Boot grind help

[morphintoskittle]

Sup guys,

Been getting some pain on the outside of my foot when skiing. I have traced it back to the ridge on the inside of my boots that can be found circled in the picture below.



The boots are Salomon X Max 120's. Heat moldable shell. Fit is pretty much spot besides this one small thing. I used to not get this pain, however since breaking in my new/aftermarket liners, it has become pretty intolerable. With that said, they are Intuition Pro Tongue liners and I definitely have no more than 65 days with them. I do strap my boots down fairly tight, so I'm sure its the ridge in the boot digging into the side of my foot; especially when I am using that ski to corner as a downhill ski. The ridge on the inside of the boot is about the height circled in the picture below, for perspective.



Now I could easily get a dremel and remove the slightest bit of material to smooth it out, but will that cause integrity issues? Are these shells sensitive to heat generated by that? The shell seems rather thick in that area. Kinda not hoping to spend a ton of money as I'm on a college budget...but the pain is getting pretty bad, so any help is appreciated. Thanks

[gregL]

I would punch it, not grind. The plastic is reasonably thick, but there is a seam for the bi-injected mold there and your chances of jacking up the seal are high. Bootfitters seldom grind these days unless it's a genuine plug boot (e.g. thick), the X/Max is not.

[toast2266]

Prior to shell modifications, you could try sticking a little bit of very thin foam on either side of the ridge to alleviate the pressure point. It might just make things too tight, but it's quick, and easy to undo if it doesn't work.

[morphintoskittle]

I would punch it, not grind. The plastic is reasonably thick, but there is a seam for the bi-injected mold there and your chances of jacking up the seal are high. Bootfitters seldom grind these days unless it's a genuine plug boot (e.g. thick), the X/Max is not.

Gotcha, yeah I would agree it definitely does seem like the ridge is resulting from being the seam created in the molding process...I just worry that the ridge is so thick/low/protruding into my shell that a punch would not be able to fix it without excessively blowing out that area?

[kamtron]

Even on a college budget, a single punch for that issue should cost less than $20. I'd hunt around your local shops.

[iriponsnow]

I would punch it, not grind. The plastic is reasonably thick, but there is a seam for the bi-injected mold there and your chances of jacking up the seal are high. Bootfitters seldom grind these days unless it's a genuine plug boot (e.g. thick), the X/Max is not.

Had the same issue in my X/Max, punched em & it went away. The heels are unusually tight.

[morphintoskittle]

Sounds good, Ill go ahead and look into getting them punched then. Thanks guys.

[waxman]

was the seam there before the shell was heated? not familiar with the boot but that looks like it was over heated and the seam is separating

[morphintoskittle]

was the seam there before the shell was heated? not familiar with the boot but that looks like it was over heated and the seam is separating

The shells have actually never been heated. Not separating, just the way the boot comes stock...

[gregL]

The shells have actually never been heated. Not separating, just the way the boot comes stock...

Heat mold them first, it works wonders, that is how the boot is designed.

Pad up the area you want to move with foam, give the liner a good bake (I would go 10 minutes with a cold oven, 8 with a pre-heated one), don't heat the liner if you want to move the shell as much as possible. Stand in them on a flat, hard surface for 13 minutes or so.

[morphintoskittle]

Heat mold them first, it works wonders, that is how the boot is designed.

Pad up the area you want to move with foam, give the liner a good bake (I would go 10 minutes with a cold oven, 8 with a pre-heated one), don't heat the liner if you want to move the shell as much as possible. Stand in them on a flat, hard surface for 13 minutes or so.

Due to my rather skinny foot I was told by a pretty experienced boot fitter that I shouldn't heat mold the shell as it will expand excessively...Ill likely be going back to him within the next week though if punches/grinding are actually that cheap.

[gregL]

Due to my rather skinny foot I was told by a pretty experienced boot fitter that I shouldn't heat mold the shell as it will expand excessively...Ill likely be going back to him within the next week though if punches/grinding are actually that cheap.

It will only expand where there is pressure, i.e. where it hurts. It can actually help wrap a cuff better for a narrow ankle. I probably do 12-15 Custom Shell and Memory Fit heat molds a week.

[waxman]

listen to Greg

[XavierD]

Anyone who recommends against molding a liner or shell is just being lazy.

First thing I do with almost anytime I get a new boot is toss the shells in the oven. Ain't gonna hurt it.

Also grinding that seam won't hurt it.

[jackattack]

Any boot? How much do standard pu alpine boots move when heated in an oven?

[XavierD]

Any boot? How much do standard pu alpine boots move when heated in an oven?

depends on the oven...

I get a bit out of my RX130s, and might tune the oven up a bit for it. Key is to actually let them cool all the way down to below room temp.

[gregL]

Every boot moves when hot; the question is whether the plastic actually stays in that shape once you take your foot out.

[gregL]

A shop oven (they are all the same oven made in Germany by K-Tech) is set to 117 C. (242.6 F.) and works great for an X/Max, not so much for a race caliber PU-Ether plug. Can't hurt, though, and often helps pull the hardware out to the max, etc.

[XavierD]

Greg, you can open up the back and change the temperature. Different brands will also have their ovens set to different factory temps.

[gregL]

Greg, you can open up the back and change the temperature. Different brands will also have their ovens set to different factory temps.

I've opened up 3 of them (Salomon, K2, generic - you know the ovens I'm talking about) and they were all the same; they shut down at roughly 240-245 F. I've tried moving the screw around as well, but you have to just stick a thermometer in the oven and see when the heater shuts off, there is no calibration. Then you sit around and wait until the heater starts up, this is usually around 225-230 F. for an average of around 235-237 F.

[detrusor]

How hot would you get a plug Lange to move it?


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[gregL]

How hot would you get a plug Lange to move it?

I wouldn't use an oven, I'd use a heat gun to localize the heat and keep from heating parts of the boot I don't want to modify. The last time I used an IR thermometer on a Lange plug was with the older "brushed" surface PU Ether plastic, and it was in the 300-310 F. range. The newer Dual Core plastics are a bit more sensitive to surface melting, so I would (do) go a bit easier but rely on the finger touch inside the shell method . . .

[GoldenBC]

I recommend against heat moldinga custom shell for people looking for a tight ankle fit. A snug ankle creates enough pressure to move the shell, resulting in a looser fit afterwards. For the average tourist, no issue.

One issue to look out for when heat moulding a boot not designed for heat moulding is that you could warp the sole. In a custom shell boot, the sole and spine are less heat mouldable than the rest of the boot, so the low temps needed to fit the boot, won’t affect the spine or sole. With other boots, the plastic is all affected similarly and could potentially result in a twist, more forward lean, unwanted canting, etc. Unlikely, but I have seen it happen so proceed with caution.

In this guys case, if his boot fits perfectly except for that ridge why go through the entire process and risk loosening the fit (which is guaranteed to happen to some degree)? Just lightly punch that one spot. Done in five minutes.

[GoldenBC]

It will only expand where there is pressure, i.e. where it hurts. It can actually help wrap a cuff better for a narrow ankle. I probably do 12-15 Custom Shell and Memory Fit heat molds a week.

Greg, when you are aiming for a better wrap, do you tighten the buckles a bit more to make that happen?

[gregL]

Greg, when you are aiming for a better wrap, do you tighten the buckles a bit more to make that happen?

Tighter? I just use the first screw hole (or even drill a new hole) for the buckle ladder and do a "hot" bake (like 10 minutes rather than the 6 or 8 the reps recommend). It works a bit better with the Atomic Hawx cuffs than the Salomon cuffs with the reinforcing plate.