Voile BC Vector waxless base

[GeezerSteve]

Don't count on that happening. 181 Charger BC is working fine for this Clyde The 180 VBC would be fun with light tele gear.

[Quadzilla]

Ive got a pair of 180 Vector BC's and my wife has a pair of 170 Vector BC's. We are both getting a fair number of days on them. Both are mounted free pivot Voile Tele bindings and both of us are on Scarpa T2 Eco's. For us they are perfect touring skis as the AVY danger is high right now and these skis are great for going out on lower angle tours and getting mileage on safer terrain. The skis are very capable and will ski any terrain too once you add skins. This is my second season on them and haven't found any terrain that they couldn't handle as easy as my other regular tele skis. My wife is a little more luke warm about them and thinks they are slower decending but likes not having to use skins all the time on rolling terrain. Anyway, I weigh 180 and ski 180's. A pretty good match and sure maybe a 190 would be a bit more floaty but maybe not as quick tree skiing. I think if anyone is carping about the size then just step up and get the Charger. I would guess that a 181 Charger wouldn't weight much more than a 190 Vector if there was one. So, Bottomline, they don't compare to any other old school waxless ski out there just plan easy to use and a great choice for someone who wants all around BC performance or a beginner who want to progress fast.

[AlpiNord]

Damn you Steve. I'm trying to not buy another pair of skis.(Mudfoot talked me into Keepers at the end of last season much to my benefit.)

My Atomic Chugaches and Silvrettas just can't climb efficiently over around 10 degrees and are fairly limited in what snow conditions they are fun. Basically zero float and with obstacles and thin snow is currently a limiting problem. The Chargers would be a perfect 'backyard' cruiser for turns. Within a mile or two from here, I could quickly get to a plethora of options. The extra float would increase turn options on even low angle pitches for a higher frequency of quick tours in small windows of opportunities. Then there's higher elevation tours.

A stated before this class of ski would be like owning a mountain bike for a convenient and broad range of touring options. For the topper, I'd really like a Dynafit set up with skis like the Chargers, but that can't happen for a while.

[Quadzilla]

Shot of a Vector BC skiing low angle powder. Notice the nice tip rise making the ski easy to turn and hard to get launched over the front. This is a capable ski........

[Quadzilla]

Sorry above pic taken today around Tahoe

[neck beard]

My Vector BC will become my mid-winter touring skis whether or not the tour calls for waxless. The waxless base does not affect powder turns in any noticeable way if I'm skiing right. It might get a bit grabby in some conditions if one gets too newschooler slarvy but keep your tips going downhill and you'll barely notice the fishscale pattern. Pattern definitely noticeable on hard pack, especially on hockey stops and windshield wiper turns, but how often do you see hardpack on a mid-winter tour?

Inspired by your findings I took my short skinny vector BC's out for a tour into the alpine yesterday, with a long cat-track then flats then gentle approach. I agree with what you said above. I was ascending on 10-20cm ski penetration dry wind effected snow and also a 2 hour old skin track on an access road. Fast and efficient. Zero speed sacrifice on the descent (though patterns really do suck on packed groomer in bounds, which I suffer on my return home).

If anything I was a little less efficient on the uptrack since I had to put down a perfect 15 degree skin track that weaved terrain like a snake charmer. But that alone was a good exercise. I also had my probe out nearly the whole time on the ascent and being on patterned bases I like to have a ski pole in each hand. Perhaps just an emotional rather than physical thing.

I was out for a 1000m climb and put skin on for the final 500m (cut short by wind anyway). Those skins felt nasty on dry soft snow after the patterns. Like velcro.

Annoyances included those short 60 foot high steep complicated steps in otherwise rolling terrain. When you have no choice other than a steep short track, you need skins. Also getting across a stream quickly without an in-run on a v-shaped bridge. I'd have liked skins on then. If that bridge failed at my tails, I'd have had nothing to hold me on what snow remained under my skis.

My mind wanders to how many tours I do where 110mm skis are the best choice, yet patterned bases really suit the approach....

[Shorty_J]

I've only taken a couple of short walks with my Vector BC's, and they kick and glide better than my Fischer waxless XC skis! I think it's a surface area thing, and I wonder if a fatter version would allow even steeper uptracks without sliding.

[Quadzilla]

I've only taken a couple of short walks with my Vector BC's, and they kick and glide better than my Fischer waxless XC skis! I think it's a surface area thing, and I wonder if a fatter version would allow even steeper uptracks without sliding.

Maybe, kinda depends on if Voile reduced length of pattern on the bigger ski compared to the Vector BC. There's always going to be a trade off, the more pattern, the more drag on the decent and the more vert you would need to get the ski to plane up. For a modest gain in climbing ability. IMO, you need to bring skins all the time unless it is a low angle dedicated tour or you like to spend alot of time making low angle switchbacks.

[AlpiNord]

Maybe, kinda depends on if Voile reduced length of pattern on the bigger ski compared to the Vector BC. There's always going to be a trade off, the more pattern, the more drag on the decent and the more vert you would need to get the ski to plane up. For a modest gain in climbing ability. IMO, you need to bring skins all the time unless it is a low angle dedicated tour or you like to spend alot of time making low angle switchbacks.

Another trade-off: Maybe with the wider Chargers and more float, you can ski thinner snow cover and stay above more obstacles for a longer season? (FWIW, I'm about the same weight as you Quadzilla). Steve, how much do you weigh?

Apples to bananas comparison, my FX94s are in the ballpark of the Vectors regarding rough sizing and are highly versatile and capable. My 189 Keepers are a little wider than the Chargers. It was night and day the low angle stuff I could make turns in and how high up in the snow I can ski on them versus the FX94s.

[Quadzilla]

Another trade-off: Maybe with the wider Chargers and more float, you can ski thinner snow cover and stay above more obstacles for a longer season? (FWIW, I'm about the same weight as you Quadzilla). Steve, how much do you weigh?

Apples to bananas comparison, my FX94s are in the ballpark of the Vectors regarding rough sizing and are highly versatile and capable. My 189 Keepers are a little wider than the Chargers. It was night and day the low angle stuff I could make turns in and how high up in the snow I can ski on them versus the FX94s.

I think that is true but for me I don't want to tear up a great set of skis and the extruded bases are not easy to repair. So I just just dedicated rock skis early/late season. A real advantage of fat skis reguardless of waxless or not is that they will plane up with less vert and wll turn easier at slow speeds making them fun on low angle soft snow.

[AlpiNord]

I didn't realize they were extruded bases. Good point on repairs. My Atomics appear to be sintered. Heck, since they are already set up with inserts for my Targas and Silvrettas, I guess CNCing a pattern into my Havoc bases is worth a shot.

[GeezerSteve]

I assume the entire length of the base is extruded, although the tips and tails seem to be holding wax okay so far.

Steve, how much do you weigh?

240 lbs. midwinter when I'm fit.

I've only taken a couple of short walks with my Vector BC's, and they kick and glide better than my Fischer waxless XC skis!

Kick better, sure. But glide better? Maybe in soft snow due to increased float, but on firm snow a double camber XC ski wins the glide contest by a country mile.

Maybe, kinda depends on if Voile reduced length of pattern on the bigger ski compared to the Vector BC.

VBC and CBC seem to have the same length fishscale zone.

There's always going to be a trade off, the more pattern, the more drag on the decent . . .

True, of course, but in pow there is virtually no fishscale drag AFAICT. I'll likely not be using my CBCs in anything but soft conditions. OTOH, Anita's 160 VBCs will likely see some use in spring, so we shall see.

For a modest gain in climbing ability. IMO, you need to bring skins all the time unless it is a low angle dedicated tour or you like to spend alot of time making low angle switchbacks.

Yes, definitely plan to pack skins for any tours other than meadow skips and logging road workouts.

Years ago I had a pair of 48mm waist fishscale skis with a pattern that was longer than the double camber pocket. I sanded down either end of the fishscale zone and they glided quite a bit better, and gripped as well as a properly kick-waxed XC ski. If you think your VBC pattern is too long you can shorten the pattern with a sander -- although once yo do there's no going back.

[Shorty_J]

Kick better, sure. But glide better? Maybe in soft snow due to increased float, but on firm snow a double camber XC ski wins the glide contest by a country mile.

Quite possibly true. I guess I'm considering the entire process more efficient, and I'm possibly gliding better because I'm getting a much better kick.

[sb]

I may have missed it b4 but it sounds to me ski surgery is coming around. Missing component is a patterned base material wide enough to be grafted into what ever ski?

BigSteve, you say your on the Vector BC and it does ok for you?

I am 205-210lbs add another 30lbs or more for gear/expendables.

BTW; had some good clean fun on my HOKs the other day b4 getting pneumonia. Sickest I have been in many years.

[GeezerSteve]

BigSteve, you say your on the Vector BC and it does ok for you?

Nope. I'm on 181 Charger BC w/Dynafits and so far they are working great for powder touring. GF is on Vector BC. Both worked great on 3 powder tours in the past 6 days. Fishscales came in really handy on all 3 tours.

[bbense]

WTF are they gonna upsize the vector bc to 190?

Clydes wanna know.

Me too... I'd buy a pair in a heartbeat.

[neck beard]

In fresh snow with air temps above freezing I am getting pretty bad balling on my Vector BC bases. It is only in snow conditions bad enough to also stick to the top sheets (a white textured top sheet at that!)

I have to be honest, balling on the fish scales really sucks. Thats is what skins are for on a moist fresh day!

I am hesitant to wax on the scales at all.



Other than that, god damn I can get some stuff done with the right terrain and snow on these skis. In their element, this gear is good. Even putting in long 15 degree rising traverses across 35 degree slopes on smashable crust over corn. It is surprising at times what snow does and does not lend itself to the scales.

The skier in me pukes, but as I tour I really wonder what better pattern could be used to offer both optimized grip and the ability to drift turns, side slip. Have patterned base patterns ever been specifically designed to enhance freeride performance?

This topic doesn't really belong on TGR, does it?

[AlpiNord]

In fresh snow with air temps above freezing I am getting pretty bad balling on my Vector BC bases. It is only in snow conditions bad enough to also stick to the top sheets (a white textured top sheet at that!)

I have to be honest, balling on the fish scales really sucks. Thats is what skins are for on a moist fresh day!

I am hesitant to wax on the scales at all......

Why not? You should also wax skins for the same issues. Bring along some paste, spray or liquid and try it.

[neck beard]

Why not? You should also wax skins for the same issues. Bring along some paste, spray or liquid and try it.

I was just narrowly thinking hot waxing, which I wanted to avoid on the scales as it fills them in a little. Thanks for jolting my brain.

The glooping happens when ice builds up in the divot of the pattern. So I guess a spray would work best before heading out.

[AlpiNord]

I was just narrowly thinking hot waxing, which I wanted to avoid on the scales as it fills them in a little. Thanks for jolting my brain.

The glooping happens when ice builds up in the divot of the pattern. So I guess a spray would work best before heading out.

You're welcome. Clean them first for better adhesion and after applying the wax, try using a heat gun (carefully). Generally, heating wax increases durability of the wax in sintered bases. I'm not sure that is as true with extruded bases/scales, but might be worth doing for a few times to see how things change over time.

[bbense]

I was just narrowly thinking hot waxing, which I wanted to avoid on the scales as it fills them in a little. Thanks for jolting my brain.

The glooping happens when ice builds up in the divot of the pattern. So I guess a spray would work best before heading out.

It's a bit of work, but the benefits are well worth it. Hot wax the base and brush the wax out with a brass brush. After waxing, use a paper bag/iron to suck up much of the
surface wax.

I'm not sure how much wax gets in the base since it's extruded, but the structure you build with the brush makes a big difference.

If you won't do that at the very minimum carry around some Zardoz Not-Wax. If the scales do start sticking, Zardoz will fix it pretty quickly. It doesn't last very long ( about a day ),
but it will get you back to the car.

[neck beard]

Been using other skis on recent sunny fresh, so no more glooping issues. It was a season transition thing. I do appreciate the good base care tips though.

Just returned from a relaxing volcano tour. 6000 feet ascent, for which I did not use skins once. I fish scaled the long low angle approach then a lot of the steeper peak climb all the way to the last 1200 feet where I had to boot pack. No skins. Snow was recently rained on corn, and higher corn that did not refreeze due to overnight due to fog.

After the volcano I took the opportunity to explore a mile or so along an undulating ridge that I had never been down. With thoughtful contouring and track setting I can cover so much terrain so fast on these skis. I think I keep saying that, but it keeps getting better.

Evening approach


They make good tent stakes for a shitty tent


Disappointing caldera and sulphur vent porn