Cochise vs. PB&J for Lazy Skiing

[Skeeze]

I'm 5'11", ~145lbs (I know I need to eat), looking at a 182cm PB&J or 185cm Cochise. I'd be using them for inbounds corn/slush, the day or two after a storm, or days with <6" of snow. I ski at Mammoth, so a lot of open bowls where there might be moguls at the top and unconsolidated crud in the aprons.

I love the Lhasa Pows (the ideal BC ski for me), but since they're so nice and light with carbon, I've found they're a bit reactive for my tastes inbounds. Probably being so light has a lot to do with this--I get bounced around a lot compared to when I'm on Stockli SS Pros. I just don't have the strength and technique to constantly pressure the tips as is required.

The other somewhat similar ski I have is an old 186cm Stockli SS Pro (91mm underfoot). I love their dampness and how stable they feel when straightlining a runout, but they're a lot of work for me to ski. Total bottom feeders due to the stiffness and the tails don't like to release and slide at all (something I really like about the Lhasas/Praxis Pows), which makes the Stocklis a ton of work in the bumps.

As for the Cochise vs the PB&J, I know they're very different skis. I'm not too concerned about their relative powder performance--I know both will be good for what I want. I've also read both are fine on groomers, so that's not a big deal either.

Mainly, I'm looking for something that can hold an edge on a steep, firm entrance, "slarve" in bumps, crud and windbuff without hookiness, and then be damp enough to feel comfortable straightlining a bumpy runout. Lastly, if you have any input on the relative forgiveness of each ski to lazy skiing/getting backseat temporarily, that would be great. As much as I'd like to say I ski super aggressively every run, I know that isn't my style. Basically, I want a ski with a pretty high speed limit, but also not a speed floor.

I know the Cochise has metal which should make it damp, but is it a bit too wide for good edge hold, and is it too heavy to do jump turns in steep, tight places?

On the other hand, I've heard great things about the PB&J's dampness and straightlining ability despite being a mini-Bibby shape, but do you think it's still going to be considerably less damp than the Cochise? Also, will the shorter running length really make a noticeable difference at speed, or am I small enough that it shouldn't matter?

[sf]

Some info here
http://blistergearreview.com/gear-re...elafonte-182cm
And more about both skis around the blister site

[Skeeze]

Thanks for that, didn't think to look in the Belafonte review for a PB&J and Cochise comparison.

[klikboom]

I'm also a lazy skier and not overly heavy, check out the Bridge or Gotama?

[travel_to_ski]

The ON3P JMO is also worth checking out imo. 5'8 145 and I think it's a really fun groomer/bump ski. Really Quick edge to edge, stable at speed and very easy to ski. I've been on the 181.

[verbier61]

I am lazy and love the cochise. Never tried the other ski, though

[pappag]

Belafonte, even the 182, is not for a lazy skier. It's a ski that requires strong input and the ability to handle it in return.

[klikboom]

I wish I would've jumped on the JMO saturday, but the way I read it was basically a thinner Jeffrey which I didn't like. I didn't realize Cochise was a lazy skiers ski. It has metal and when I heard that I thought Mantra.

[pfluffenmeister]

^^^ yeah, i hope the cochise isn't too forgiving. most reviews i can find are for the 185.

i'm picking up the 193 cochise to fill the slot that skeeze mentioned in the OP: day-after storm-ski/crud-crusher.

i've read (and hope) that the 193 is "a different beast" (than the 185), but that statement wasn't qualified in any way.

anyone have time on both the 185 and 193 cochise?


PS skeeze: glad to see that someone is putting those SSs to good use.

[Bandit Man]

I wish I would've jumped on the JMO saturday, but the way I read it was basically a thinner Jeffrey which I didn't like. I didn't realize Cochise was a lazy skiers ski. It has metal and when I heard that I thought Mantra.

Cochise didn't ski like it had metal to me. It was stable (to a point), but also had a playful side to it...and it's way easier to ski than a Mantra.

[Mr. Toad]

I bought the Cochise for the same reasons you are considering them but sold them because they didn't really fit the quiver like I had hoped. I think a 100mm waist is best paired with a versatile pow ski like the Lhasas. You're going to get a lot of overlap with the Lhasas. If you didn't already have Lhasa's and wanted one ski, then Cochise would do it.

For hardpack, steeps, icy chutes, moguls, my Hardsides were much better than the Cochise. Have you considered the Bonafides? My wife loves them for these conditions.

[givethepigeye]

You might look at Nordica Girish - check blistergear for review

[54-46]

I bought the Cochise for the same reasons you are considering them but sold them because they didn't really fit the quiver like I had hoped. I think a 100mm waist is best paired with a versatile pow ski like the Lhasas. You're going to get a lot of overlap with the Lhasas. If you didn't already have Lhasa's and wanted one ski, then Cochise would do it.

For hardpack, steeps, icy chutes, moguls, my Hardsides were much better than the Cochise. Have you considered the Bonafides? My wife loves them for these conditions.

I have Bonafides and Caylors for my two ski quiver. Very pleased with both.

[GIJoePSA]

I don't see why keep on calling the cochise playful, to me it has too much metal and is boring in that it skied almost too easily through crud, although I prefer poppy skis so I guess I'm biased. However if mammoth crud is similar to tahoe crud in density it may be ideal.

[Skeeze]

I decided to go with some 184 Bibbys as the Moment sale was too good to pass up. They're probably a bit wider than I need, but they also seem like they'll be more fun than the Cochises--and way cheaper. Even used 185 Cochises go for crazy prices.

[TahoeJ]

Both good skis - you couldn't really go wrong with either the Bibby's or Cochise. Should be fine for what you're after.

[D(C)]

^
Nice! I just got 190 Bibbys and they're super versatile but will go as fast as you can push them. Groomer performance is awesome. I find I need to be driving the 190s all the time, but the 184s should be a bit friendlier.

I only have 1 day on my PB&Js and they're definitely not as inspiring as the Bibby, though much more playful.

[Ender]

I agree you should consider dropping from the Cochise (110 underfoot) to the Bonafide (98 underfoot) based on your description of what you are looking for. I use the 184 Mantra for this spot, works well. I tried the 187 Bonafide though and loved the shape, esp the slight rocker, was great in bumps and rails on hardpack.