What I learned in Avalanche School

[TBS]

I've not read any of the author's other works, but found her Newbie take on avalanche safety training refreshingly interesting
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/31/m...-julavits.html

An excerpt

A man at the end of the table asked the class if anyone had seen the 2014 movie “Force Majeure.” I was the only person who had. Another man asked what the movie was about. I didn’t say it was about the ongoing shame and denial experienced by a husband who abandoned his wife and children during an avalanche scare. I didn’t say, “Much like this course so far, it’s a referendum on masculinity.”

[PNWbrit]

Was just reading this.

Excellent.

[John_B]

Very well written and certainly illustrates the bizarre world of backcountry travel. The concept of wanting to go where the danger potentially is must look very strange to people/newbies. I ski with my wife and her friends a fair amount and yet again it makes me resolve to make sure I'm doing a good job of shutting the fuck up and listening to other people before I throw my opinion out there.

For anyone trying to get around the NYTimes paywall if you stop loading the page prior to getting the paywall alert you're able to read the entire article.

[Core Shot]

For anyone trying to get around the NYTimes paywall if you stop loading the page prior to getting the paywall alert you're able to read the entire article.

Thx.

Link in the nyt article is also a good read From powder mag

https://storied.storied.co/human-factor-2.0/chapter-1

[Bunion 2020]

The NY Times was OK, thanks for that Powder Link.

[babybear]

good articles. had read the powder one prior which somewhat negates the "women are safer" angle but generally I agree with that.
I also can relate to the author in the NYT article who talks about going skiing with some guys that claim "she can ski it" - but can you ski it without wallowing/ endangering the situation more and can you ski it confidently enough to mitigate a potential sluffing/ slide situation?
(guys get sucked into this too for sure but seems to be more ladies)

also on the subject of force majeure - saw this movie coming out and was psyched at first for a funny ski movie with Will Farrell and Julia Louis Dreyfus but after watching the trailers it appears to be a remake of force majuere and is certain to be heavier than what I would have expected from these 2. although it looks like some funny moments "How could I run away in ski boots? Have you ever tried running in ski boots?"

[plugboots]

So...why couldn’t she tell if the car was four-wheel-drive in that New York Times article?

[LHutz Esq]

Why does she call Cherry Bowl a “Yukon avalanche”? The people were from Yukon but cherry bowl is near Shames in BC.


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[I Skied Bandini Mountain]

So...why couldn’t she tell if the car was four-wheel-drive in that New York Times article?

I think it was analogous.

[plugboots]

I think it was an analogous.

Well, duh. It was poorly written.
“Hey I know, why don’t you fly out West and take an avalanche course and write about what goes on, male egos, etc.”

[glademaster]

Your expert halo is showing.

Interesting piece, could have been better. I found it refreshing to read something that was so blunt about the realities of backcountry travel in the winter, which I truly believe are almost universally downplayed.

[summit]

I tried and quit reading it for the second time. I keep picking up this raging undertone of arrogant cynicism in the author's prose that makes me want to change browser tabs.

This is no masterpiece like Snow Fall, which is an expose of the human factor.

Edit, tried again, made it one more paragraph and nope.

Also, I was too kind. It's not an undertone. The piece reeks of the author's superiority complex:

"Here’s where my skill set came in handy. Here’s why all avalanche courses should include at least one novelist. In my head, I imagined the real “avalanche problems” on Microdot."

Yea.. only a novelist can do that. Also, who actually says things like that? Much less prints it in a national publication?

Maybe I am jaded because I run across 1 student like this every 2 or 3 classes who just effuse the attitude "I have it dialed and this class is a formality." They "know people." They did their "research" or have all the "experience" and really they wish they were teaching... so they don't learn. They consciously or subconsciously believe they are doing the class a favor by being in it and they let everyone know it. Even on the occasion one of these types of "students" is truly knowledgeable and experienced, because of their shit attitude, they interfere with the learning of others and kill the vibe. Maybe in this case they just brood and write articles later. Often these people ARE the human factor.

Maybe I'm just overly sensitive to what bothers me as an educator, but after 10 years of doing it, this personality type is a rather easy spot. /rant

[kootenayskier]

It’s unrealistic to expect to learn anything significant from an article written by a novice for a general audience, but it was interesting to have my daily practice considered from a neurotic outsider’s perspective.

[summit]

It’s unrealistic to expect to learn anything significant from an article written by a novice for a general audience, but it was interesting to have my daily practice considered from a neurotic outsider’s perspective

Well put

"from a neurotic outsider's perspective"

... but one who thinks she is neither neurotic nor an outsider, but feels the need to repeatedly goes on at length (unconvincingly) as to why she is neither. This while also expounding on why she is so great at understanding the issue in a way "other" insiders can't because they just don't have her skills.

[Self Jupiter]

"Here’s where my skill set came in handy. Here’s why all avalanche courses should include at least one novelist. In my head, I imagined the real “avalanche problems” on Microdot."

Can’t believe this made the final edit

[BFD]

I was surprised to start reading and find the hatcher pass accident. Somehow that is now a case study used in avalanche education. Did not really read the rest of it.

[reckless toboggan]

Often these people ARE the human factor.

Precisely.

[plugboots]

And this graph:

Why not add: “Pecked to death by ducks.”?

[Bunion 2020]

Not sure what that graph actually means.

Is that the likelihood of being caught in an avalanche? Cause it certainly does not represent the possible outcome when you are actually caught in an avalanche.

[PNWbrit]

“Pecked to death by ducks.”?

Floaty little bastards.

Damn tasty though.

[mall walker]

Not sure what that graph actually means.

Is that the likelihood of being caught in an avalanche? Cause it certainly does not represent the possible outcome when you are actually caught in an avalanche.

probably just avalanche as a % of total mortality in US adults or something I would guess, which is obviously not super useful

[ACH]

Floaty little bastards.

Damn tasty though.

[quote = Buster] Bacon of the bird world [/quote]

[plugboots]

Sorry. That graph was from the David Page Powder article. I’m gonna blame Pinot noir.

[cravenmorhead]

Thanks for the Powder link; great piece.

[Jonathan S.]

[...] Maybe I am jaded because I run across 1 student like this every 2 or 3 classes who just effuse the attitude "I have it dialed and this class is a formality." They "know people." They did their "research" or have all the "experience" and really they wish they were teaching... so they don't learn. They consciously or subconsciously believe they are doing the class a favor by being in it and they let everyone know it. Even on the occasion one of these types of "students" is truly knowledgeable and experienced, because of their shit attitude, they interfere with the learning of others and kill the vibe. Maybe in this case they just brood and write articles later. Often these people ARE the human factor.

Maybe I'm just overly sensitive to what bothers me as an educator, but after 10 years of doing it, this personality type is a rather easy spot. /rant [...]

Thanks for posting this -- I too found this article interesting, but only for the insight into the perspective of a nightmare of a student for any fellow course instructor.