Who has switched from race-type boot to 3-piece?

[mikdes26]

I currently ski and love the comfort, control, and feel of the Salomon X Max 120. The problem? They’re not warm. They’re the model from a few years back that have a bad seal in the gusset in the toe, thus allowing some minor air and water leakage. Not terrible, but not good.

I have a low volume foot and ordered the Dalbello Lupo SP ID on an impulse. I’ve yet to get them fitted but, based on wearing them around the house, I’m pretty sure a good fitting will get them right.

X Max pros: Fit, control, comfort, and I simply like the look. Plus I’m used to them. They feel like home.
X Max cons: Not warm.

Dalbello Lupo SP ID pros: Intuition wrap liner, warmer, walk mechanism, rubber toe & heel for better walking grip.
Dalbello cons: Not crazy about the look (inconsequential), more upright stance that may require technique tweaks.
Dalbello “jury is out” factor: stiffer flex, never skied a 3-piece boot or intuition liner, slightly longer bsl (2mm).

Who has made a similar switch and what has been your experience?

[galibier_numero_un]

As far as the upright stance, I think you'll like it. I was late to the party with modern skis (perhaps 4 days ago).

I'm more trad than modern, and I like the feel of my shins against the front of my boots, and wondered how I'd adapt to a more upright stance. It took me two runs.

I found what others have noted - my quads are less tired.

For more of a data point, I don't like "modern" mount points on my skis I've skied my Praxis GPO mount point back by 1cm, and later by 1.75cm (liking both). I like my Billy Goats mounted on line.

... Thom

[1000-oaks]

They’re not warm. They’re the model from a few years back that have a bad seal in the gusset in the toe, thus allowing some minor air and water leakage. Not terrible, but not good.

If a leak is the main problem with your overlaps, tape the gap. If you don't like duct tape, gaffer's tape is fantastic stuff and it even comes in white.

[mikdes26]

If a leak is the main problem with your overlaps, tape the gap. If you don't like duct tape, gaffer's tape is fantastic stuff and it even comes in white.

If you look closely at the photo you will see that duct tape is already in place on the Salomon. The bad seal isn’t the only reason they’re not warm.


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[mikdes26]

As far as the upright stance, I think you'll like it. I was late to the party with modern skis (perhaps 4 days ago).

I'm more trad than modern, and I like the feel of my shins against the front of my boots, and wondered how I'd adapt to a more upright stance. It took me two runs.

I found what others have noted - my quads are less tired.

For more of a data point, I don't like "modern" mount points on my skis I've skied my Praxis GPO mount point back by 1cm, and later by 1.75cm (liking both). I like my Billy Goats mounted on line.

... Thom

Perfect info. I also have Billy Goats on the line and they’re bombers. Love them.


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[creaky fossil]

I don't know if I'd base the overlap > cabrio decision based on cold feet in an overlap. But anyway... I switched from overlap to KR2 3 yrs ago. I like the fluidity of the flex and since I used ZipFits in my overlaps, the cabrio KR2 also is a whole lot easier to put on/take off, so it scores laziness points as well. I haven't ever really had cold feet issues skiing so I can't say much about whether overlap to cabrio for me suggested cabrio = warmer.

[mikdes26]

I don't know if I'd base the overlap > cabrio decision based on cold feet in an overlap. But anyway... I switched from overlap to KR2 3 yrs ago. I like the fluidity of the flex and since I used ZipFits in my overlaps, the cabrio KR2 also is a whole lot easier to put on/take off, so it scores laziness points as well. I haven't ever really had cold feet issues skiing so I can't say much about whether overlap to cabrio for me suggested cabrio = warmer.

Also good info. FWIW, the Salomons are actually pretty easy to get in and out of for an overlap boot.

KR2 is a great comparison as the Lupo I bought is basically a KR with a walk mechanism.


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[jckstein]

I grew up racing and have been in an overlap boot my whole life. Just switched to a Dalbello Lupo 130 this year and granted i've only skied like 2 days in them, they're pretty sweet. Its a stiff boot, with a freshly fitted wrap liner so power transmission is spot on and it feels no weaker than any overlap boot ive been in. If you blindfolded me idk if id feel a difference though really.

[mikdes26]

I grew up racing and have been in an overlap boot my whole life. Just switched to a Dalbello Lupo 130 this year and granted i've only skied like 2 days in them, they're pretty sweet. Its a stiff boot, with a freshly fitted wrap liner so power transmission is spot on and it feels no weaker than any overlap boot ive been in. If you blindfolded me idk if id feel a difference though really.

Great info.

Do you feel the stiffness is more manageable due to the nature of the 3-piece construction?


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[iriponsnow]

I'm making the switch (again). I was in Full Tilts in 2012 thank to TGR's "show us your boots", but they were not enough to drive bigger skis. My main motivations for going to a 3 piece again is wanting to feel more "on top" of the ski instead of tippy/twitchy sensation from an overlap, added warmth & a progressive flex.

Note how tall the tongue is on my Lupo's in the center; the plug on the right is lifted.

[TexasGortex]

If the only thing wrong with your boots is that they are cold, buy Hottronics.

[zlatham]

I switched to Full Tilts and will never go back, easy on and off, warm, consistent flex, love em. The ease of on and off is huge. Give the 3piece a chance, you may be surprised-

[ZomblibulaX]

Been skiing krypton and kr2 pros for the better part of a decade, still run an atomic cs130 for my race boot. Going between boots does take a little getting used to, but it's two runs tops. I ran a flexon comp back in the 90's and the feel of the cabrio shell hasn't changed much. It may not be a great option for people with limited ROM in their ankles, as you need to get a little deeper into the cabrio boots to push the ski with the progressive flex. Works great for me, I have a ton of dorsiflexion and an overall softer flex lets me get over the front of the boot to push the ski around. Overall, the lateral stiffness is on par or better than the x max you're in now, so driving the ski won't be hard, just a little different.

I think the more upright stance works better for a lot of people on modern skis. I'm a Luddite, so I run a 2mm wedge under the heel and the largest forward lean chip to get where I want to be on my ten-year-old daily driver.

Intuitions are definitely warm, but they stay wet, so you might be ripping your liners out almost as much as before. Still worth it if you live where it's cold, IMO.

[Jonny Snow]

My Full Tilts are pretty comparable to a 130 or 140 flex, 97mm last race boot, but they are a custom setup.

[Skidog]

Why not just an intuition liner replace in the salomons?

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[creaky fossil]

ZomblibulaX's description of the cabrio/KR2 boot action is excellent.

On the upright stance, it truly messed with me at first and I hated it. But now I've adapted I find it better, more ROM from feet to hips.

[undertow2]

Why not just an intuition liner replace in the salomons?

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So I have the Salomon X Max 130 and worked with Intuition to pick the right liner for my boot. My boot was so low volume we could not get the liner packed/formed enough to create enough room for it and my foot to fit.

I like the boot so much I just wore my first pair out and have a new back-up ready to go. If I get word Sollie is dropping this boot I will be searching high and low for a couple of pairs of 28.5 X Max 130s.

I will add this and thanks to this board my toes were always getting cold in my boots. I was using the heaviest Pattigucci sock I could buy and no luck. I read a thread that discussed cold feet issues in their boots and many recommended going to a compression low volume sock. Since making the change only now on the absolute coldest of days do my toes get remotely cold.

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[stuckathuntermtn]

Switched from Agent 120's to Lupos. I need more time on them to really comment other than to say that I need to mod the ramp and forward lean because they were way to upright. Easily done in a non-permanent way. Just velcro tape the extra spoilers to the liner (easy to remove for skinning). Also added small heel lift and then a bontex pad to take up the extra volume (remove for full day out of bounds). The flex is nice if it's not too warm and they ski well. Seem to be very laterally stiff. Forward flex is stiff enough, I think. There is a little bit of extra "suspension" for big bumps.
I got them toward the end of last season, so not enough time to comment on them more.

[Gepeto]

^^^ thin (sock) for the win

Made the transition to cabrio 3yrs ago for the ease of entry and i'm knew to going up hill. Currently in the 16/17 LupoTI (kermit clogs/fugly) and will continue the experiment for 17/18.

The change was not an easy one for me. Take-aways; compression/rebound difference was the biggest adaptation. Compounded by the intuition power wrap that transfers input with -zero play. Tweaked the lean and ramp angle to get neutral. (13&+1.5). No matter how hard I dug, I couldn't get an answer as to the amount of splay that Dalbello uses. It feels like less than 1 to me.

Warmth? I've never been in anything warmer... -25F toasty

As suggested above; why not drop the intuition in the salomon's.

[Skidog]

for the record I am making a switch from overlap boots (cochise) to Dalbello Panterra 120 for inbounds. Will report back with how I like the 3 piece design. I used to love my flexons back in the day so I cant imagine it will be much worse.

[mikdes26]

Warmth? I've never been in anything warmer... -25F toasty

As suggested above; why not drop the intuition in the salomon's.

I’ve considered that as well as Hotronics. Maybe even one of the Intuition tongue liners.


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[grskier]

It depends on what you're trying to drive and how...

[jckstein]

Great info.

Do you feel the stiffness is more manageable due to the nature of the 3-piece construction?


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There are a few factors going into my boot experience this season. My last boot was a Scarpa that was too big, and I skied it on one intuition mold for like 5 seasons. Should have gotten rid of them long ago, but didnt get around to it. So me switching to the Lupo this year is also in combination with a 2 shell size decrease, a power wrap liner (only used tongue in the past), and DIN soles again. That said, what I can already tell I like about the 3-piece design is that the flex is consistent no matter what I do with my buckles. I feel like I can just snug the boot up nice and comfy tight and the tongue does the rest, whereas wrap boots were way more finicky in that sense. Still haven't had enough days on them to really speak confidently, but just initial feelings.

They say overlap boots are better for lateral power transmission (for racing) and 3-piece is more fore/aft power transmission, but it all just feels like 360 degrees of power transmission. Had no issues railing GS turns through shit snow the other day.

[skiing-in-jackson]

Ha! That's my exact switch Salomon x Max 120 w/ zipfit liner to a Dalbello Lupo w/ stock intuition liner. Just finishing up two perfect 130+ day seasons in them. It was my first three buckle boot. They were great.

A very smooth forward flex and easy to get into and out of. Warm. I don't hike in them too often, but for hiking the Headwall, I never put them into walk mode.

Mrs. SIJ skis in a Dalbelllo Krypton- she's had several pairs of them.

[mikdes26]

Ha! That's my exact switch Salomon x Max 120 w/ zipfit liner to a Dalbello Lupo w/ stock intuition liner. Just finishing up two perfect 130+ day seasons in them. It was my first three buckle boot. They were great.

A very smooth forward flex and easy to get into and out of. Warm. I don't hike in them too often, but for hiking the Headwall, I never put them into walk mode.

Mrs. SIJ skis in a Dalbelllo Krypton- she's had several pairs of them.

Did you also like the X Max? If so, and if you don’t mind, what do you find to be your pros and cons of it vs the Lupo?


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