Roundup

[Ripzalot]

po witto wipsawot! hoit and angwy!

why do you think i'm angry? i'm laughing at y'all for your stupidity. see? -->

[Ripzalot]

You are quite the tool. You had to make it a leftist thing and post a chart from a guy who is a chef. What alias do you post under in poly?

Yeah, I started this thread based on a business getting hammered by 3 lawsuits now. That's what it was about. How may scientists were involved in this trial and how was their proof that it has caused their cancers...in 3 cases now? I don't know, but there is more to that story. I don't really care, but I'm not buying any stock in Bayer right now.

i think the bigger tool are the ones spreading enviro-propaganda disinformation. sorry if i lumped you in but hey, you didn't provide much context.

a chef huh?

GUEST AUTHOR: Alison Bernstein, PhD is a neuroscientist, who studies the role of epigenetics and environmental exposures in Parkinson’s disease.

[neufox47]

. Also perhaps consider pulling weeds instead of spraying them.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15862083

I only use it on poison oak. I’m not pulling that shit. I am amazed at how the other weeds that get hit when spraying it seem completely unfazed. Maybe I need to get the 41% stuff to really knock them out. Currently losing the war against star thistles. Mother Nature just pulled a Night King on me and is giving us a significant rain in late May. All the foxtails are going to come back, and the rest of the weeds will grow again. Fuck. At least the blackberries , wild plums, and cherries should be good.

[wyeaster]

why do you think i'm angry? i'm laughing at y'all for your stupidity. see? -->

yeah i'm sure she spiked it to terrify those kiddos with "enviro-propaganda." that's what you'd do if you worked for koch industries as a highly successful attorney for years before working for the epa and then public interest groups. obviously she was making up for bad karma.

[4matic]

Without an effective replacement food production will decline and costs will rise. More people will die because they won't have access to or can't afford commodities. Too many people in the world anyway so I will just try and enjoy my $15 organic soy burger.

[mtngirl79]

yeah i'm sure she spiked it to terrify those kiddos with "enviro-propaganda." that's what you'd do if you worked for koch industries as a highly successful attorney for years before working for the epa and then public interest groups. obviously she was making up for bad karma.

You never answered if "aquatic life" meant plants or fish.

[warthog]

I tend to agree here even if the masses don't. We trust science for stuff like global warming, why do some think that there is some conspiracy with scientists to cover up the glypho nonsense?

I tend to only believe in the science that fits my narrative.

Global Warming- Bad- scientists back me up
Monsanto- Bad- Scientists don't know what they are talking about.

About par for the course here. The same person that is likely to tell me that my 1979 Jeep that I drive 40 miles a week, is killing the earth, will also tell me that vaccines cause autism. So, I am to believe science and believe that I alone, a digesting American, am killing the earth, but I am supposed to believe Jenny McCarthy and Jim Carey when it comes to my kids' health. THAT right there is why I have a hard time listening to anyone anymore when it comes to their "science".

[Skidog]

I tend to only believe in the science that fits my narrative.

Global Warming- Bad- scientists back me up
Monsanto- Bad- Scientists don't know what they are talking about.

About par for the course here. The same person that is likely to tell me that my 1979 Jeep that I drive 40 miles a week, is killing the earth, will also tell me that vaccines cause autism. So, I am to believe science and believe that I alone, a digesting American, am killing the earth, but I am supposed to believe Jenny McCarthy and Jim Carey when it comes to my kids' health. THAT right there is why I have a hard time listening to anyone anymore when it comes to their "science".

wait does Bayer make any vaccines? Maybe you're onto something here?

[warthog]

Yup - there it is. Right next to frying foods and being a hairdresser.

Don't forget "Very Hot Beverages". Gotta look out for those too.

Some of the Known carcinogens are a little unsettling. Who knew Salted Fish was so dangerous?

[Game Over]

^yup.

Without an effective replacement food production will decline and costs will rise. More people will die because they won't have access to or can't afford commodities. Too many people in the world anyway so I will just try and enjoy my $15 organic soy burger.

This. But keep in mind that RoundUp Ready crops are just one of several herbicide resistant crop traits in the tool bag.

We also have engineered resistance to 2 4-D, glufosinate, dicamba to name a few... not to mention a lot of older herbicides that are still around from before we started beeeding resistance. All these work but they are much dirtier than roundup.

[warthog]

wait does Bayer make any vaccines? Maybe you're onto something here?

I am still undecided if Bayer = BAD. I mean, let's look at the facts.
1. They are German- leaning towards BAD, I mean Hitler and all, AMIRITE?
2. They like chemicals- leaning towards BAD, every movie I have ever seen with a really bad guy(Dr Evil) has some sort of lab with chemicals and stuff.
3. They make Aspirin- BAD- If you take too much Aspirin, it can kill you. That is very irresponsible of them. Of course, too much water can kill you too, but you know, I like science that only proves MY point.

[Timberridge]

On a positive note, they don't make talcum powder, which if you put it on your cooter gives you cervical cancer. So they have that going for them.

[warthog]

On a positive note, they don't make talcum powder, which if you put it on your cooter gives you cervical cancer. So they have that going for them.

I heard they were heavily invested in GMO Talc futures. Evil

[k2skier112]

because it's a convenient excuse for leftists to rail about a "big evil corporation".

caffeine is 40x as toxic as glysophate....

do you have a source for your science?

[Kinnikinnick]

do you have a source for your science?

It’s a chart bro, what more does he need?

Starting today I’m replacing my morning coffee with Roundup thanks to this chart.


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[jackstraw]

do you have a source for your science?

This woman - http://translationalscience.msu.edu/...AIBfaculty.htm

And she states this regarding the LD50 chart -
What is an LD50?

Let’s get something straight about LD50 – it is a measure of ACUTE toxicity. That is, LD50 is relevant for accidents, murders or suicides.

An LD50, or the median Lethal Dose, and the related LC50 (median lethal concentration, for inhalation rather than ingestion) are measures of acute toxicity only. Acute toxicity relates to adverse effects that occur after a single exposure or multiple exposures within a day, and effects that manifest immediately or within two weeks of the exposure. The LD50 is determined experimentally, usually with rats or mice. It is single acute dose that will kill 50% of a population given that dose. If you have a test population of 100 rats, it is the dose found to be sufficient to kill 50 of them. Likewise, the LD50 for humans is the dosage of a compound estimated that would kill 50 out of 100.

LD50s tell us about risk in cases where someone is exposed to a large amount of a chemical in a short amount of time. In other words: accidents, murders or suicides. Most real human exposures are not acutely lethal but have other, long-term or chronic, effects that may or may not be toxic. Thus, LD50s are not very useful when considering health effects of the large majority of human exposures.

Despite their lack of usefulness in describing chronic toxicity, as noted above, charts comparing LD50s are inevitable in almost every comment thread on the internet about chronic toxicity, lately in regards to glyphosate, the active ingredient in the herbicide Roundup. People are generally not concerned about poisonings – rather they are worried about increased risk of cancer and other long term health risks. LD50 is the wrong measure for discussions of chronic toxicity.

[Game Over]

[muted]

Steep, honey, that chart could could be right, I wouldn't know, but you have a bad rep here for posting ridiculous stuff that's misleading, out-of-context, or just plain wrong. No one is gonna read that. Sorry.

[Game Over]

Bullshit. Where have I posted false scientific info?

The info graphic is from this piece. It has links to every regulatory agencies statement.

https://gmo.geneticliteracyproject.o...dup-dangerous/

[MontuckyFried]

I'm not so much worried about Roundup's direct effect on human health, but rather the unintended consequences of what it does on the microscopic level, which in turn effects EVERYTHING downstream. Disrupt the microbiome in all the tiniest critters, then you end up screwing it all up.

I mostly believe the studies that say it doesn't cause cancer and all that, thus regulatory bodies deem it "safe" for humans, but that's missing the big picture. What happens when we lose all the bees, the butterflies, etc.? Then we'll have MUCH bigger problems than a few people theoretically getting sick from it.

https://www.npr.org/2018/09/25/65161...ead-bee-deaths
https://arstechnica.com/science/2016...thin-20-years/
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/26/o...cientists.html

THIS is why the over-use of such products scare me.

[Game Over]

^you seem to be speaking to the entire “reliance on pesticides” issue and not roundup or even herbicides specifically.

[Dantheman]

Without an effective replacement food production will decline and costs will rise. More people will die because they won't have access to or can't afford commodities.

In the end, the weeds will win:

n the 1990s, when the first genetically modified crops, such as glyphosate-resistant corn, canola, soybean and cotton, were introduced,[170][171] no glyphosate-resistant weeds were known to exist.[172] By 2014, glyphosate-resistant weeds dominated herbicide-resistance research. At that time, 23 glyphosate-resistant species were found in 18 countries.[173] "Resistance evolves after a weed population has been subjected to intense selection pressure in the form of repeated use of a single herbicide."[172][174]

According to Ian Heap, a weed specialist, who completed his PhD on resistance to multiple herbicides in annual ryegrass (Lolium rigidum) in 1988[175] – the first case of an herbicide-resistant weed in Australia[176] – by 2014 the Lolium rigidum was the "world’s worst herbicide-resistant weed with instances in "12 countries, 11 sites of action, 9 cropping regimens" and affecting over 2 million hectares.[173] Annual ryegrass was known to be resistant to herbicides since 1982. By 1996, the first documented case of glyphosate-resistant L. rigidum was reported in Australia in 1996 near Orange, New South Wales.[177][178][179] In 2006, farmers associations were reporting 107 biotypes of weeds within 63 weed species with herbicide resistance.[180] In 2009, Canada identified its first resistant weed, giant ragweed, and at that time 15 weed species had been confirmed as resistant to glyphosate.[174][181] As of 2010, in the United States 7 to 10 million acres (2.8 to 4.0 million hectares) of soil were afflicted by superweeds, or about 5% of the 170 million acres planted with corn, soybeans, and cotton, the crops most affected, in 22 states.[182] In 2012, Charles Benbrook reported that the Weed Science Society of America listed 22 superweeds in the U.S., with over 5.7×106 ha (14×106 acres) infested by GR weeds and that Dow AgroSciences had carried out a survey and reported a figure of around 40×106 ha (100×106 acres).[183] The International Survey of Herbicide Resistant Weeds database lists species that are resistant to glyphosate.[184]

In response to resistant weeds, farmers are hand-weeding, using tractors to turn over soil between crops, and using other herbicides in addition to glyphosate.

Monsanto scientists have found that some resistant weeds have as many as 160 extra copies of a gene called EPSPS, the enzyme glyphosate disrupts.[185]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glypho...esistant_weeds

Summary

The proliferation of glyphosate-resistant weeds is increasingly forcing growers to use additional or alternative management tools to achieve adequate weed control.
For a small number of weed species, resistance to multiple herbicides now leaves growers with few viable options for control.
No new herbicide modes of action have been commercialized in the last 20 years, and it is unlikely any will be coming in the near future.
New herbicide-resistant crop technologies coming to market this decade will expand grower options for dealing with resistant weeds, but all rely on existing herbicide active ingredients with known weed resistance cases.
Recent experience with glyphosate resistance indicates that all herbicides are susceptible to resistant weed evolution given enough time and repetition of use. Overreliance of any new weed management tool will eventually lead to its failure.

https://www.pioneer.com/home/site/us...phosate-resis/

[4matic]

/\kind of like people taking antibiotics for common cold and flu. The resistant strains become more deadly.


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[MontuckyFried]

^you seem to be speaking to the entire “reliance on pesticides” issue and not roundup or even herbicides specifically.

No. Did you even read the links? The first two were specifically about herbicides. Monarch butterflies specifically depend on milkweed. Bees get their guts wrecked by glyphosate aka Roundup.
"Glyphosate perturbs the gut microbiota of honey bees": https://www.pnas.org/content/115/41/10305

[skaredshtles]

In the end, the weeds will win:

Yup. In the end, I'm convinced humans will make things uninhabitable for ourselves, we'll all die off, and the weeds, bugs, and birds shall inherit the earth.

NTTAWWT.