Voile Supercharger (vs. ZeroG 108, Praxis BCs)?

[AKbruin]

I'm struggling to find reviews on the Supercharger. Anybody been on them? Any comparisons with the ZeroG 108s or Praxis Backcountries?

I'm looking for an all-around BC ski for winter tours with a waist between 107-112mm, 185cm length, and under 8 lbs. They should be good in deeper snow, but not powder-specific. I want confidence in variable and firm conditions. Also, I'm cheap and don't want to spend more than $500. So the plan is to wait until the spring and buy something on sale.

I've got some 8-year-old Praxis Backcountries that I'm looking to put to pasture later this season. They've served me very well. They've been fine in deep snow and adequate in firmer snow. My nits with them are that (1) they're a little heavy, (2) the 190cm is just a little too long, especially in the tail, for big days with deep kickturns, and (3) their hard snow performance is okay but not great. A fourth nit would be that they are spendy, especially if I got some with lightweight cores. I've also got some Blizzard ZeroG 95s, which I love but they are obviously limited in deeper snow.

I'm pretty sure the ZeroG 108s fits the bill, but I'm also interested in the Superchargers. The Volkl V-Werks BMT 109, DPS Wailer 112RP2, and G3 Synapse 109s also look good, but I doubt they'll go on sale for under $500. Ditto for Praxis BCs or Freerides with the UL Cores.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

Zero G 108's are significantly better than the Praxis on firm and significantly worse in powder. For strong skiers who see a lot of mixed conditions I'd say it's a good trade off. If you ski a lot of tighter trees with good snows, the Praxis are better as they are floatier/surfier. Never skied superchargers or the other skis mentioned.

[AKbruin]

Zero G 108's are significantly better than the Praxis on firm and significantly worse in powder. For strong skiers who see a lot of mixed conditions I'd say it's a good trade off. If you ski a lot of tighter trees with good snows, the Praxis are better as they are floatier/surfier. Never skied superchargers or the other skis mentioned.

Thanks. That's good to know. In my experience, it's easier to ski a firm-snow ski in powder than it is to ski a powder-ski in firm snow.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

Thanks. That's good to know. In my experience, it's easier to ski a firm-snow ski in powder than it is to ski a powder-ski in firm snow.

Exactly. I mean, the Blizzards are 100+ waisted skis with rocker. If you ski well, it's just fine in powder. Praxis BC's just happen to be particularly good powder skis for the width.

[LightRanger]

AKB, if you can find the BD Helio 105s on sale, may want to add them to your list as well. In the running for my next BC ski.

[meter-man]

I think those Voiles used to be called V8s. Not sure if the construction is the same or not, but reviews of the V8 may be helpful.

And....from your ask...I'm not sure when you'd pull out the new winter touring skis v. the ZeroG 95. When there's fresh snow? If so, why the emphasis on hard snow performance? Because, Sierra?

Further to the point: you will be hard-pressed to find a ski that is (1) good in deeper snow, and (2) confident in variable and firm conditions, AND (3) sub 8 pounds. Usually (2) requires some stiffness/weight or a skinny ski (like the 95) that makes up for it within less surface area. (1) and (3) may be in the same ski, but they usually suck in variable (2).

Anyway, you should also consider a Moment Bibby Tour in 184. I LOVE my 190s (I have the 14/15 Exit World, now the Bibby Tour), and was coming from the BC. I'd say it ticks your boxes (except it's right AT 8 pounds), but is significantly wider than you're looking for (116). It's probably also better in powder than you want. ETA: http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...rld-Ski-Review

[AKbruin]

AKB, if you can find the BD Helio 105s on sale, may want to add them to your list as well. In the running for my next BC ski.

Those look pretty nice for a one-quiver BC ski. They may be a little too close to my ZeroGs as the second part of a two-ski quiver though. Maybe. Curious about the wider Helio 116s though.

I think those Voiles used to be called V8s. Not sure if the construction is the same or not, but reviews of the V8 may be helpful.

And....from your ask...I'm not sure when you'd pull out the new winter touring skis v. the ZeroG 95. When there's fresh snow? If so, why the emphasis on hard snow performance? Because, Sierra?

Further to the point: you will be hard-pressed to find a ski that is (1) good in deeper snow, and (2) confident in variable and firm conditions, AND (3) sub 8 pounds. Usually (2) requires some stiffness/weight or a skinny ski (like the 95) that makes up for it within less surface area. (1) and (3) may be in the same ski, but they usually suck in variable (2).

Anyway, you should also consider a Moment Bibby Tour in 184. I LOVE my 190s (I have the 14/15 Exit World, now the Bibby Tour), and was coming from the BC. I'd say it ticks your boxes (except it's right AT 8 pounds), but is significantly wider than you're looking for (116). It's probably also better in powder than you want. ETA: http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...rld-Ski-Review

Right now I've got my 190cm Backcountries and 185cm ZeroG 95s, which I feel cover my bases pretty well. I decide which ski to use based on how deep the snow is and how long the tour is going to be. But sometimes you honestly don't know if you're going to get knee-deep powder or wind-blown ice or both, particularly in places like the Eastern Sierra or Shasta. In such conditions, I wouldn't want to drop in to a firm couloir with flappy powder skis, like, for instance, my Praxis Powders or my old Made'n AKs. I guess I don't want skis that are either noodles or are too fat. Whereas, I feel like my Backcountries are able enough in both conditions. If possible, I'd like a similar set up but with with a few small tweaks.

From friends who have them and online reviews, the ZeroG 108 seems to check all the boxes. The Supercharger looks promising, too. The V8s are still in existence, and they appear to be heavier and wider than the Superchargers.

I should take a harder look a Moments. To be honest, I've always hated their stupid square tips, which is a crappy reason to dismiss them. The Bibby Tours look pretty nice, although I'd be a little concerned about what looks like a lot tail rocker. I'll put it on my list of skis to look out for in spring sales.

[LightRanger]

Pretty sure the Supercharger is actually an entirely new ski.

ETA: I didn't see AKB's post directly above mine before posting it. Was responding to meter-dude.

[GeezerSteve]

I think those Voiles used to be called V8s.

No. Supercharger is a different ski, different dims, longer radius, Vector/Charger tail instead of V8/V6 twin tip, longer effective edge length. I love my Chargers and Vectors, prolly would love Superchargers but I'm not in the market.

[meter-man]

Those look pretty nice for a one-quiver BC ski. They may be a little too close to my ZeroGs as the second part of a two-ski quiver though. Maybe. Curious about the wider Helio 116s though.



Right now I've got my 190cm Backcountries and 185cm ZeroG 95s, which I feel cover my bases pretty well. I decide which ski to use based on how deep the snow is and how long the tour is going to be. But sometimes you honestly don't know if you're going to get knee-deep powder or wind-blown ice or both, particularly in places like the Eastern Sierra or Shasta. In such conditions, I wouldn't want to drop in to a firm couloir with flappy powder skis, like, for instance, my Praxis Powders or my old Made'n AKs. I guess I don't want skis that are either noodles or are too fat. Whereas, I feel like my Backcountries are able enough in both conditions. If possible, I'd like a similar set up but with with a few small tweaks.

From friends who have them and online reviews, the ZeroG 108 seems to check all the boxes. The Supercharger looks promising, too. The V8s are still in existence, and they appear to be heavier and wider than the Superchargers.

I should take a harder look a Moments. To be honest, I've always hated their stupid square tips, which is a crappy reason to dismiss them. The Bibby Tours look pretty nice, although I'd be a little concerned about what looks like a lot tail rocker. I'll put it on my list of skis to look out for in spring sales.

BT has lotsa tail rocker. Not a hard snow shape with flattish tails (like the Zero G 108). Square tips. Better in pow than the BCs. But probably not what you're asking for.

I just read Voile's description of the Supercharger. Good lord. Whatever PR jockey put out that description should be in charge of assessing voter fraud or inaugural rally sizes. The rocker profile looks fugly to me too, but that might just be the image used. http://www.voile.com/voile-superchar...2016-2017.html Anyway...happy hunting.

[AKbruin]

I just read Voile's description of the Supercharger. Good lord. Whatever PR jockey put out that description should be in charge of assessing voter fraud or inaugural rally sizes. The rocker profile looks fugly to me too, but that might just be the image used. http://www.voile.com/voile-superchar...2016-2017.html Anyway...happy hunting.

It does everything, for everyone, everywhere, in every condition, every time. What's wrong with that?

[meter-man]

It does everything, for everyone, everywhere, in every condition, every time. What's wrong with that?

I can't believe they didn't include the part about the RECCO/GPS/drone/iApp interface. Suckers.

[Tye 1on]

No. Supercharger is a different ski, different dims, longer radius, Vector/Charger tail instead of V8/V6 twin tip, longer effective edge length. I love my Chargers and Vectors, prolly would love Superchargers but I'm not in the market.

how do my Drifters fit in to that matrix compared to those? Skiing them tomorrow for the first time, pretty stoked.

[Tri-Ungulate]

You may already know this but the Supercharger was one of the top skis in this season's test at Backcountry Mag, amongst the Editor's choice selections FWIW. Unfortunately not a whole lot of info other than the testers meaningless blurbs, but hey. They also made the cut at Freeskier's test, as well. Not that I put a whole lotta stock in ski porn magazine reviews, but you gotta start somewhere.

[thewestisthefuture]

Haven't ridden the superchargers, but I'd like to. I ski the v6's and v8's and love them both. Never met a voile I didn't like. Pretty sturdy for the weight, durable, cheap, made in Utah.

[AKbruin]

You may already know this but the Supercharger was one of the top skis in this season's test at Backcountry Mag, amongst the Editor's choice selections FWIW. Unfortunately not a whole lot of info other than the testers meaningless blurbs, but hey. They also made the cut at Freeskier's test, as well. Not that I put a whole lotta stock in ski porn magazine reviews, but you gotta start somewhere.

Thanks. My take on such reviews and awards is that they don't necessarily establish that a ski is awesome, but they are pretty good evidence that a ski is not horrible, which is helpful to know.

Haven't ridden the superchargers, but I'd like to. I ski the v6's and v8's and love them both. Never met a voile I didn't like. Pretty sturdy for the weight, durable, cheap, made in Utah.

Good to hear. I don't know much about Voile skis, but I've always kind of imagined them to be more light-snow skis given their weight and origin. Any general info on how they generally perform in variable snow or Sierra mank?

[#######]

Thanks. My take on such reviews and awards is that they don't necessarily establish that a ski is awesome, but they are pretty good evidence that a ski is not horrible, which is helpful to know.

Good to hear. I don't know much about Voile skis, but I've always kind of imagined them to be more light-snow skis given their weight and origin. Any general info on how they generally perform in variable snow or Sierra mank?

Mag reviews (as you probably know) are a pay-to-play event, and six figure ad buys generally twist the arms of editors to keep that revenue stream flowing...

Voile uses the pretty much the same construction for all their skis. The light weight skis (Objective/WSP) use a full paulownia wood core with woven carbon/fiberglass on the top and bottom with cap construction. The Supercharger (V6/V8/UltraVector) has an aspen wood core with the above carbon/fiberglass on the bottom with regular glass on the top. This helps reduce the tinniness on hard snow w/out having to add damping materials and weight. It's very similar to the DPS Wailer 106 Tour1 in shape at half the price(half the engineering). DPS and Voile share the same core supplier in SLC too FYI.

And as long as you're not skiing tracked out manky crud at speed (+30mph) they should be just fine. It's more forgiving than the original Charger, but they should have named it the Dart because it's not built for hauling ass, just handles everything good-enough.

[Andyski]

AKB, if you can find the BD Helio 105s on sale, may want to add them to your list as well. In the running for my next BC ski.

On my list, too, but have seen multiple reviews/comments (Wildsnow comments, Backcountry skiing Canada, etc) saying it's not as "good" as the Zero G 108, BMT 109 or the FINDr 102 for various reasons, mostly saying it's not as predictable in less than perfect snow. Would love to hear from others.

Everyone is different, but the Superchargers have way too much camber for me. Too deep and too far down the ski.

[Cosmic Suncloud]

Mag reviews (as you probably know) are a pay-to-play event, and six figure ad buys generally twist the arms of editors to keep that revenue stream flowing...

that viole isn't one of the big guys buying big ads everywhere but still generally scores high is telling (in a good way).

[thewestisthefuture]

Thanks. My take on such reviews and awards is that they don't necessarily establish that a ski is awesome, but they are pretty good evidence that a ski is not horrible, which is helpful to know.



Good to hear. I don't know much about Voile skis, but I've always kind of imagined them to be more light-snow skis given their weight and origin. Any general info on how they generally perform in variable snow or Sierra mank?

Despite their naming conventions, voile doesn't make a 'charger' as it might be understood on tgr. They're just too light. I ski mine in a continental snowpack and have very little experience skiing on a maritime, but if you're looking for a wet snow crusher you might want something heavier. That said, for the weight they do pretty well in the variable snow I ski in NM. More of a 'maneuver through' than a 'charge through' ski for variable, though. Again, weight. I think that may be the case for most skis in the category you're looking at, unless those other companies have some magic I'm not aware of.

[Roberto]

Just to complicate your choices ever further....have you considered the Anima Freebird? Picked up a pair early season and feel they tick most of your boxes. Extremely light, nimble and playfull in powder/soft snow. They reward a forward, not an upright shitty newschool technique which I appreciate as well.....also absolutely rail groomers. Although they float like a true 115mm waisted ski they have the quickness of sticks with much more svelte dimensions; coming from a competitive skiercross background, this really surprised me. Only drawback I've found is that when absolutely charging they can be overpowered and can wash out on larger airs. That being said, I think any ski of similar weight would suffer similarly. At the end of the day I don't believe the materials technology is quite there for any ski to offer a stable stiff/damp ride in a truly lightweight offering. Really though, most manufacturers have found that "secret sauce" in dimensions, sidecut, rocker ect the last few years and you would likely be happy with any of the suggested skis.

[truax]

On my list, too, but have seen multiple reviews/comments (Wildsnow comments, Backcountry skiing Canada, etc) saying it's not as "good" as the Zero G 108, BMT 109 or the FINDr 102 for various reasons, mostly saying it's not as predictable in less than perfect snow. Would love to hear from others.

Everyone is different, but the Superchargers have way too much camber for me. Too deep and too far down the ski.

I owned/skied both the Helio 105 and the ZeroG 108. Both good skis but the zeroG wins hands down. And I'm a weight weenie so I really wanted to make the Helio work. Alas, I sold the Helio because the zeroG is basically everything that folks have raved about here and elsewhere. Predictable, stable, intuitive. Maybe not the most playful, but its consistency makes up for that as a daily driver for the BC. It's arguably one of the best touring skis in its category that I've had the pleasure of skiing.

The Helio tended to be a bit grabby in the tail even with a detune whereas the zeroG does exactly what you input with no such grab. Also, given the ~200g per ski difference, the Helio obviously did not hold true in variable as well as the zeroG. "Not as predictable in less than perfect snow" is exactly correct. It wasn't shitty by any means, just not as nice as the Blizzard on the down. Another Blizzard convert here.

[GeezerSteve]

Despite their naming conventions, voile doesn't make a 'charger' as it might be understood on tgr. They're just too light.

Well, they are touring skis ya know. For touring skis Voile Chargers are quite stable, have a pretty high speed limit and IME handle PNW marine snow very well. Sure, more ballast would make it more of a charger, but then it wouldn't be a touring ski. And this thread is about touring skis.

The rocker profile looks fugly to me too, but that might just be the image used..

That image is unfortunate. When decambered (which takes only a few lbs. of force) Voile tip rocker profile has a nice sweep that works great for a wide range of snow, e.g., pow, wet pow, unconsolidated mank, firm corn, sloppy afternoon summer corn.

[happytimefunbox]

I tour on a older voile drifter for all snow-not buy choice I just havent expanded my quiver. It has pretty much the same tail as the charger and does not appreciate laziness or a backseat driver. I have a friend that does pretty well on chargers inbounds but he is of the lighter variety. Voile construction is bomber, and their boards are super light

Charger is on my shortlist for my next set touring boards. Am I weird that I like last years topsheets?

[AKbruin]

Thanks, all. There's good information here. It sounds like both the ZeroG 108 and Supercharger are solid options.

Reberto- A friend has that ski, and it looks interesting. It might be a tad on the heavy side, but if I found some with a steep discount I'd be tempted.