Thoughts on intentionally over-canting to improve carving?

[Gaperious Basterd]

Hello,

What are the pros and cons to intentionally over-canting boots to tighten up turn arcs and keep edges engaged?

I had my Fischer Vacuum boots remolded (for other reasons), and the lateral alignment is screwed up. My turn arcs are no where near the same as they were prior to the re-mold. I believe the lateral adjustment held my knees way too inward.

I really want to avoid doing a third fit.

[Caucasian Asian]

Sore calf muscles. Sore knees.

[ill-advised strategy]

Keep skiing it and adjust. Any change like that feels like shit for a few days.

[Ted Striker]

Hello,

What are the pros and cons to intentionally over-canting boots to tighten up turn arcs and keep edges engaged?

The con is that you won't be able to disengage an edge when required (which usually manifests itself in a small stem/wedge at the transition to the next turn).

YetiMan is right.

[RShea]

Unless you are the type of skier that only carves on the inside edge (ie very little pressure on the outside edge- or A framing a turn) the over canting will make it harder to get back to neutral and transition onto the new edges will be more work and require higher edge angles to engage. I would think that a good remolding session, one of the things checked would be the plumb of the knee and cant if any added.

[Gaperious Basterd]

Well, now (post 2nd mold, and btw I had about 25 days with prior mold) transitioning from a left to right turn on a hill falling toward the right is virtually impossible to do with my ankles alone. I now must get enough speed going where I can jump-pivot to start the new carve.

This reinforced my realization the alignment was different, as I noticed the turn-arcs were much different (transitions pointing more downhill b/c of quicker downhill ski's inside edge release b/c of a more-inward position of the knee). Moreover, during skiing itself, I realized in the bottom part of the turns I really wasn't getting zipped across the hill so much as I am going forward.

To compensate, if I made a concerted effort to use the ankles, and also generate large angles, I got somewhat better results. However, even then I observed my tracks and it was more of the same-old.

Thanks for the responses, by the way. I think I will give it a couple more days before deciding whether or not to get another re-mold.

Its a tough call, too, on lateral alignment, because its a trade-off between railed turns on hard snow and then off-piste stability/ease.

[skiermarc127]

Absolutely do not do it. A shop accidentally over canted mine inward and I hated every minute of it, even on 27m radius skis. You'll never be able to get a comfortable turn in after you make the change.

[rod9301]

Go to a shop and have them plumb your knees to see where the vertical line from the center of the knee falls.should new pretty neutral.,ie close to the degree of the boot toe.

That will allow you to edge and release the edge,ie slide the ski.

This is a really big deal, take your time and do it right.
On other boots they have r
To cant it , ie grind the sole of the boot until the alignment is neutral.

Don't know about the vacuum molded boots, but I think they might have to do the same.

Whatever they do, at the end, have them plumb the boot, that's the only way to make sure it's neutral.


Sent from my SCH-I500 using TGR Forums

[flipsRscary]

I have some boots (dynafit titan) where the cant adjustment won't stay put unless you slap some tape over the screw. They will slowly move towards +maximum. It's not fun.

At some point it becomes nearly impossible to unhook the inside edges (both of them) no matter which way you turn. Yeah. It'll make your carve _much_ more solid. It'll also make it impossible to slide anything.

If you're into learning by experience, give it a try. However do put whatever tool it takes to put stuff back to neutral (usually an allen wrench) in your pocket when you head out.

I was really surprised at how much of an impact even a degree or two had. Max cant was downright dangerous. I remember looking at my tracks riding the lift back up, and neither inside edge had unhooked at all, all the way down. Not something I'd want to deal with anywhere with any sort of exposure.

If you want your edges to bit more, go for a sharper tune (say 1 degree base, 3 degree side), and make sure that you can really bend whatever ski you're on into any radius you might want. This usually means a fairly large radius ski that's soft enough for you and the size turns you're trying to make.

[gunniride]

All my skis have canted bindings. I put thin washers on the outside edge between the ski and the binding. Somehow, the maximum cant on boots still is less than vertical, let alone A-frame. Tried a friend's skis this week and it was blatantly apparent my inside edges were far exceeding the pressure on the outside edge.

So... after trying what you may with boots, bindings are still an option. Even the toes on my dynafits are canted....which makes a big difference on a 125mm waist-ed ski. (heel canting on d-fits not recommended)

[DeepHelmet]

You should PM Greg at Alpine Zone. I bet he could shed some light in this.