Official Sprocket Rockets Training Thread

[buttahflake]

Dead stopping with your heart redlined is not good, it can be dangerous for you, try to keep spinning and let it come down from there.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

Ok bumping this up. I may have missed a past post, but what are you guys using to track your food/calories? I need to figure out my diet for real. When I am lifting and riding bikes and trying to gear up for races I am often hungry/delirious late at night or in the early AM because I know I'm not eating enough/properly.

I'm also sore as fuck. Been stretching, foam rollering, drinking magnesium...........ice bath? Maybe it's time I go down that whole rabbit hole? Feed trough out on the back deck etc etc.

Quickly looking at Pickels nice chart on the last page I realize I basically NEVER eat enough when actually riding and I'm sure I never eat enough when I'm recovering either......and I'm probably not eating the right stuff.

[smmokan]

Fwiw, I started doing cold baths last month and I love it. It seems to help with quick recovery when I do back to back big rides, and the other (documented) benefits are all there as well. I went with the poor man’s solution and built one with a Rubbermaid stock tank, but I’m already eyeing a better solution. Of course this likely won’t help with your eating issues…

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

Fwiw, I started doing cold baths last month and I love it. It seems to help with quick recovery when I do back to back big rides, and the other (documented) benefits are all there as well. I went with the poor man’s solution and built one with a Rubbermaid stock tank, but I’m already eyeing a better solution. Of course this likely won’t help with your eating issues…

Do you just buy big bags of ice or do you have a commercial ice maker? I suppose I could just hoard the ice from the kitchen sized fridge icemaker in a cooler.

[smmokan]

I have a smaller chest freezer in the garage, and I use 5-6 bigger tupperware containers to freeze ice (about 2 gal each). It works pretty well right now since it's not hot yet here in Colorado, but I'm not sure it'll be enough once the temps hit 80-90* and the water heats up more. I have an insulated cover for the tank, and it typically gets up to around 60-65* during the day. With 5 blocks of ice (each about 10-12#, I'd guess), it drops the temp of the water about 15 degrees fairly quickly. I usually have the water between 45-50* or so. I'm going to see how it goes through the summer, but I may end up buying a chiller for the tub. Also, definitely get some spa cleaner - I use enzymes I bought from the local pool store and it makes a big difference.

[davjr96]

On the soreness topic... I'll be doing my biggest ride ever (not actually huge: ~74ish miles, 3k vert) and immediately getting in the car and driving 4 hours because life... Anything I can do quickly after the ride so that I will be able to stand when I arrive at my destination? Should I throw on compression tights in the car?

For specifics, riding around Tahoe on a Sunday morning and need to be in SF Sunday evening. Maybe I jump in the absolutely freezing lake as a fake ice bath

[Dantheman]

Ok bumping this up. I may have missed a past post, but what are you guys using to track your food/calories? I need to figure out my diet for real. When I am lifting and riding bikes and trying to gear up for races I am often hungry/delirious late at night or in the early AM because I know I'm not eating enough/properly.

I just shovel food into my pie until I can't take it anymore, rinse, repeat. But, if you want to be more objective about it the Carbon app seems to be the best food tracking app out there.

I'm also sore as fuck. Been stretching, foam rollering, drinking magnesium...........ice bath? Maybe it's time I go down that whole rabbit hole? Feed trough out on the back deck etc etc.

The best DOMS solution is consistent lifting and the Repeated Bout Effect.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

Hmm I do have a small chest freezer that is dangerously low on elk/beef. Might as well make ice blocks in it.


The issue for me just shoveling food is that my belly swells up if I just look at a carb and my muscles still feel weak. If I literally only eat proteins I can slim up a bit but then feel like i'm half asleep all the time. Genetically I am not setup to be thin/trim as a latino and I have yet to accept that haha.

[J. Barron DeJong]

The Huberman Labs/Andy Galpin podcasts that DTM posted in another thread had one dedicated to nutrition, one dedicated to recovery:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/4FU...Qj-Sqh7i6FTdIQ

https://open.spotify.com/episode/2b9...Sn-rTJ56tPRESw

For ice baths/cold treatment they talk about potential interference: if the goal is to eliminate soreness because you need to be able to perform again quickly (like middle of a sports season where you have games every couple of days) then getting rid of the soreness may be worth it, but in doing so you’re reducing one of the signals that’s leading your body to adapt (grow muscle or whatever) so you’re potentially hurting long term gains.

[Dantheman]

The issue for me just shoveling food is that my belly swells up if I just look at a carb and my muscles still feel weak. If I literally only eat proteins I can slim up a bit but then feel like i'm half asleep all the time. Genetically I am not setup to be thin/trim as a latino and I have yet to accept that haha.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CqWEsgepBay/

The Huberman Labs/Andy Galpin podcasts that DTM posted in another thread had one dedicated to nutrition, one dedicated to recovery:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/4FU...Qj-Sqh7i6FTdIQ

https://open.spotify.com/episode/2b9...Sn-rTJ56tPRESw

For ice baths/cold treatment they talk about potential interference: if the goal is to eliminate soreness because you need to be able to perform again quickly (like middle of a sports season where you have games every couple of days) then getting rid of the soreness may be worth it, but in doing so you’re reducing one of the signals that’s leading your body to adapt (grow muscle or whatever) so you’re potentially hurting long term gains.

Andy Galpin's answer to literally very question:

"It depends."

He's not wrong

[climberevan]

https://www.instagram.com/p/CqWEsgepBay/

Yep. I suspect that a close look at WRG's diet & general practices would find big red flags. We've been down this road before on this thread.

Consistency is the key, whether it's diet or training.

[buttahflake]

Guy needs a psychologist or an e-bike or more laps.

[XtrPickels]

Ok bumping this up. I may have missed a past post, but what are you guys using to track your food/calories? I need to figure out my diet for real. When I am lifting and riding bikes and trying to gear up for races I am often hungry/delirious late at night or in the early AM because I know I'm not eating enough/properly.

I'm also sore as fuck. Been stretching, foam rollering, drinking magnesium...........ice bath? Maybe it's time I go down that whole rabbit hole? Feed trough out on the back deck etc etc.

Quickly looking at Pickels nice chart on the last page I realize I basically NEVER eat enough when actually riding and I'm sure I never eat enough when I'm recovering either......and I'm probably not eating the right stuff.

I'm a bit mixed on the Food Tracking.
Pro's
1. It can give insight into diet that is otherwise unavailable
2. It creates accountability
3. It gets to the root of the problem which is calorie in vs. calories out

Con's
1. It is borderline impossible to do accurately unless the individual has both an innate knowledge of nutrition and the patience / diligence to weigh everything
2. Due to the above, bad data often means that individuals make poor decisions / actions that lead them astray
3. Due to the above, a difficult process + limited value = most give up after ~1 month.

We all know the basics, but we rarely want to adhere to them
1. Diet should be based around vegetables, lean meats, and fruits.
2. Avoid calorie dense foods with low nutrition value (anything processed or with added sugar, meats with high fat content, alcohol, grain-heavy meals)
3. If you're training a lot, eat a lot. If you aren't then eat less
4. If you need to binge late at night because you're starving, then you need to increase your intake during the day.
5. Consistency is key. A small deficit each day adds up to weight loss over time. A huge deficit today and a binge tomorrow leads to increased fat stores.
6. Go for the big-wins because the marginal gains are hard to sustain. E.g. Calorie timing / altering macro-ratios / supplements can make sense on paper but either have limited real-world value or are difficult to implement without a professional.

[Dantheman]

Con's
1. It is borderline impossible to do accurately unless the individual has both an innate knowledge of nutrition and the patience / diligence to weigh everything.

Also, it's legal to under-report cals by up to 20% and lots of health-conscious packaged foods toe right up to that line.

If you weigh/measure everything for a month or so most people can calibrate themselves pretty well and estimate close enough by eye after that.

[bean]

The issue for me just shoveling food is that my belly swells up if I just look at a carb and my muscles still feel weak. If I literally only eat proteins I can slim up a bit but then feel like i'm half asleep all the time. Genetically I am not setup to be thin/trim as a latino and I have yet to accept that haha.

The weight gain when you have some carbs (especially when you’re already restricting carbs) is literally 80% water, the rest is glycogen stored in your muscles. Keep fat intake low when you're in a high carb consumption phase and there won't be much to store as body fat.

Pickels nailed it on the big picture stuff being what matters most. It took me a long time to really come to grips with the bit about starving in the evening means you need to eat more during the day.

I’ve been doing a block of big intensity the last three weeks (5-6 zwift races per week about an hour each) and despite eating a *ton* during the day (focus on carbs and protein, trying to keep fat down to stay lean) I’m not gaining weight and I’m not starving every night like I used to be. Lots of oatmeal, bread, etc. Last race is tomorrow and then I’m going back to a more sane routine for June with long base rides and such. I can’t wait to stop eating so much, and to get a real weigh-in done. I bet I’m no worse than stable from a month ago by the time the dust settles.

[bagtagley]

Hmm I do have a small chest freezer that is dangerously low on elk/beef. Might as well make ice blocks in it.


The issue for me just shoveling food is that my belly swells up if I just look at a carb and my muscles still feel weak. If I literally only eat proteins I can slim up a bit but then feel like i'm half asleep all the time. Genetically I am not setup to be thin/trim as a latino and I have yet to accept that haha.

I’m not here to encourage a LC or VLC diet, but if that’s your goal, you need to eat more fat. Protein is good for a lot of things, but isn’t a reliable source of energy.

[Dantheman]

200 g of sucrose. This plus half a dozen dates kept me me feeling pretty strong for 4 hours yesterday.

[whyturn]

I like my liquid IV packets for hydration and nut butter bars for quick boost


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[XtrPickels]

200 g of sucrose. This plus half a dozen dates kept me me feeling pretty strong for 4 hours yesterday.

All about the table sugar.

I did 120g per hour.... for 7(ish) hours a day ..... for 7 days in a row in Portugal.

TSA was a bit put off by my two 5 pound bricks of white powder...

[climberevan]

Dixie Crystals gang REPRESENT! I'm looking forward to the Portugal TR.

Ms CE signed us up for a 100mi gravel race this Saturday. We'll both be on the 80-100g of sugar per hr program. We'll have little ziplocks pre-measured with it for bottle refills at aid stations.

[Dantheman]

TSA was a bit put off by my two 5 pound bricks of white powder...

You couldn't buy sugar in Portugal?

[XtrPickels]

You couldn't buy sugar in Portugal?

I like to be self-sufficient.

[J. Barron DeJong]

There are parallel pathways for carbohydrate uptake, right? Does table sugar hit both of those, and at approximately the right ratios to maximize the use of both pathways?

(Just asking out of general interest, since I don’t do any ultra-endurance stuff.)

[Dantheman]

My grade-school understanding:

Table sugar is sucrose, which is a 1:1 glucose:fructose disaccharide. Glucose uptake maxes out around 50-60 g/hr, IIRC. Fructose uptake happens via a separate metabolic pathway, but for a long time it was thought that fructose utilization during exercise was low so the focus was placed on glucose sources, such as dextrose and maltodextrin. When people started actually studying fructose utilization they found that it was actually much higher than anticipated, so the "ideal" G:F ratio has climbed from 3:1, to 2:1, and now 1:1 appears to be ideal, or at least below the tolerable upper limit for fructose intake.

[climberevan]

My grade-school understanding:

Table sugar is sucrose, which is a 1:1 glucose:fructose disaccharide. Glucose uptake maxes out around 50-60 g/hr, IIRC. Fructose uptake happens via a separate metabolic pathway, but for a long time it was thought that fructose utilization during exercise was low so the focus was placed on glucose sources, such as dextrose and maltodextrin. When people started actually studying fructose utilization they found that it was actually much higher than anticipated, so the "ideal" G:F ratio has climbed from 3:1, to 2:1, and now 1:1 appears to be ideal, or at least below the tolerable upper limit for fructose intake.

Yep, and don't forget the most important thing: table sugar is CHEAP and easily obtained (except in Portugal).

Stop paying a bunch for repackaged sugar.