2012 Montana Conditions, Stoke and Whatev Thread

[yeahman]

Yeahman - which trail did you go into the Bob at and what was your round trip mileage ? Want to go there and a day hike seems most doable for me now.

We went in from the Straight Creek Trailhead at the Benchmark access west of Augusta and hiked to the Patrol Mountain Fire Lookout. My GPS said 12.6 miles round trip. The sign at the TH says 5 miles to the lookout but it is widely known as being 6+. Great day hike! Bring flipflops to ford Straight Creek, even this late in the season it is pretty wide and there was no boulder hop that we could find.

[MontuckyFried]

Love late summer floats. Light crowds, good hopper fishing, and awesome weather.

It really has been an awesome late summer! Perfect weather and a relatively low fire season was a nice bonus! At least where I was, I didn't deal with any smoke this year while I was there. Great pic, swimmy! Just beautiful. That captures it better than I was able to.

[skiSilent_skiDeep]

Big Sky Grizzlies do not fuck around-
"As the bear lunged the only thing Rudy could do was punch the bear in hopes of slowing it down. Unfortunately it did not, and after the first punch the Grizzly was on top of Rudy. The Grizzly left a large scratch down his right chest, bit his arms, legs, and to top it all off, gave him as what Rudy describes as the most disgusting french kiss of his life before biting down and tearing off his lower jaw."
https://www.gofundme.com/f/rudy-noor...ttack-survivor
probably shouldve stuck with the cougs over at Brothel Bikes

[yeahman]

Vibes to the man and I hope for his recovery.

Bear spray, instantly accessible, may very well have saved him from this attack. Certainly the firearm proved useless as it so often does in these situations. Either that or it proves fatal to the bear, which also sucks. It certainly will almost never work to "scare away" a bear, as the writer says was the man's intention. Guns are useful for killing and nothing else.

But anyway it sucks this happened.

[Bunion 2020]

It really has been an awesome summer!

for all the reasons your cited. Even all the rain up to 7/2 was welcome. As usual Swimmy, you R killin it.

[Yonder_River]

Gnarly. My family in the area says griz activity is at an all-time high, particularly in the backcountry behind the rainbow ranch. Not sure where this took place, but says south of big sky. Yep, bear spray on the ready and more people with you the better.

[swimmy]

It really has been an awesome late summer! Perfect weather and a relatively low fire season was a nice bonus! At least where I was, I didn't deal with any smoke this year while I was there. Great pic, swimmy! Just beautiful. That captures it better than I was able to.

Yeah, this summer has been awesome.

Bear spray, instantly accessible, may very well have saved him from this attack.

I don't have a lot of experience with firearms so for me, bear spray is a no-brainer. But I'm always surprised when talking to folks who just don't trust bear spray and simply rely on a pistol.

Vibes to that dude and his family. My wife works at the hospital and heard this guy was all kinds of fucked up. Completely lost his jaw.

As usual Swimmy, you R killin it.

Gotta get it in now. We just sold our house and bought a new one. Exciting times but the next 6 weeks or so will be a total pain in the ass.

[Ted26]

Grizzly was chasing my friends dog on a narrow trail a couple years ago and the pair came running back towards us. We stepped aside both sprayed half a can of bear spray in the grizzlies face at point blank range as it ran by. Bear didn’t even blink and kept running after the dog. My opinion of bear spray was diminished after that

[yeahman]

My opinion of firearms is diminished after a guy misses and gets his jaw ripped off. Or a griz takes multiple bullets and keeps coming. Or a guy accidentally shoots his friend instead of the bear, as just happened recently.

Also, hard to say if that bear you sprayed was not affected, just because he ran past you. But one thing we know is that none of this is foolproof, and if you even find yourself in this situation, you've made serious errors by not being aware of your surroundings and not making enough noise to alert a bear before you were within a few yards. (Or bringing a dog with you into griz country.)

[RootSkier]

While the wind is not like Lone Peak, Lost Trail had to re-route one of their new chairs due to wind problems a few years back.

New chair at LT? What is this craziness you speak of? Chair 4 was added in 2001 (and I was the first paying customer to ride it...they didn't even give me a sticker). I am not aware that they ever moved that chair, either....pretty sure they did not. That said, it does get damn windy at the top of Chair 4 sometimes but that almost always leads to the good kind of wind-affected snow.

[swimmy]

I'm also conflicted with dogs in griz country...

[Ted26]

I'm also conflicted with dogs in griz country...

Certainly isn’t my preference after that experience. Ironically the dog probably saved us by drawing the bears attention. We had coincidentally stopped for a break probably only 20-30 yards from where it must’ve been resting right next to the trail. I presume the dog (small blue healer) may have walked right up to it and perhaps woken it up. Had it not it probably would’ve been us instead. In my experience grizzlies are weird and unpredictable in their behaviors. More often than not they could care less about people but sometimes they do and if that’s the case bear spray probably isn’t going to do much

[MontuckyFried]

I'm also conflicted with dogs in griz country...

To me, the reward outweighed the risk. Our dogs NEEDED the intense exercise that only charging around the mountains could provide. However, I'd always outfit them with bear bells so they made enough jingly racket that we never encountered a single bear, despite being in prime bear country and hiking almost daily, year round. There WAS one time when one of my normally completely fearless dogs caught scent of something that spooked it enough to put its head down, paused, and slowly reared back. I took heed and we backed right on out of there from whence we came. I didn't see anything, but trusted the pup's instinct on that one. Especially being Fall when they're fattening up in prep for their slumber.

Seems that most encounters occur when people catch the bears by surprise, being hunters primarily who of course kinda require some stealth to achieve their goals. ESPECIALLY bow hunters. Those guys seem to have tons of bear encounters.

Harry has a good bear story when he encountered one at point blank range on Long Peak. Eff that.

[Pope Shredaddictine]

Certainly isn’t my preference after that experience. Ironically the dog probably saved us by drawing the bears attention. We had coincidentally stopped for a break probably only 20-30 yards from where it must’ve been resting right next to the trail. I presume the dog (small blue healer) may have walked right up to it and perhaps woken it up. Had it not it probably would’ve been us instead. In my experience grizzlies are weird and unpredictable in their behaviors. More often than not they could care less about people but sometimes they do and if that’s the case bear spray probably isn’t going to do much

Not sure what brand of spray you had, or how old it was- but both of those factors can make your bear spray less effective when it comes time to use it.

Some of of the off-brand types carry a less-potent punch, and any bear spray should be replaced after the 2-year mark.

And of course, the one brand I always praise time and time again:

https://www.counterassault.com/bear-spray/

Stay safe out there, and always keep your prayers close that nature will allow you to return home safely.

[MontuckyFried]

Not sure what brand of spray you had, or how old it was- but both of those factors can make your bear spray less effective when it comes time to use it.

Some of of the off-brand types carry a less-potent punch, and any bear spray should be replaced after the 2-year mark.

And of course, the one brand I always praise time and time again:

https://www.counterassault.com/bear-spray/

Stay safe out there, and always keep your prayers close that nature will allow you to return home safely.

Good points! Counter Assault is what I carried too cuz I heard the best things about it. Definitely trusted it more than a gun for all the aforementioned reasons. But yeah, check your expiration dates and swap out every couple years.

[singlesline]

My understanding is that bears don't generally view adult humans as food. They view them as potential threats that may need to be neutralized. But they don't want to waste calories fighting if they don't have to (bluff charges, giving up after you play dead, etc.).

I think getting sprayed tells their mind "the cost of this fight just went up a lot, maybe I should back down" and changes the fight or flight calculus.

But when they are chasing a loose dog, they are in predator mode, not fight or flight. They see a big calorie reward and they've already committed to making the effort. Running through a stream of spray may well not be enough to deter them from pressing on through the hunt. Especially since who knows how much of a dose they actually got running past it--works best when they are running straight into the cloud.

But what do I know? I've never actually sprayed a bear and I guess I'm so big and loud that I can spend a full week camping in the Alaskan wilderness without even seeing a single one.

[singlesline]

Good points! Counter Assault is what I carried too cuz I heard the best things about it. Definitely trusted it more than a gun for all the aforementioned reasons. But yeah, check your expiration dates and swap out every couple years.

And consider a second can in the bottom of your pack. A counter assault employee told me that's what they keep their recently expired cans for, older cans can be target practice--they should be fine well after the expiration and you can weigh the can to test for propellant leakage, but they aren't really that expensive and you kinda want to be sure they will work.

Saw a story the other day about someone who used up their spray when they were about 3 days deep into the Bob. The spray did its job, but they were pretty nervous for the 2 or 3 days of hiking back to the trailhead with nothing.

[Harry]

In my experience grizzlies are weird and unpredictable in their behaviors.

I disagree 100 percent. My experience, and I’ve got a lot, is that grizzlies behavior is very predictable. Watch the hair on their hump, watch their ears, watch their eyes, spend enough time around them and you will pickup what I’m talking about.

Harry has a good bear story when he encountered one at point blank range on Long Peak. Eff that.

Lone Peak Jong. Right on the ski area. Yeah, that was too close. 5 feet maybe. His breath was horrible.
That was my closest. I probably have had 100+ encounters of under 50 feet.











Full story: when I moved to Missoula in the early 80s I fell in with the Earth First crowd that was active at that time. Howie Woulk introduced me to Doug Peacock, both being military veterans we hit it off. He confided to me his favorite place in Yellowstone to watch grizzlies. A remote valley in the park with no trails that is surprisingly close to Big Sky. It was kind of a gathering place for them, on any given day I would see 40-50 grizzlies. It was open sagebrush country so you could see a long way. I never once saw any humans in there. They were aware of my presence, but never once did I ever feel threatened. Occasionally one would be curious and wander over to observe me. Usually they stayed 100 or so feet away, but sometimes they came as close as 20 feet. One that was very close sat and watched me for almost an hour from 20 feet away then it curled up and took a two hour nap. I did not move. He farted several times during his nap. The next time I saw Doug I told him about that encounter and I thought he was going to cry.

Full disclosure: I always had bear spray and a 44 magnum with me. Although in my early years just the gun as bear spray did not come around until the mid to late 80s if I remember correctly.

Hands down the best grizzly protection while hiking is to bring a Bluetooth speaker clipped to your pack. You won’t see any bears. I’m serious. As I got older I realized someday my luck would run out, so I bought a little clip on speaker. Never seen a grizzly since.

More notes: the active ingredient in bear spray does not go bad, but the propellant does. After 2 years you run the risk of it coming out more like silly string and only going 5 feet. But directly into a bears face would still work. I always bought a new can every year and used the old one for practice.



https://www.altaonline.com/books/non...-edward-abbey/

[Bunion 2020]

Quality stories and experiences H. Thanks.

Have you given any thought to different types of music to either employ or avoid for their affect on a bruins disposition?
I could see a lot of Grizz being Swifties but maybe I am wrong. I also think some rap might piss them off while Nordic Death Metal could either incite a charge or cause them to run in terror.

[Harry]

I can’t let you get all the credit for the 80s & 90s stoke. I’ve got to make my memory bank contribution too.

I was going to give that other maggot shit for the off leash blue healer in grizz country, then I remembered the time I was walking my yellow lab off leash and she went into the woods after a large moving creature. Was it a grizzly? Sasquatch? No, it was Bunion.

[swimmy]

[GravityDT]

So am I hearing correct that Big Sky for the Closing Weekend of the Bike Park - they've closed most of the terrain for the running event??

[yeahman]

So am I hearing correct that Big Sky for the Closing Weekend of the Bike Park - they've closed most of the terrain for the running event??

Depends on what you like to ride I guess. Gambler, Happy Hooves, Joker Lips, Snake Charmer will all be open, plus others. Here's the rundown:

[Whiteroom_Guardian]

People on the internet get all bent out of shape about music in the wilderness, and yeah if I'm on leverich or sourdough or something, duh no music.

Now solo deep in the souther gallatins, or over on Lionhead or something where the chances of seeing another person are super super low......yeah I got a mini speaker with a Spring '77 or Spring '90 show going.

[homemadesalsa]

People on the internet get all bent out of shape about music in the wilderness, and yeah if I'm on leverich or sourdough or something, duh no music.

Now solo deep in the souther gallatins, or over on Lionhead or something where the chances of seeing another person are super super low......yeah I got a mini speaker with a Spring '77 or Spring '90 show going.

We did a Lionhead lap on Monday and only saw 3 horse gals at the top of the Dry Fork. An old Dead show might have been preferable to how many times I called out "Hey bear!"

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