[leroy jenkins]

There's a lot of pro-gun culture in the USA, a large portion of the population fucking love guns for some reason. How do you change that?

Here in Canada I've got a few friends who enjoy shooting and hunting, but by and large nobody cares about guns at all, let alone enough to go out and try to own one. Seems like a different mentality in the states, and if any laws are going to change I think this mindset needs to change first. Just an outsiders perspective from someone who doesn't know what they're talking about, is all.

Maybe it's because we don't have gun stores all over the place, or they're kind of a pain in the ass to obtain. I dunno.

I fucking love guns. I've studied enough history to know there are of course cons, but also absolutly, pros, to a population not being easily victimized like stalin mao and hitler were able to.

Oh, yea thats right. Thats CRAAAZY.

[leroy jenkins]

These are the same people who believe being asked to wear a light proactive mask and other relatively simple measures to protect themselves and others from a potentially deadly new disease is too big of an individual sacrifice to bear for society.

Lol. Nice hyperbolic dismissal of legitimate concerns, when science has since shown that masks do very little to help protect anyone, and there are downsides to their use.

Its also just very black and white binary thinking. Like masks equal good and opposition equals crazy. Nevermind that there are negative consequences to kids being masked during their developmental years. Nope, any opposition is purely selfish right wing crazy and deserves to be mocked. Its completely black and white right?

instead of weighing the very real pros and cons of these things, they are reduced to this incredibly simplified black and white bullshit. Same with guns. Most liberals can't seem to interact with the actual complexity of the universe and need to reduce things to a BPD level of binary.

I remember years ago I used to have liberal friends who could say yea, there are some pros to civilian gun ownership, but I disagree. And I could say, yea, there are surely some cons to civilian gun ownership, and I can admit that and weigh those against the pros. Now most liberals can't even admit that the pros are even remotely valid, resorting to ridicule and sarcasm. This is a refuge for those who can't deal with the world's actual complexity.

[leroy jenkins]

Just the opposite. Few have documented issues. Thats why safe and sane people have no problem forgoing dick compensation toys. Back in the day, police were generally pro gun control because it makes sense

Lol. Anyone with a difference of opinion to you on this issue isn't sane. nice circular definition you've got there.

[mcphee]

This problem is not going to be solved by limiting the rights of sane safe peaceful people with no problematic history.

Sane, safe, peaceful people don’t have guns.

[J. Barron DeJong]

I fucking love guns. I've studied enough history to know there are of course cons, but also absolutly, pros, to a population not being easily victimized like stalin mao and hitler were able to.

Oh, yea thats right. Thats CRAAAZY.

When should we expect Canada, France, Germany, Italy, UK, Japan, etc. to become fascist states?

[ex-powderbroker]

STALIN MAO HITLER

[leroy jenkins]

When should we expect Canada, France, Germany, Italy, UK, Japan, etc. to become fascist states?

On a long enough timeline they will.

The life of one individual is a very short thing.


Did you really include Germany and Japan and Italy in there? Lol. Seriously? never read a history book? Hint, they already were, not that long ago at all.

This is really the argument you're making? Like, I can't believe this is just something you said? For serial? Super serial? You should really stop and think about this.

[leroy jenkins]

Sane, safe, peaceful people don’t have guns.

Incredibly circular biased definition there. Seems insane to me.

[mcphee]

Sane people don’t have guns because they don’t see everyone as a threat or see themselves as a mark

Safe people don’t have guns because households without firearms are statistically safer

Peaceful people don’t have guns because they don’t like killing animals or people

[PNWbrit]

When should we expect Italy to become a fascist state

1922, after armed Fascist blackshirts marched on Rome. Leroy would have fit right in.

[leroy jenkins]

Sane people don’t have guns because they don’t see everyone as a threat or see themselves as a mark

Safe people don’t have guns because households without firearms are statistically safer

Peaceful people don’t have guns because they don’t like killing animals or people

there are biathlon competitors who don't hunt or own for protection but just because they own guns you think they can't be sane or peaceful.

This is literally just your biased prejudiced hateful attitude towards those different than you. Sad and disappointing.

[leroy jenkins]

1922, after armed Fascist blackshirts marched on Rome. Leroy would have fit right in.

How would I have fit in ?

One things for sure.

I'm glad you folks don't own guns. You all seem very unbalanced and unstable.

[jackstraw]

Meanwhile, a local HS was shut down today and a person is in custody.

So we almost had another school shooting today that nobody will hear about. How many of those happen daily, weekly, monthly? No issues there, right? Mental health of students, parents, teachers. Ahh, fuck it. Sell more gunz! Yippee!

[Flounder]

Its kind of a moot point as many mass shooters HAVE a previous record of mental health issues and threats of violence, and under our current laws, shouldn't be able to get a firearm. However, the ATF doesn't know these things. They aren't omniscient. Many mass shooters were previously reported to police or the FBI, who did nothing or close to nothing.

So then do you support 100% background checks and red flag laws? Two things that won’t interfere with law abiding citizens ability to bear arms. You can’t just blame mental health and do nothing. There needs to be a way to stop someone from buying a gun. If they already have a gun, it needs to be taken away until they get their shit together. Easy enough, right?

[ex-powderbroker]

you’re so stable that hearing something like ‘reasonable gun control’ means that the usa is turning into an authoritarian state akin to stalin’s ussr.

deranged or stupid?

[leroy jenkins]

you’re so stable that hearing something like ‘reasonable gun control’ means that the usa is turning into an authoritarian state akin to stalin’s ussr.

deranged or stupid?

The USA absolutely is becoming increasingly authoritarian. Not because I'm triggered by a phrase but because the voting records of our politicians reflects this change.

Obama said he'd repeal the patriot act and then strengthened it beyond repeal.

Hyperbole and mocking me doesn't change that.

Its not the USSR, not by a long shot, or else we wouldn't be having this discussion (I use that word generously in regards to some this things I've read here) but its still absolutely becoming more authoritarian. Are abortion rights not under attack as well? Are all our rights not under attack? Every part of the bill of rights is important.

But you also put words in my mouth. I never made that comparision thats your strawman.

can you guys really not avoid using hyperbole and strawmen and putting words in my mouth? if you're so right shouldn't you be able to just articulate that in a not crazy way?

[mcphee]

there are biathlon competitors who don't hunt or own for protection but just because they own guns you think they can't be sane or peaceful.

This is literally just your biased prejudiced hateful attitude towards those different than you. Sad and disappointing.

I t’s an insane sport.

Look at the company you keep, who you’re carrying water for, and what you’re allowing. Of course I hate you.

[leroy jenkins]

So then do you support 100% background checks and red flag laws? Two things that won’t interfere with law abiding citizens ability to bear arms. You can’t just blame mental health and do nothing. There needs to be a way to stop someone from buying a gun. If they already have a gun, it needs to be taken away until they get their shit together. Easy enough, right?

Well saying I 100% support red flag laws is stating it with a BPD level binary black and white thinking. Obviously there needs to be nuance in how they are implemented. Obviously duality exists in the world, and many things aren't unequivocally good. Like compassion for trans kids is fantastic but that doesn't mean there isn't a potential for harm by removing the requirement to attempt therapeutic intervention before medical, and that compassion for kids harmed by this who later choose to detransition isn't valid as well.

I feel like 10 years ago this was common sense. Not now though.

[leroy jenkins]

I t’s an insane sport.

Look at the company you keep, who you’re carrying water for, and what you’re allowing. Of course I hate you.

Lol. Biathlon is an insane sport? How? I'd wager as a demographic its competitors are some of the least criminal least violent people on the planet.

Your hate has more to do with you than me. Its your heart thats full of hate not mine. I am glad you don't own guns if your heart is this deliberatly willfully full of hate. Mine is full of love.

Honestly I was not expecting this level of crazy returning to TGR.

[ex-powderbroker]

The USA absolutely is becoming increasingly authoritarian. Not because I'm triggered by a phrase but because the voting records of our politicians reflects this change.

Obama said he'd repeal the patriot act and then strengthened it beyond repeal.

Hyperbole and mocking me doesn't change that.

Its not the USSR, not by a long shot, or else we wouldn't be having this discussion (I use that word generously in regards to some this things I've read here) but its still absolutely becoming more authoritarian. Are abortion rights not under attack as well? Are all our rights not under attack? Every part of the bill of rights is important.

you’re a douche that deserves it but in this you have a point. unfortunately, wide and untracked ownership of firearms undermines our civil liberties and shortens our lifespans. hopefully sane safe law abiding gun ownership can continue with

a database
checks on storage
insurance
permitting
etc


and your assertion that red flag laws fail is wrong. they are not perfect because there’s no national system and even if there was, it is still quite easy to get a gun by default. neither tn or ky had them so we will never know. but if you had to jump through a bunch of bureaucracy to get a gun, a shooter might change their mind if they fall into some vagina first. and if there were databases and follow ups like in canada guns wouldn’t disappear stolen from cars millions at a time or just through straw
man purchases to end up in inner cities (lax states to tight states). not to mention the way they pour over the border to canada and mx (over 80% of the guns used in crimes are from america) and to other shores.

our system brings no benefits except to people like you who want to be free of guilt for their shitty opinions. fortunately you’re in the minority on tgr and real life and at some point the laws will catch up.