The neoshell thread

[skiingsamurai]

Anyone here have experience with Flylow's neoshell line (Lab Coat and Compound Pant)? I'm wondering about the durability of Flylow's version of this fabric. Any delam or "bubbling" issues like with the Westcomb Shift?

I have the compound pants, probably 100 days on them now.
Im pretty unimpressed with neoshell. Its super breathable for how solid it feels, but the waterproofing is shit. Theyre downright sponge-like now. The durability is not what flylow made their name on. Ive got little cuts all over the place, the seam tape is falling off. These are nothing like my old chemical pants, which had 6 seasons on them.

Ive washed the neoshell pants as per the tag's instructions: hand wash with mild detergent, line dry (last night), and I was soaked in under 2 hours today with warm snowfall.
Im going to page through this thread for tips to restore the DWR, but I sadly cant recommend neoshell for waterproofing.

[Truenilbog]

I'm crossposting this here, as I posted this in another thread regarding Neoshell and its waterproofing. I accidentally posted from my unused user name:

https://www.discoverytrekking.com/pdfs/neoshell.pdf

Look on page 1 to the right under "technical highlights" and you will see where Polartec says that Neoshell starts out as a 10,000mm waterproof membrane, but after 20 washes, that is reduced to 5,000. Regardless the laundry directions on any brand's tag, Polartec states plainly that Neoshell degrades with washing. That degradation, from what I've heard, has to do with breakdown of the Neoshell, and it is permanent. 5000mm should still be basically waterproof, but I'm not sure if the degradation continues beyond 20 washing or what. And if you haven't washed it 20 times, and it's truly leaking, then I'm guessing it's defective. If I recall correctly, Polartec's Power Shield Pro apparently does the same thing, starting out at 5000mm and degrading to about half that in 20 washings.

I'd strongly suggest that if anyone decides to buy a Neoshell or Power Shield Pro garment, avoid washing it as long as possible. Even then, consider it a relatively short term investment.

[bodywhomper]

If I tomahawk often, is that like a spin cycle?

[bsavery]

I'm crossposting this here, as I posted this in another thread regarding Neoshell and its waterproofing. I accidentally posted from my unused user name:

https://www.discoverytrekking.com/pdfs/neoshell.pdf

Look on page 1 to the right under "technical highlights" and you will see where Polartec says that Neoshell starts out as a 10,000mm waterproof membrane, but after 20 washes, that is reduced to 5,000. Regardless the laundry directions on any brand's tag, Polartec states plainly that Neoshell degrades with washing. That degradation, from what I've heard, has to do with breakdown of the Neoshell, and it is permanent. 5000mm should still be basically waterproof, but I'm not sure if the degradation continues beyond 20 washing or what. And if you haven't washed it 20 times, and it's truly leaking, then I'm guessing it's defective. If I recall correctly, Polartec's Power Shield Pro apparently does the same thing, starting out at 5000mm and degrading to about half that in 20 washings.

I'd strongly suggest that if anyone decides to buy a Neoshell or Power Shield Pro garment, avoid washing it as long as possible. Even then, consider it a relatively short term investment.

Wow, that's kinda shitty. Does gore-tex or event behave the same?

[mfa81]

Wow, that's kinda shitty. Does gore-tex or event behave the same?

I can speak for goretex and no, it doesn't behave the same

[verbier61]

Any membrane loses waterproof after washing. Dunno whether neoshell is so bad compared to pro shell or active shell, but they all are spoiled by washing. And yes, any wash is a sign of fear ;-)

[neonorchid]

According to Marmot, Only use a Powdered Detergent and Never use Fabric Softeners.

[GeezerSteve]

Any membrane loses waterproof after washing.

This ^ ^ ^ Cross-posting from the other thread, my original Neoshell shell started to delam before my only wash (tech wash/cold/gentle/hang dry). I have rinsed, but not washed, the warranty replacement. No delam so far.

[Dr_Moreau]

Could any Neoshell pant you know of work as a hiking pant in the mountains? How is the feel of the inner surface in for exampel the Rab neo stretch, is it that clammy rubbery feel that many(all?) hardshells has or could it be worn next to skin?

[robgoose]

just pulled the trigger on a marmot nabu... will report back

[XXX-er]

I got my Nabu late last year love it currently my favorite piece any time anywhere, I don't understand why it was on a discount rack

[jerlane]

Hey, xxx-ER, how does the Nabu fit? I've read reviews that say it good for tall and skinny folks. I've also heard the neck can be tight when zipped up. Does the hood fit ok over a helmet?

[XXX-er]

I'm 5'8" short AZN man /broad shoulders/ narrow waist/ skinny/ 39-40 in sleeve/ 24 BMI

I tried on SM and MED and got the small which is normal for me, often sleeves are not long enough for me and a jacket will fit like a tent but Nabu has sleeves that are plenty long with a slim fit thru the body so yeah its probably cut for skinny fuckers

neck feels ok , I happen to be wearing it so I tried an xc bike helmet under the hood and it fits but the thing is that this neo fabric is stretchy with a soft feel and actualy you could easily wear it under a helmet so I tried that and it works

Skinny fit maybe why they were all on the sale rack for 100$ off right before X-mas

[jerlane]

Thanks for the info, XXX-ER. I went ahead and ordered one from STP. It was only $150 with the 40% off code. Hard to beat. Lots of good reviews. I can't wait to check it out.

[robgoose]

nice to know I'm not the only one who waited on that 40% off

[XXX-er]

They are 375 list up here and I paid 275 so you got a pretty good deal there

[exxun]

I just try to buy a new Jacket on Discount Wanted to try NeoShell, as i want something more breathable and stretchy than my Peak Performance Heli Alpine Jacket made from Gore Pro. Got a Mountain Equipment Centurion Shell yesterday in Size Large ( it said Euro Size XL), which fits nearly the same as my Heli Jacket in Size L. As i always wear a back protector it gets a bit narrow when i put a mid layer under it. Would go for the XL but is not available for the same price. I could get a Westcomb Apoc in XL but it seems to be much bigger than the Mountain Equipment stuff. I am 6'1'' and weight about 190 lbs, with big arms and shoulders. Mostly have problems on the chest and arm when layering. Can anybody say something about the fit of the apoc ? I think a fit like Haglöfs Vassi would be nice.

[mfa81]

btw stp now have some RAB neoshell in case someone is looking to buy one

[robgoose]

my large nabu just got delivered: me 6'2" , a trim 200lbs. Fits well, with just enough room for a puffy underneath. Now I just need it to snow. I like

[Andeh]

I picked up a pair of Rab Neo Guide jackets for myself and the girl, for like 25% off at Backcountry with my AAC discount.

I did an informal breathability test comparing them to my BD Dawn Patrol LT Schoeller softshell and Arc'teryx Theta SV GoreTex Pro bibs by holding the fabric over my mouth, blowing, and comparing the resistance. Unsurprisingly, the Gore Pro was like holding a plastic bag over my mouth (no discernable permeability), some was possible on the Neoshell with effort, and a good amount was possible on the Schoeller.

Build quality and features of the Rab seems pretty good but not perfect. The cuffs seem well thought out, and would function well both under or over gloves. They have a little bit of gauntlet on the outside of the hands for better coverage, which I believe wasn't in the Stretch Neo, and I believe they also increased the size of the velcro. The chest napoleon pockets are large but not bellowed, and high enough not to interfere with waist belts. Interior pockets seem mid-sized (1 is stretchy mesh for phone, 1 zippered shell), but not big enough for skins. Hood is big and easily helmet compatible, and has an actual wire brim to keep it formed how you want. They added pit zips since the Stretch Neo, which may be nice for skinning, but do seem to reduce the underarm comfort a bit. I doubt I'll use those much, since on warmer days I'll be wearing Schoeller. Draw strings on the hood seem OK but aren't as awesome as Patagonia ones with the pincher embedded in fabric. The main zipper is reversed (tongue on right, zip on left), British style, which is kind of annoying. The collar sticks up nice and high, which should offer good face coverage when the wind is blowing. I got a size medium (5'10", 150 lbs), which seems to be a good, trim, non-bulky fit. I can easily wear an R1 fleece under it; Atom LT puffy under works but definitely fills out the shell. However, it's also trim enough that I can pull on the Atom overtop (for lunch or skin changeover). Sleeve length seems plenty long although I'm no gorilla: I can lift my arms above my head with cuffs cinched and not have the jacket body ride up. I wish the green color was a little bit brighter, but that's kind of trivial. All said, I'm pretty stoked to have a shell for high precip days that won't turn me into a sweaty mess... assuming we ever get some snow.