Ask the experts

[XXX-er]

At one time i had some used time road shoes with time pedals & cleats, for MTB I had SPD pedals & mtn bike shoes, at some point it seemed point less so I sold the road stuff and just went SPD which i don't regret.

I might need to be more upscale if i was riding a Pinerello Dogma but for an old CAAD7 I can rock the mtb shoes

and I can actualy walk in them

[sf]

It’s DUB interface, but the T-Type cranks spindles are longer than normal 12sp Eagle cranks to enable that shitty 55mm chain line. You’d have to use the DUB wide BB spacer- I can’t remember if it’s 7.5 or 11.5mm.
So yes, but Q factor would get wider and chain line would get worse - unless she’s riding a SuperBoost bike.


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I’m obviously clueless but I thought standard eagle was 55mm as well, if uaing zero offset chainrings?

[joetron]

Sure, but most frames have 52mm chain line, so it’s rather rare to use zero offset rings.
The T-Type cranks are “Dub Wide”, the spindle is longer. Last I checked (a few weeks back) there were only 3mm offset T-Type rings. Which sucks, but this isn’t an issue for Evan though, since he’d be using Eagle drivetrain, a so a 6mm ring would work for chain line correction.


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[sf]

Thanks.
Yeah, I’ve been looking for 8-bolt chainrings with 4,5mm offset.
Guess there will be aftermarket options soon, but SRAM selling only complete cranksets really makes it somewhat costly

[singlesline]

Anyone use egg beaters on their road bike? There is just enough of a difference in the cleat position on my road/mountain bikes to be annoying. Plus I like my mtb shoes better than my road shoes.

I’ve always used Time pedals anywhere I’m clipped in.

IMHO as long as you have a decent shoe it won’t be a problem. Too much flex and you might get hot spots on long road rides, but modern stiff/carbon soled XC style shoes will be just fine on the road.

[rideit]

Anyone have Garneau MTB shoes?

Curious how they fit. Actually looking for a very light SPD shoe for road and gravel. No chance of trying them on, and QBP is basically “no returns, EVAR”.
TIA
Either these or the XC

[Flounder]

I’ve got road and MTB Garneau shoes. They fit my feet really well, I’ve got a wider fore foot. They don’t pinch my toes causing numbness like other shoes have. We stop by the factory outlet when we are in the NEK so trying on is easy. They are good shoes, been very happy with how they hold up.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

WRG, based on your posts over the past month, I think your bike hates you.

Ha, yeah IDK. I've never had a bike that needed so much fiddling. Gotta take the cassette off the rear wheel today because every couple months it develops a horrible creak. IDK why.

Its actually a super fun bike and given random money to throw at I I would probably keep the front triangle and change pretty much everything else. Upgrade to the newer rear triangle that is carbon and doesn't have the stupid 3mm offset. New fork (incoming), new wheels, new brakes, new Transmission drivetrain etc etc.

I need to make this bike work so that I can get a regular trail/aggressive XC bike. It's stupid to drag a 38 pound hog up 95% of the steep climbs around here. I want a bike that I can go do 30+ mile days on linking trails together and still be relatively competent at speed on the downhill.

[Roxtar]

It's stupid to drag a 38 pound hog up 95% of the steep climbs around here. I want a bike that I can go do 30+ mile days on linking trails together and still be relatively competent at speed on the downhill.

I feel you.
Two bikes ago I made the switch from enduro rig to trail bike and haven't looked back.
Went to a Ripmo and now an Offering and have never felt the need to go bigger. And this is in the steeps of northern NM.
It's actually fun to ride a non-dh trail again and a couple weeks ago I even did the Salida Enduro which had two burly stages and still never felt under-gunned.

[Roxtar]

Wax lubes are certainly the worst in terms of longevity,

Depends on your definition of "longevity".
An oil based lube may stay on pretty much forever but is it actually lubing the chain when it's full of grit or just wet sanding it?

[Dantheman]

38 pound hog

How is it that heavy? I've ridden with Boissal and Marshal on their Garnv's and don't recall either of theirs being anywhere close to that.

[Roxtar]

Anyone use egg beaters on their road bike? There is just enough of a difference in the cleat position on my road/mountain bikes to be annoying. Plus I like my mtb shoes better than my road shoes.

When they first came out (dating myself here) I used them for XC endurance racing. I see no reason against using them for road.

[toast2266]

Depends on your definition of "longevity".
An oil based lube may stay on pretty much forever but is it actually lubing the chain when it's full of grit or just wet sanding it?

I mean, the wax lube ends with a dry chain that's noisy and feels friction-y after not particularly long, and the wet lube is quiet and doesn't have any noticeable increase in friction for a good while longer, so...

There's no question that a wet lube runs dirtier. But if the "clean" lube doesn't last a whole ride, there's not really much point in discussing the finer points of the data. I'm not gonna spend the last 2 hours of a ride on a bike that sounds like a rusty huffy just so I can point at how clean my chain looks.

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

How is it that heavy? I've ridden with Boissal and Marshal on their Garnv's and don't recall either of theirs being anywhere close to that.

Not sure I ever actually weighed it, but I'm remembering 37.5# for some reason with pedals. DD casings, cush core, burly fucking wheels, no carbon parts but the front triangle, etc.

I spend the majority of the summer riding Big Sky Bike Park. You need a real sled to ride there, Silver, etc etc so I can't get rid of this bike. Trail rides near town? Racing in Helena? Big divide rides, etc? Yeah I need to get like a 130mm bike. Saw a Druid out of the trail. Fuck that looks sexy. Sounds like the rear end on that bike is legit.

[Roxtar]

I mean, the wax lube ends with a dry chain that's noisy and feels friction-y after not particularly long, and the wet lube is quiet and doesn't have any noticeable increase in friction for a good while longer, so...

There's no question that a wet lube runs dirtier. But if the "clean" lube doesn't last a whole ride, there's not really much point in discussing the finer points of the data. I'm not gonna spend the last 2 hours of a ride on a bike that sounds like a rusty huffy just so I can point at how clean my chain looks.

That "dryness" is on the outside plates. The rollers are still full of lube. That noise may be irritating but at least it's not pulling the grit into the chain.
I'm more concerned with longevity of the drivetrain. I don't want a grit magnet chain lube prematurely wearing out my drivetrain just so I can point out how quiet it is.

[toast2266]

That "dryness" is on the outside plates. The rollers are still full of lube. That noise may be irritating but at least it's not pulling the grit into the chain.
I'm more concerned with longevity of the drivetrain. I don't want a grit magnet chain lube prematurely wearing out my drivetrain just so I can point out how quiet it is.

I'm getting 1500+ miles out of a chain. Maybe if I dealt with a squeaky drivetrain that sounds like utter shit, I could get it to last longer. But then I'd have zero riding partners and I'd probably go insane because a noisy drivetrain is in the top 3 most annoying sounds on the planet. So instead of enduring that for a 10% bump in lifespan on a $50 part that I replace every other year, I'll just use lube that audibly works.

[El Chupacabra]

Anyone use egg beaters on their road bike? There is just enough of a difference in the cleat position on my road/mountain bikes to be annoying. Plus I like my mtb shoes better than my road shoes.

I tried using them for road pedals, long ago - scrapped that idea pretty fast, as I could pull straight out of the pedal on a road bike, and there was no spring preload adjustment. Maybe they've changed. Maybe Crank Bros still sucks.

[Roxtar]

I'm getting 1500+ miles out of a chain. Maybe if I dealt with a squeaky drivetrain that sounds like utter shit, I could get it to last longer. But then I'd have zero riding partners and I'd probably go insane because a noisy drivetrain is in the top 3 most annoying sounds on the planet. So instead of enduring that for a 10% bump in lifespan on a $50 part that I replace every other year, I'll just use lube that audibly works.

Perhaps we're both overstating the negatives.
I suppose oil encapsulated grit won't wear a chain out overnight.
and...
3hr rides in NM moondust doesn't create a noisy chain as long as I rinse it out between rides (literally 10 seconds). I recently did a 6 hr enduro race in Salida without a peep. But that was with a newly waxed chain. That was 3 weeks ago and it's still running quietly.
Granted, the timespace between rewaxing is around 3-4 weeks and it will let you know when that time is coming.

[toast2266]

Perhaps we're both overstating the negatives.
I suppose oil encapsulated grit won't wear a chain out overnight.
and...
3hr rides in NM moondust doesn't create a noisy chain as long as I rinse it out between rides (literally 10 seconds). I recently did a 6 hr enduro race in Salida without a peep. But that was with a newly waxed chain. That was 3 weeks ago and it's still running quietly.
Granted, the timespace between rewaxing is around 3-4 weeks and it will let you know when that time is coming.

You're talking about hot wax, and I'm talking about drip wax, so that's certainly part of the disconnect here.

Hot wax sounds great until it's not. But my issue with hot wax isn't the longevity, it's the general hassle. And yes, I'm aware it's "really not that big of a hassle, just do these quick and easy 37 steps and then it's the best thing ever." And I don't doubt that the end results are very nice.

But at least until I get bored, I'm sticking with my extremely low hassle lubing regiment, because it works fine and requires approximately zero effort or forethought.

[Supermoon]

Ok, maybe a dumb question, but what's the purpose of lube in the drivetrain? Is it to lubricate the pivots in the chain, lubricate the chain/sprocket interface, push dirt out of the interface? I'm not sure I understand where the friction in the system is.

[climberevan]

Or you could put a 6mm offset chainring on to the cranks. Bringing your chainline back closer to 52mm.

I have a 170 XO Transmission Left side Non Power meter arm/spindle if you want to mess around with it, to see if it fits.

Thanks. I might take you up on that. I'm still checking options.

It seems like leaving the chainline at 52 with the new cassette might actually be better for most people (who ride real trails and can't put out 450 watts for an hour) who spend a lot of time in the biggest cogs. I'd rather have a nice line in the 2nd and 3rd biggest and a worse line in the 2 smallest, where I spend almost no time.

Anyway I prefer Shimano.

[rideit]

Hey, if any of you miraculously have a 136.5 mm Race Face BB spindle kicking around, HMU.
THNKS

[XXX-er]

Perhaps we're both overstating the negatives.
I suppose oil encapsulated grit won't wear a chain out overnight.
and...
3hr rides in NM moondust doesn't create a noisy chain as long as I rinse it out between rides (literally 10 seconds). I recently did a 6 hr enduro race in Salida without a peep. But that was with a newly waxed chain. That was 3 weeks ago and it's still running quietly.
Granted, the timespace between rewaxing is around 3-4 weeks and it will let you know when that time is coming.

wow I didnt realize you hot wax folks go 3-4 weeks between lubing the chain, besides the hassle factor which i have been told is not really , that doesn't seem often enough to me ?

[J. Barron DeJong]

You're talking about hot wax, and I'm talking about drip wax, so that's certainly part of the disconnect here.

Hot wax sounds great until it's not. But my issue with hot wax isn't the longevity, it's the general hassle. And yes, I'm aware it's "really not that big of a hassle, just do these quick and easy 37 steps and then it's the best thing ever." And I don't doubt that the end results are very nice.

But at least until I get bored, I'm sticking with my extremely low hassle lubing regiment, because it works fine and requires approximately zero effort or forethought.

What are these 37 steps?

On my road bike, it’s: pop the chain off, thread it onto the swisher thing (bent spoke in my case) put that in the crock pot and turn it on low uncovered.

Some time later, whenever I’m free and the wax has melted, come back and give it a swish for a few seconds, then hang to drip.

Before next ride, break the wax bonds by running the chain around something (I run it around the handle of one of my garage cabinets). Then put the chain back on the bike.

It’s literally a few minutes of actual working time, and broken into even smaller chunks that you can be flexible with.

For (dry) mountain, I wipe the chain with a rag sprayed with alcohol before taking it off the bike. So that adds another 30 seconds to the process.

[J. Barron DeJong]

Ok, maybe a dumb question, but what's the purpose of lube in the drivetrain? Is it to lubricate the pivots in the chain, lubricate the chain/sprocket interface, push dirt out of the interface? I'm not sure I understand where the friction in the system is.

Chain lube is for the internal parts of the chain, not for the chain/sprocket interface.

’Shedding’ type was lubes - hot melt, or a few types of drip - actually shed wax particles as the bike is ridden, and that can carry contamination out with it.