Architecture

[highangle]

I am not arguing with any of that. If the entire system switches to metric then yep, no problem. If you are building a nuclear reactor (and yes I have) with tolerances in the hundredths of an inch that .125 mm of being off over the entire 4 foot width (121.92 cm) crushes all of the construction tolerances you might have. Now if the industry actually made a 16 mm plywood then yep no problem. It worked ok when the FWHA mandated that all highway projects be built to the metric system because there are a LOT more tolerances allowed in road and bridge building. If a bridge is a an inch off the only person that usually know is the GC.

8 hundredths error between bents is HUDGE on a bridge. Especially a bridge with battered piles supporting a vertical curve. Precast stringers or red iron, if your anchor bolts are out an inch, you are Officially fuckt. Hope you brought your checkbook.


Standard tolerance for dirtwork is a tenth of a foot or so, depending. I've set slope stakes to .01', but only for the $$.
The "finished grade" is usually set to .02', about 1/4 inch, or 6mm. Bridges are spec'd tight as a cat's ass. It's just numbers for a designer or cad driver, but 2/3 of a field crew's time is going to be spent checking what they did on the first third of a job like a bridge because of those extra significant figures.

To make this about the topic, a professional earns his keep. An architect should bring value to his client well beyond what he costs. Good ones can do it just with their names.

[teleee]

8 hundredths error between bents is HUDGE on a bridge. Especially a bridge with battered piles supporting a vertical curve. Precast stringers or red iron, if your anchor bolts are out an inch, you are Officially fuckt. Hope you brought your checkbook.


Standard tolerance for dirtwork is a tenth of a foot or so, depending. I've set slope stakes to .01', but only for the $$.
The "finished grade" is usually set to .02', about 1/4 inch, or 6mm. Bridges are spec'd tight as a cat's ass. It's just numbers for a designer or cad driver, but 2/3 of a field crew's time is going to be spent checking what they did on the first third of a job like a bridge because of those extra significant figures.

To make this about the topic, a professional earns his keep. An architect should bring value to his client well beyond what he costs. Good ones can do it just with their names.

Preaching to the choir my man. But if you think errors on bridges don't occur and get "field fixed" then we need to hang out and I will tell you some stories



The potential for millions and millions of impact on the error on this one for example was avoided by some creative engineering on a cocktail napkin of which I am not going to go into on the inter webs.

And I totally agree, every professional in the industry should be bringing far more value to the table than the fee they charge.

[::: :::]

My first task at my first job was redrawing offshore-outsourced as-builts for a hospital.
Not one of the lines intersected on a shared point in space.
Good times!

[Below Zero]

An architect should bring value to his client well beyond what he costs.

Architects get paid shit for the work for what they bring to the table. I don't agree with your statement. A professional should be paid fairly for the services provided, nothing more, nothing less.

[highangle]

Preaching to the choir my man. But if you think errors on bridges don't occur and get "field fixed" then we need to hang out and I will tell you some stories



The potential for millions and millions of impact on the error on this one for example was avoided by some creative engineering on a cocktail napkin of which I am not going to go into on the inter webs.

So what was the source of the error? Procedural? Personal? Instrumental? ? How did a surveyor manage that?

[teleee]

So what was the source of the error? Procedural? Personal? Instrumental? ? How did a surveyor manage that?

Wasn't the surveyors fault, it was definitely procedural and as is often the case with fast paced design build projects, a complete lack of communication.

[highangle]

Architects get paid shit for the work for what they bring to the table. I don't agree with your statement. A professional should be paid fairly for the services provided, nothing more, nothing less.

You say you bring value to the table far in excess of what you (can) charge, yet you don't agree with me?

It's not all market pressure. I've lost $$ on jobs because the ethics of the profession required I do buttloads of unbillable background research to straighten out someone else's fuckups from 60 years ago, not for me, but for the next damn surveyor and owner of some piece of land I could care less about otherwise. So your tears are falling on soggy ground, because maybe in a few years I can reap some expert witness billing, if someone decides to sue someone over some land there some day. Probably not though, since the 140 hours I put into a $3000 job will ultimately reduce the chance for contention over those land lines for the next 100 years. There's no way I can expect to be fairly paid for that one...

[::: :::]

in addition to being able to make good asethetic decisions, architects are supposed to know enough about all the trades & disciplines that go into making built projects work so that they can lead the teams it takes to do the work

comments in this thread suggest that folks have had the experience that not all architects are worth that level of leadership responsibility

[Bromontana]

[Tippster]

I just don't like that stacked box style. Nice enough to look at now and then, but fuck living in it.

[Bromontana]

I just don't like that stacked box style. Nice enough to look at now and then, but fuck living in it.

Maybe it's a knee jerk reaction to growing up near a million colonials.

[Tippster]

I actually spent 1/2 my growing years inn Europe where that style developed. We lived in a very modern multi-family building. Actually not hard to look at: https://www.google.com/maps/@48.0826...8i6656!6m1!1e1

That said I'd prefer to live in this: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.9639...7i13312!8i6656

[highangle]

Warm analog music ftw.

[BmillsSkier]

Suit, that's a gorgeous home but I'm not sure if you noticed that you left a giant rock in the foyer. Someone should've brought that to your attention.

[matoco]

in addition to being able to make good asethetic decisions, architects are supposed to know enough about all the trades & disciplines that go into making built projects work so that they can lead the teams it takes to do the work

comments in this thread suggest that folks have had the experience that not all architects are worth that level of leadership responsibility

I don't know if I agree. I think a GC or CM is generally brought in to lead the team it takes to actually perform the work (which is the subcontractors or a self perform GC). At least around me, my architects prefer to have as little communication directly with the trades as possible, and route all correspondence to them through the CM/GC.

And I would say many architects are really not all that familiar will all disciplines. They will generally have good understandings of work related to spec divisions 6-12. But anything else (steel, concrete, mechanical, electrical) can get over their head real quick, so hopefully you have some good engineers.

[The Suit]

Suit, that's a gorgeous home but I'm not sure if you noticed that you left a giant rock in the foyer. Someone should've brought that to your attention.

I tried to grab it when we left, but someone epoxied it to a bunch of rebar.

[MarcusBrody]

I tried to grab it when we left, but someone epoxied it to a bunch of rebar.

I agree. Absolutely gorgeous. One of my favorite houses I've seen. This "Jackson" must be quite the place.

You know, I live in MA and am about to move. It would be a bit of a commute, but still. Wait, when you say you took a bath on the resale, you do mean like 90%, right?

[BigDaddy]

I actually spent 1/2 my growing years inn Europe where that style developed. We lived in a very modern multi-family building. Actually not hard to look at: https://www.google.com/maps/@48.0826...8i6656!6m1!1e1

That said I'd prefer to live in this: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.9639...7i13312!8i6656

Very Bauhaus, but I agree with you. When I was renovating our place, I was planning to do a very modern "statement", but the more I thought about it, the less I liked it. I decided to try and replicate the original 1880 farmhouse style.

You can't tell what is the addition and what was original, so I feel I was successful. It's warm, inviting and functions perfectly for us... with no leaks.

That said, a couple of well known architects that I really like do some very contemporary, but warm homes:

Peter Bolin and one of his disciples, James Cutler. Cutler did Bill Gates house and Bolin ironically, does all the Apple stores. He also just did a home for a friend in Carmel, which is incredibly stunning. This is just the pool house: http://bcj.com/projects/halls-ridge-knoll-guest-house/


Gepeto, the counter is indeed concrete. I knew it wasn't Corian... I grew up in a house made out of that and even drove a car with the license plate "Corian". If fact, I will probably die from ingesting enough Corian dust to coat Magic Mt. with a foot of fine white powder. It is amazing stuff, though and you are right about the seams being invisible now!

[Bromontana]

wowsa the Bolin projects are special. But then again, so is the cabin you did! Living in/near the mountains I'm more inclined to an open floor plan and big windows to improve the interior feel (views of mtns > paintings of mtns reasoning).

[iceman]

Bolin's "Ledge House" (near the bottom of the right column) was built for a friend who still owns it. Pretty spectacular. Lots of stories about working with Bolin. Pretty prickly guy by all accounts.

[::: :::]

I don't know if I agree. I think a GC or CM is generally brought in to lead the team it takes to actually perform the work (which is the subcontractors or a self perform GC).

Of course, a GC/CM absolutely leads the team building the work and deserve to be paid for understanding all the sub-tasks. But I hope you'll concede that the GC's not going anywhere without an entire project manual and coordinated drawings. Someone's got to get that together, and it sure isn't the owner.

At least around me, my architects prefer to have as little communication directly with the trades as possible, and route all correspondence to them through the CM/GC.

It sounds like you work on larger projects. That's a function of liability, legal responsibility, and chain of command. You might notice that GCs on larger jobs push the responsibility of coordination downhill to their subs and basically do as little central oversight of subcontractor work as possible to get the job done. You don't know how many shop drawings I've received that haven't been reviewed by the CM for conflicts between subs. For instance, they just throw the steel shops over the wall, and let the architect figure out if the hvac fits in the floor openings provided. Just an example, not an indictment against all GCs.

On residential jobs, I will work with the framer & electrician directly. But on large jobs, I work with the GC's project manager or project engineer. But we talk with the subs directly too, doing mockups, reviewing installations and figuring out what to do with discovered conditions.

And I would say many architects are really not all that familiar will all disciplines. They will generally have good understandings of work related to spec divisions 6-12. But anything else (steel, concrete, mechanical, electrical) can get over their head real quick, so hopefully you have some good engineers.

I'm not going to pretend architects should know how to operate a grader. But I do think they need to understand reasonable parameters for unrestrained slopes so they can review the civil/landscape scope and know if anything's amiss. Same with HVAC, the architect should be on top of providing appropriate space for the systems to work and know where dampers are required.

All this applies to decent GCs. And the larger the job, the less likely the GC knows much about the sub's trade specifically.

[Gepeto]

I'm more inclined to an open floor plan and big windows to improve the interior feel.

This is nice to enjoy and makes lots of style points, but the energy loss, heat - cool - air quality.
Never mind total carbon foot print impact .

Quality of life

LEEDS; money/time/energy well spent or pissing it into the wind?

[flatlander#2]

So much of the dream house custom build stuff I fail to comprehend. So many of them in my neighborhood end up being either these grand lodges filled with 2 people and a bunch of shitty "mtny" decoration or odd layouts and seem to be losing bets the minute the keys are handed over.

There is a main floor master, two masters upstairs house that sits on a great lot, great trees, sun, very nice looking house, etc. Go to look at it and the upstairs are literally two 800sqft master bedrooms on either side of a study, put your 8 & 10yr old kids in there and they're lost. They were asking $2M, I think a widow bought it after sitting on market for over 2 years. Another let his wife build this godawful Greco Roman disaster, 10ksqft, columns, enough shitty faux painting to choke a horse, infinity pool to water the elk, 2 masters on one level, 2 one another level. The guy that built it owns the Dodge dealership in Golden on Colfax, tried to sell it for $10M or some horseshit amount, there was supposed to be an auction on it last year, he still lives there. Another built on 20 acres at the very back of their lot-10 feet from the line, neat house, great outside area, but their neighbor built a big fucker of a riding arena literally 10 feet on their side of the lot, see it from the kitchen. Huge fight, for sale now at $1.8. If you're an architect and what you do daily is design this stuff, that sucks honestly.

There are presently 2 on my street for sale at just under $3M, this is one
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/21...54889654_zpid/

[Bromontana]

This is nice to enjoy and makes lots of style points, but the energy loss, heat - cool - air quality.
Never mind total carbon foot print impact .

Quality of life

LEEDS; money/time/energy well spent or pissing it into the wind?

This topic is out of my element Gepeto, but this is what my dream involves... ~1,200sf house with regular ceiling height but large winders. A/c costs should be zero where I want to live (8k+). Don't need it custom or fully post modern design.. just want to be able to enjoy the surrounding environment even while inside. Those dramatic 30' ceilings in post modern castles have zero chance of intersecting with my life. I know next to nothing about the details of LEEDS but did pay extra for solar offsets as far back as college .

[BigDaddy]

Thanks Broman...

Bolin's "Ledge House" (near the bottom of the right column) was built for a friend who still owns it. Pretty spectacular. Lots of stories about working with Bolin. Pretty prickly guy by all accounts.

That's a great looking place, too. My friend liked Bolin and they worked pretty closely... designing it together. (He was an architect student, turned developer.)

It's a lot of ego to manage, no doubt. I don't know Bolin, but have met and dealt with Cutler. I hate him, but friends of mine had him do a place and loved him. Lid for every pot.


And yes, these dream homes are energy pigs, but if you have the money... Did a 33,000 square foot home for three a couple years ago. Insane and amazing.