Overthinking things: The binding combo edition.

[nickel]

So let's say you wanted to put a couple sets of inserts in your brand new skis to get some extra versatility. Which 2 or 3 would you choose? Here's the scenario:

Skis are 128 and 94 under foot. Realistically destined for 75% OB, 25% IB. In bounds use is mostly work related therefore also done in an AT boot. Some of it can be pretty fun though so IB performance and reliability not to be underestimated. Must have hole patterns that play reasonably well together without crazy offsets in boot centers. All bindings must accommodate rockered touring boots. Frame bindings not considered. Kingpin also off the table.

Original plan was 128 gets salomon mtn + warden. 94 gets tecton/warden or tecton/mtn.

Playing with mount points until my brain felt like mush says you might be able to make all 3 work and even share a couple holes but we're still talking ~24 holes per ski which seems over the top.

I'm also considering ditching the mtn in favor of tecton/warden on both. I'm a big guy and reports have me optimistic about the mtn but cautiously so.

So let's hear it. What would you choose? How much overthinking can i add into my brain?

[SkiLyft]

You are overthinking it. Mount Shifts up and be done. Better yet add inserts for shifts and then swap them between skis.

What does your average tour look like? We talking >15k of vert? Over several passes If so then yeah maybe you want the MTN. Or 3-5k? If that’s the case given you are a bigger guy take the IB releasable/safety of a full alpine binder.
We need more details! Haha


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[nickel]

5-7k with a handful of 10k days a season. first year juju has me weary of shifts but they're not out of the question.

[toast2266]

You're probably gonna have to swap brakes too since those skis are way different widths, unless you're running something without brakes.

After years of running inserts and swapping bindings, I concluded that it's far too much hassle.

[smooth operator]

I concluded that it's far too much hassle.

I came to the same conclusion before mounting inserts.

[LiveLarger]

After years of running inserts and swapping bindings, I concluded that it's far too much hassle.

This! Also, it seems to significantly reduce the resale value of the skis.

[nickel]

resale value is super low importance. I do not tend to flip skis, I generally ski them until they're done unless i really don't jive with them.

[SupreChicken]

For that ib/oob ratio, I might go for tectons only, but I don’t know if you’re comfortable with that...

[LiveLarger]

I skied most of last season on tectons. I have lost count on how many days it was, but probably around 50/60ish. Skied them "inbounds" as you guys call it "over there" and also tons out in the mountains. I had little/no trouble with them. They let me loose when they should and never when they shouldn't.

[mall walker]

5-7k with a handful of 10k days a season. first year juju has me weary of shifts but they're not out of the question.

Shifts on a 75% touring setup seems awful heavy to me. What bindings are you touring on now?

[nickel]

For that ib/oob ratio, I might go for tectons only, but I don’t know if you’re comfortable with that...

i had a negative experience doing this with kingpins. all appeared fine first season then everything went to hell in a handbasket. I'm not dead set against the idea but that's kind of how wardens came into the picture.

[XXX-er]

I came to the same conclusion before mounting inserts.

yeah i have never even considered it

I make sure to have cash for the deal which is usually ski/binding/skins for cheap in may, you just need to have faith that stuff will come along cheap/gear will go on sale ... its kind of like religion

[nickel]

Shifts on a 75% touring setup seems awful heavy to me. What bindings are you touring on now?

my touring binding history over the last decade goes trekkers>fritschi freeride>rad1>kingpin

I've grown to appreciate efficiency and value transitions without removing skis and the like although the single riser of shifts isn't a huge deal to me. performance on the down is of value though and i really enjoyed saying goodbye to the vague heel of traditional pins on harder snow. This was the thinking behind mtn on the pow stick as the torsion on the ski is mostly pretty low. This is also part of the mental hand wringing.

[TahoeJ]

For that ib/oob ratio, I might go for tectons only, but I don’t know if you’re comfortable with that...

That's what I was going to say. Or Shifts, I suppose.

[galibier_numero_un]

Is your plan to swap bindings weekly, as in from Warrdens to Tectons for a tour on your day off? If so, then I suspect as others have noted that you'll grow tired of weekly swapping very quickly.

I'm in the insert camp primarily because I take time to figure out if I want an alpine or a touring mount. I go back and forth when figuring out a ski, and sometimes a new ski enters the quiver and reverses my thinking.

I'm in the "let the retail beta testers" have at it with the Shifts this year as well.

... Thom

[nickel]

Plan was indeed to go weekly swapping. Sounds like it's not most people's preferred way...

[XXX-er]

its certainly what is possible but will you want to do it? I used to re-wax for every day but nowadays not so much

I am on that whister / skiboard swap FB page and there are constant deals on that page every week so IMO just buy something that is a complete package already slightly used for like 1/3 of the price, the downside is eventualy running out of room to store all the skis

inserts might be good if you are taking several skis somehere in a bag like Japan

[TahoeJ]

i spent a most of a season on the Vipecs.
really for me the biggest drawback was the fiddle into toe factor when under duress. they required a flat place to stand for entry and if i was in any kind of hurry, well fuck they took a few tries to align the pins.
otherwise, the binding performed well in all snow conditions.

The Tecton, however, is the easiest tech step-in binding I've ever used. And they've since updated the Vipecs to be the same.

[rod9301]

I went from the dynafit to g3 ion to Salomon mtn.

The mtn is hands down the best binding for me.
Simple, doesn't ice up, and great retention.
Also light, even though this wasn't my first requirement.

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[NorCalNomad]

I've grown to appreciate efficiency and value transitions without removing skis...

Amen, skimo skills have some real benefit for casual touring. Being able to relax and get food or a drink instead of fiddle fucking around like your buddies is awesome .

I'd be in the camp of just Tecton it. The only time I don't like my regular Vipecs inbounds is late in the day when everything is chopped up and lacking the heel elasticity is a bummer.

[dcpnz]

Pretty sure in your situation I'd want another pair of skis.
Put touring bindings (either mtn or vipec tecton but not necessarily the same) on both pair you have and get something in between for working inbounds in the 100 - 110 underfoot range with wardens. Heck even guardians / frame binding on the inbounds pair if there's a need for that.
Used, new, beater, whatever it takes not to mess with inserts and swapping couple of times a week or compromise every day.

[nickel]

Tecton only is definitely a decent option. Prior experience on kingpins probably not relevant as the limited pre-releases I experienced would likely be mitigated by toe elasticity. Pin failures and heel failures also not relevant due to different product but concerns remain. Kingpin took longer than 1 season to show it's true colors...

[sethschmautz]

I've been swapping bindings on plates and with inserts for a few years. Currently, I'm using a combo of Radical 2 and Beast 14s that I bought from Spyderjon. I essentially owned a full set of Radical 2.0s and a set of Beast 14 heels as they share the same toe. The Beat 14 heels stayed (for the most part) on my DPS RPCs that I used primarily inbounds last season. The Radical 2.0 heels stayed (for the most part) on my Salomon Mtn Explore 95s. I also used a combo of Dynafit Beast boots and TLT6Ps. Mostly skied the Beasts with the RPC setup and the TLTs on the Explores.

Most of my days were spent skiing with my 5yo last season, although I got 2 hours each Saturday when he was in ski club to ski by myself. I had envisioned myself taking advantage of some good slackcountry while he was at ski club, but I was always paranoid about not making it out in time to come back and get him at the end of club. I most ski inbounds to ski soft snow, and that often is found out of bounds. For me, the Beast 14 was a pretty decent compromise last year and I think it will work well this year also. On harder/mellower days I would try to ski the Explores with the TLT6Ps to work on technique and improve skiing softer, lighter gear.

The only downside was having to swap toes from one ski to another or adjusting the bindings specific to the boot, although I didn't do that a ton. A few weeks ago I added a second pair of Beast 14s so I could just leave the toes on the skis with the intention of selling the heels. If you go a similar route and want a pair of Beast heels for cheap, let me know. For now, this is working for me - I have a reasonably light touring binding (Radicals) and a reasonably descent inbounds/slackcountry binding (Beasts). There are room for improvements on both bindings, but they work for my needs.

Seth

[LeeLau]

pretty sure Vipecs have heel elasticity

Not much. Actually so little that it's not significant

[LeeLau]

And Pat you can do Tectons and get away with it. You're smooth enough