2016 PRAXIS info, mounting and resource guide

[Shu Shu]

we will have no shortage of opinions 😀 but did you ask Keith this question?
To me it sounds like you are looking for either a Gpo or Q with a heavy core and veneer in 3 flex

[undertow2]

Shu Shu is spot on... GPO or Q would be a perfect match for your Freerides and it tics all of your boxes (build will determine dampness and flex)..

[adrenalated]

Agreed re: heavy core (dampness), veneer (to save weight), and #3 flex (softer, but not too soft).

GPO could work, but is still a little hooky in windfuck. I haven't skied the Q, on paper it seems like a good choice. RX, would be concerned it wouldn't be less demanding than the Freeride due to long radius, and it's not that loose/buttery. Backcountry is also a little hooky in windfuck and I don't think it floats much better than the Freeride. MVP maybe, but the mount is rather centered and I'm thinking you won't like the wide, full twin tail.

Agreed it's worth asking Keith's opinion.

[auvgeek]

+1. Haven't skied the Q, but it seems to check all the boxes. Heavy layup, veneer, and #3 or #3+ flex seem perfect.

I wouldn't worry too much about even a #4 Q being more demanding than a #4 Freeride mounted -1.5. That's a very traditional ski. Would you to step up to the 188 length, or go 182?

Dang, an enduro+carbon veneer RX in -10 mm looks better and better. Must resist.

[Muggydude]

The 187 GPO sounds like a good match. Heavy w/veneer and carbon, ~3.5 flex. Q trades off a little looseness for more resort crushing abilities if that's more important.

I was pretty happy with my map GPOs, I'd imagine veneer heavy carbon would make them much more ON3P-esque resort layup perfection

[I've seen black diamonds!]

Foggy, I'm thinking of selling my 187 GPO Veneers. Standard layup. Minty. Bought here and never mounted as I'm mostly using lighter touring gear these days. Drilled once for I forget. Can figure it out. $425. I keep almost listing them, then holding back since I love my 182 GPO UL's so much.

[Duffman]

Foggy, I'm thinking of selling my 187 GPO Veneers. Standard layup. Minty. Bought here and never mounted as I'm mostly using lighter touring gear these days. Drilled once for I forget. Can figure it out. $425. I keep almost listing them, then holding back since I love my 182 GPO UL's so much.

Out of curiosity do you know what the weight of that pair is?

[I've seen black diamonds!]

My bathroom scale says 9.2 lbs. For the pair.

[Duffman]

My bathroom scale says 9.2 lbs. For the pair.

Thanks.

[ScrewYou]

Trigger pulled. Skinny Q guinea pig.

[Shu Shu]

Right on!

[galibier_numero_un]

Trigger pulled. Skinny Q guinea pig.

You're making me doubt myself for going full width ;-)

... Thom

[Foggy_Goggles]

Ok, you assholes are probably gonna make Keith some money. A little more info:

Length - 184 Freeride is the shortest ski I've owned in over 30yrs. Anything with more rocker will be in the 188 area

Bindings - most likely inserted for Wardens and IONs. I ski IONs 90% of the time. I think they ski great and I'm too lazy to switch.

Terrain - I'm an anti quiver guys. I'm looking for an almost all the time ski. Think La Grave, CB, Colorado tours, Berthoud Pass, snowmobile skiing etc.

Flex - how about flex 3 regular? I'm not into the veneer due to $ (which I have none of currently) and my dampness concerns are relative to carbon which is a little rough in refreeze, chix heads, etc.

Style - my own. I'm super old school (think Buster Jr.) but utilize and enjoy skiing sideways in all types of conditions. I'm usually the first to the bottom (besides Lindal and avgreen of course) but feel I'm to opposite of charging. I like to keep in smooth, no falling.

Anyways, I'll email Keith. Hopefully I can give him some money and continue the conversation.

At this point, I'm leaning 188 Q flex 3 regular. Thanks

[ScrewYou]

You're making me doubt myself for going full width ;-)

... Thom

I would have gone with the regular width, enduro layup, however I already have way too much overlap over 110mm

I needed a daily driver for Big Sky next season. Kinda bugging out about flex a little, I picked #4 flex with the Heavy core. Maybe thinking of changing it to #3, or something in between the two. I want to use it as a playful charger, like an On3p wren 108(or vicik), but with the added Asym magic

I really wanted to get it right the first time, without having to bug Keith to change anything. Im still learning..

[auvgeek]

Terrain - I'm an anti quiver guys. I'm looking for an almost all the time ski. Think La Grave, CB, Colorado tours, Berthoud Pass, snowmobile skiing etc.

At this point, I'm leaning 188 Q flex 3 regular.

Hmm...this makes me change my mind a bit. I've skied a bit in CO (CB, Berthoud, etc) and a bit in France (Cham), and I would not get a 118 underfoot ski for an "almost all the time ski" in those places. I would get something in the 106-110 range, especially if you're biased towards touring. The Freerides may not float well, but that doesn't necessarily mean you need to go wider for more float.

I realize this is the Praxis thread, but you might consider the 184 ON3P Wren 108 in their tour layup. I would suggest the Zero G 108, as that's my choice for a OSQ for Cham and CO, but they're pretty stiff and light—may be too similar to your Freerides.

[spindrift]

OTOH, plenty of folks do use 115-ish skis as one ski quivers. If I lived in CO and had to have just one ski - oh the humanity... - the GPO and Q would both be at the top of my consideration list. I suppose it boils down to what you are biasing for.

The one comment I'd make about the Quixote is that the long edge is a decently long edge, If in doubt, I'd go shorter. Just my .02.

[Duffman]

OTOH, plenty of folks do use 115-ish skis as one ski quivers. If I lived in CO and had to have just one ski - oh the humanity... - the GPO and Q would both be at the top of my consideration list. I suppose it boils down to what you are biasing for.

The one comment I'd make about the Quixote is that the long edge is a decently long edge, If in doubt, I'd go shorter. Just my .02.

Spin,I know you have commented on this before, but after getting a decent amount of time on both, any updated comparo of the GPO vs Q. Also given the much longer effective edge, how does the Q do in tighter trees and more noodly terrain?

[auvgeek]

I needed a daily driver for Big Sky next season. Kinda bugging out about flex a little, I picked #4 flex with the Heavy core. Maybe thinking of changing it to #3, or something in between the two. I want to use it as a playful charger, like an On3p wren 108(or vicik), but with the added Asym magic

I really wanted to get it right the first time, without having to bug Keith to change anything. Im still learning..

I would stay with the #4 flex if you want it to be anywhere near a charger for someone your size. Go veneer or add carbon if you're concerned about the weight making them not playful enough. I ski the 184 Piste Jib (enduro core) in a #4 flex, and they are super fun—makes me want to throw 3s off every side hit. The tip isn't quite soft enough to nose-butter super easily, but I think any ski that butters really well is too soft in the tip/tail to be called a charger. NTTAWWT.

[ScrewYou]

I would stay with the #4 flex if you want it to be anywhere near a charger for someone your size. Go veneer or add carbon if you're concerned about the weight making them not playful enough. I ski the 184 Piste Jib (enduro core) in a #4 flex, and they are super fun—makes me want to throw 3s off every side hit. The tip isn't quite soft enough to nose-butter super easily, but I think any ski that butters really well is too soft in the tip/tail to be called a charger. NTTAWWT.

True. I guess with our weight difference, it could be fairly comparable. You on MAP#4, me on MA#4. I emailed Keith about it anyhow.

I definitely dont want a noodle ski that excels at butters, I have some shreditors for park and groomer zoomin'. Im looking for something to charge the steeps on the top of Lone Peak, and also rip the trees, but also can spin. Basically do it all.

The 187 length will be more like 185 straight tape, and it should be a bit more capable of spins and butters than a 186 vicik its replacing.

My only fear, is that my Heavy core Rx in #5 is stiffer than my 191 wrens, and ive only hand flexed a #4 in the enduro layup. Quite a big jump there, I find all MAP cores Ive flexed to have a rounder flex, although I've never skied them. Is a heavy #4 20% softer than my heavy #5?

Im trying to match the flex of the 2014 On3p vicik honestly. Which wasnt all that stiff, but plenty damp enough. I liked jibbing around on them, but I always wished for an ever so slightly more playful shape. I think the outside edges of the skinny Q will do me well.

[hoarhey]

Hmm...this makes me change my mind a bit. I've skied a bit in CO (CB, Berthoud, etc) and a bit in France (Cham), and I would not get a 118 underfoot ski for an "almost all the time ski" in those places. I would get something in the 106-110 range, especially if you're biased towards touring. The Freerides may not float well, but that doesn't necessarily mean you need to go wider for more float.

I realize this is the Praxis thread, but you might consider the 184 ON3P Wren 108 in their tour layup. I would suggest the Zero G 108, as that's my choice for a OSQ for Cham and CO, but they're pretty stiff and light—may be too similar to your Freerides.

I think Foggy lamented that the Freerides were demanding and he wants a ski that's easier to break loose into a skid, butter or slarve at the end of the turn...

GPO does that for me, and I'm sure the Q does as well...

skinnier versions might help if using them all of the time (especially mention of la grave), but there is an upcharge for going narrower...

I agree that the GPO rocker profile skis soft snow very well, even at narrower widths (111 vs 116), and by extension to 106 mm... (hopefully)

[undertow2]

True. I guess with our weight difference, it could be fairly comparable. You on MAP#4, me on MA#4. I emailed Keith about it anyhow.

I definitely dont want a noodle ski that excels at butters, I have some shreditors for park and groomer zoomin'. Im looking for something to charge the steeps on the top of Lone Peak, and also rip the trees, but also can spin. Basically do it all.

The 187 length will be more like 185 straight tape, and it should be a bit more capable of spins and butters than a 186 vicik its replacing.

My only fear, is that my Heavy core Rx in #5 is stiffer than my 191 wrens, and ive only hand flexed a #4 in the enduro layup. Quite a big jump there, I find all MAP cores Ive flexed to have a rounder flex, although I've never skied them. Is a heavy #4 20% softer than my heavy #5?

Im trying to match the flex of the 2014 On3p vicik honestly. Which wasnt all that stiff, but plenty damp enough. I liked jibbing around on them, but I always wished for an ever so slightly more playful shape. I think the outside edges of the skinny Q will do me well.

I am 6'4" and 205 lbs and no way would I drop below 4 flex... For what you describe I would think about dropping down to enduro core rather than heavy... If I was looking for a ballz to the wall all mountain charger I would do 4 flex with heavy core or what you did with your RX... Do not go 3... No at our size...

My 194 Qs are 4 flex with enduro core and no Fing way will I find its speed limit and it had zero issues with crud and mank...

[ScrewYou]

I am 6'4" and 205 lbs and no way would I drop below 4 flex... For what you describe I would think about dropping down to enduro core rather than heavy... If I was looking for a ballz to the wall all mountain charger I would do 4 flex with heavy core or what you did with your RX... Do not go 3... No at our size...

My 194 Qs are 4 flex with enduro core and no Fing way will I find its speed limit and it had zero issues with crud and mank...

I thought about that for a while, Im almost th same size as you (lil shorter). The only problem is I went 188, and I want it to rally in crud. It wont be seeing deep snow. If I had gone 194 regular width, that would be the way to make it for sure.

The 188 skinny measures closer to 185 straight tape, I assume, which is perfect for really messing around. I think the layup I already made will be good for stability in the shorter length. This is going to be such a fun ski. Vicik replacement.

What did you get from the sale Undertow?

[undertow2]

I think what you went with will do what you want it to... You were thinking 3 flex and def donr think that would be the way to go for what you want and your size...

No Praxis for me this year... Placed my order for a 189 108 Wren... So digging my 98s and they nailed the profile on that ski... Had to do the 108s with the red bird...

[ScrewYou]

Thanks for the input. I'll stay away from the #3 flex. Seems like what I already made will be moderately more playful than my Rx, being thinner, shorter and softer, and the shape of the outside edges. Yet still directional and stable enough to rip chunder.

[Muggydude]

Last day of the sale, if anyone needs a code PM me (;