an experiment in body redesign - based on methods from the 4-Hour Body

[bmg97]

Bullshit to light or bullshit to heavy ?

[bmg97]

The picture on the left is Tim at 146 lbs and the one on the right is him at 177lbs. He is 5'9". I don't ever want to get to that size.

146 ?? Shit, at that weight he might have to stay home on windy days or walk the other way when angry girl scouts come around.

I honestly think he looks better at 177. For me I would never walk around at anything less than 175. Right now since I'm in lazy mode and my back has been killing me I'm walking around at 185 to 198. When I get back to normal I'm about 180 to 185. If I actually hit the gym then my goal would be to stay around 180 / 185 and get cut. I think I ski better at a heavier weight too cause I go faster

[woodstocksez]

5 ' 8" you should be at 170 minimum.

Bullshit.

I call bullshit on that too. I'm 6', I lift some and have got some muscle going on (more than on advres - no offense, just a point of comparison), and 170 is a good weight for me (I target about 175 now); definitely not a minimum.

I was surprised by the 138.8, too - seems really light. But you clearly look better and, as others have said, you'll probably look and feel even better when you add some more muscle.

[The AD]

I was surprised by the 138.8, too - seems really light. But you clearly look better

Yeah, at under 140 he's clearly not underweight. I think that's a perfectly good weight for someone that height. Yeah, a few pounds of muscle wouldn't hurt, but there's no reason he needs to be substantially heavier.

[XXX-er]

5 ' 8" you should be at 170 minimum. Shit, I'm 5'9" and weigh about 190 and look just a bit portly Why not bulk up to burn the fat ? You're gonna lean out from it anyway.

http://www.nhlbisupport.com/bmi/

which except for reasons of heavy muscle building as in a real athelete ... would put you overweight

sure I would agree that the BMI is NOT a good indicator in atheletes who have built a lot of muscle OR old people who have lost muscle mass but for literaly hundreds of millions of north americans it is a very good indicator of a healthy or unhealthy weight

How old are you cuz I just wana point out you almost never meet old or older people who are trying to bulk up cuz they all want/need to LOSE weight

ever seen old pro foot ball players who used to bulk up back in their 20's ...30 yrs later they are just bald & fat

[wicked_sick]

Forget that shit. All respect to Tim, but Mark Rippetoe has forgotten more about lifting than he will ever know. His programming is simple, effective and proven.

This book has to be the most comprehensive and entertaining book on the subject. Lots of helpful pictures and diagrams as well. I'm amazed at how many people I see at the gym performing squats and deadlifts with way too much weight and poor form. I bought starting strength and have been doing one of the programs in it for about a month now. I've made some pretty impressive (to me) strength gains, but I am still the same size. I cannot get enough food. I'm hungry an hour after every meal no matter what I eat. (and there's no way in hell I'd be able to drink a gallon of milk a day) My goal is the opposite of gameface's, by the way.

Good job, Man.

[bmg97]

http://www.nhlbisupport.com/bmi/

which except for reasons of heavy muscle building as in a real athelete ... would put you overweight

sure I would agree that the BMI is NOT a good indicator in atheletes who have built a lot of muscle OR old people who have lost muscle mass but for literaly hundreds of millions of north americans it is a very good indicator of a healthy or unhealthy weight

How old are you cuz I just wana point out you almost never meet old or older people who are trying to bulk up cuz they all want/need to LOSE weight

ever seen old pro foot ball players who used to bulk up back in their 20's ...30 yrs later they are just bald & fat

Well according to the BMI I'm slightly overweight at 26.6. I'm 33 years old too. I've dropped down to 170 before and been told I look sickly. Maybe I just carry the weight better than most ? I'll probably have a heart attack soon

[zion zig zag]

This book has to be the most comprehensive and entertaining book on the subject. Lots of helpful pictures and diagrams as well. I'm amazed at how many people I see at the gym performing squats and deadlifts with way too much weight and poor form. I bought starting strength and have been doing one of the programs in it for about a month now. I've made some pretty impressive (to me) strength gains, but I am still the same size. I cannot get enough food. I'm hungry an hour after every meal no matter what I eat. (and there's no way in hell I'd be able to drink a gallon of milk a day) My goal is the opposite of gameface's, by the way.

Good job, Man.

My goal was to bulk up as well so l did the starting strength/gomad for a month and I added strength to every lift. I also put on 14 pounds. In my opinion the milk was the difference as I've never been able to gain, you should really try it.

I guess since gameface manned up and posted pics ill post some before shots tomorrow.

Ps. After 2 months of eating constantly plus drinking whole milk all of the time its killing me to try and shed the excess fat now, I feel like I'm starving all of the time.

[XXX-er]

33 eh?

Yeah so get back to me in 20-30 yrs on your health & weight ,update me on if you got wattles & chicken neck going on ,a gut out front , how is your health and has doc told you losing some weight would be good ?

WHO told you you look sickly at a normal weight AND were they also overweight cuz take a look at the TV , you can see overweight people in the commercials because ... being overweight is the norm in America

It would also be a good time to point out you live in a country with HIGH rates of obesity & early onset diabetes where you DON't have universal healthcare

[advres]

WHO told you you look sickly at a normal weight AND were they also overweight cuz take a look at the TV , you can see overweight people in the commercials because ... being overweight is the norm in America

No shit. I got in a pissing match on Digg last week about this article right here.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/ar...-disturb-.html

The second picture, not the one with the tits is of a fat woman. Not disgustingly obese but a fat woman. They actually wrote "As Terri says: ‘The rest of my body is quite slim. Yet throughout my teens my boobs went up a couple of cup sizes every year." There is nothing about that 21 y/o chick that is "slim". She is over weight, fuck here thighs are probably the size of my waist. The fact people see her as slim is the scary part.

My before pics and weight would still put me in normal for BMI and I thought I was carrying too much fat. Some people (society) may think it is acceptable, but I had enough, which brought me to today.

[bmg97]

Never been told I have to lose any weight by my doctors but they did say I need to quit smoking. When I lose weight most of it comes out of my face so I guess I looked manorexic. I was acually told this by my girlfriend who likes me with some meat on me bones and no she's not fat or close to it. Ill tell you that in 20 to 30 years it's not going to matter if you're skinny or fat now. I know lots of people that were skinny when they were younger and now walk around looking like they're pregnant. Honestly it was just my opinion about his weight. For me 170 to 180 is normal on me causeof my body structure. I've been at that weight since I was in 11th grade.

[wicked_sick]

The picture on the left is Tim at 146 lbs and the one on the right is him at 177lbs. He is 5'9". I don't ever want to get to that size.

I'm always amazed at how lifting weights seems to get rid of chest hair.


z zig zag... Drinking large amounts of milk has severe gastric effects for me. I can get away with eating a lot of cottage cheese though, which I may try if i can find a low sodium option.

[XXX-er]

You read the interent forums and the pattern is ALWAYS the same ,the young guys ALWAYS want to bulk up and the old guys ALWAYS want to lose weight ,I just havent figured out exactly the age where the flip flop happens but I think its some time in the 30's or 40's ,about the time due to career/family/life comitment in general instead of bulked up they realize ... they are overweight

being 20lbs over weight is like carrying around a couple of full 1 gallon (4 liters up here ) milk jugs , pick them up feel the weight ,now carry them around everywhere for 1 day and see how much extra work you do ,how much they slow you down...then tell me its still a good thing ?

AND you probably havent been told to lose weight cuz the "this is your last chance to make lifestyle changes OR die prematurely ... likely from heart failure" conversation doesnt come till around 50

quiting smoking is a no brainer

[shroom]

I can get away with eating a lot of cottage cheese though, which I may try if i can find a low sodium option.

I took a nutrition class last year taught by the spokesman for the ASN, and she stated multiple times that the new nutritional guidelines will not include a recommendation for sodium intake, as the level of intake only effects those hypersensitive to it, which accounted for <1% of the population.

I have no idea if that applies to you, just relaying info.

[Platinum Pete]

When it comes to protein supplementation what is preferred? Rice, soy, whey, egg, other protein powders?

[PowTron]

BMI = Bullshit Mass Index

According to BMI, I am severely obese. I am 5'10", and 205lbs. I have 10% Body Fat.

Explain to me how that is severely obese?

[The AD]

According to BMI, I am severely obese. I am 5'10", and 205lbs. I have 10% Body Fat.

Then obviously you aren't sedentary and the "BMI > 25 is obese" does not apply to you. This is specifically stated in all the official BMI descriptions (e.g. see http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/publ...tm#limitations.

Just because it doesn't apply to everyone doesn't make it bullshit. Some smokers live to 100, but that doesn't make it a healthy habit.

[PowTron]

Then obviously you aren't sedentary and the "BMI > 25 is obese" does not apply to you. This is specifically stated in all the official BMI descriptions (e.g. see http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/publ...tm#limitations.

Just because it doesn't apply to everyone doesn't make it bullshit. Some smokers live to 100, but that doesn't make it a healthy habit.

Well then, I stand corrected....

[doughboyshredder]

That second chic is a cow.

[zion zig zag]

So, the first photo of me is before paleo or gomad/starting strength. Second photo is one month after gomad/starting strength and about one month of paleo after that.

36 years old, 6'0", 170lbs:


182lbs:


Even though there is 12 pounds difference I can barely see it.

[hafilax]

ZZZ, it could all be in your legs. I saw a before and after on the crossfit.com message board of a guy who did starting strength and his biggest gains were in the legs. I know that most of the muscle I've put on is in the legs and shoulders from doing crossfit.

Gameface, first of all way to go! Deciding to become healthier was probably the biggest step. That said, I'm not so sure about the supplements other than the fish oil and maybe the vitamin D. There's very little evidence that most supplements do much at all. If you're not lifting weights to build muscle then the protein shakes are probably not needed either. I would guess that you're getting plenty from the beans and meat. If you start a strength training program then start taking the protein shakes within a 1/2hr to an hour of your hardest workout. It will replenish the glycogen and flood the body with the stuff needed for muscle repair. It will do you more good at that time than in the morning. Body repair happens in your sleep, not during the day.

My advice for a training plan would be to lift weights to get stronger. If you don't like the changes to your body then modify the program. I do crossfit to (hopefully) get fit. I could care less what I look like. I want to be able to enjoy my time in the outdoors so being able to ski longer and in more comfort or hike with a heavy pack or bag peaks are my goals. You need concrete goals in order to come up with a training plan. It's hard to choose how your body will look so focus on some strength goals and go from there.

Someone asked about protein supplements. I believe that whey isolate is generally considered to be a good choice. It's a good protein and there is very little left of what most find to be bad with dairy.

[XXX-er]

BMI = Bullshit Mass Index

According to BMI, I am severely obese. I am 5'10", and 205lbs. I have 10% Body Fat.

Explain to me how that is severely obese?

the site explains that the BMI doesnt deal well with muscle eitehr too much in an athelete who has too much muscle OR too little as in old person who loses muscle mass but for literaly hundreds of millions of AVERAGE sedentary overeating north americans the BMI works very well

a real athelete would have to do the dunk tank weighing in water thing or however the fuck that works and then having to expel ALL air from the lungs and holding their breath under water ,ability to do that can give different results depend ing on how the athelete does it

ZZZ started at NORMAL in the BMI so it's hard to see the changes but he looks to have gained muscle/leaned in his upper back,viens are sticking out and the arms are more defined ,ribs are showing more but yeah its very suttle,changes would be much more evident in a person in the overweight range losing weight and dropping into the normal range ,for me going from 5'8" 175lb to 155lb the changes were very evident and my pants started falling off my ass unless i used a belt


still think about the health aspects ,a doc in alberta told me he gets a 25% higher fee for service from our universal healthcare system for operating on people with a BMI >30 ,buddy said " run the figures and if its >30 ... yee haw we got a bimmer!" ,the 2 docs i was talking to said obese people are more work ,more likely to be there cuz of their failure to deal with their lifes style ,more likely to die on the table , more stress for the doc...and more money

[advres]

ZZZ... personally I like the build in the before pic (no homo). If I could get to that build I would be ecstatic, but I'm a weak as fuck, no muscle, fatty so that will take some time. haha.

[Mazderati]

When I do start lifting (by the end of the month), any suggestions on duration, routine and time of day?

Tim suggests once every 3 days at first and the more you work out extending rest time between workouts. Then he suggests one set to failure of no more than 80-120 seconds with a 5 second up and 5 second down cadence (8-12 reps) of 2-10 exercises per workout. At least 3 minutes of rest between exercises.

Don't know about the failure part as I would need a workout partner and my schedule is fucked and I don't want to have to rely on someone else for perfect timing. Not sure I am sold on this way as I have never been a lifter and I NEVER want to have a frame like the after pictures.

But, doing this routine he gained 34 lbs in 28 days and reduced his body fat over 4%. But he also took a shit ton of supplements and did not do his "Slow-carb" diet that I am on. And no anabolic steroids.





Remember, this is an experiment and Tim suggests, what he thinks, gives the biggest gains with the least amount of work. So, take it with a grain of salt if you don't believe in his routine and I'm willing to listen to anyone on advice on this.

Nice work.

Some of the more popular beginner weight lifting routines will put you in the gym three times a week doing some sort of back, chest, and legs split. Training to failure doesn't necessarily require a training partner. In fact, if you get access to a power rack, there are few lifts you can't perform to failure on your own.

I don't know who Tim is and I've never heard of him. He may know things no one else does, be blessed with a herculean genetic makeup, and have rainbows shooting out of his ass, but in close to ten years of being involved in lifting, I've never seen anyone gain 34 pounds of muscle, which is what it sounds like he's implying, in four weeks. That company includes bodybuilders, powerlifters, and strong men, and in some cases, copious amounts of Vitamin S. Gaining 34 pounds in 28 days is doable. Gaining 34 pounds of muscle in 28 days is not. Though, I'll qualify that by saying there are no absolutes.

Good luck.

[advres]

Nice work.

Some of the more popular beginner weight lifting routines will put you in the gym three times a week doing some sort of back, chest, and legs split. Training to failure doesn't necessarily require a training partner. In fact, if you get access to a power rack, there are few lifts you can't perform to failure on your own.

I don't know who Tim is and I've never heard of him. He may know things no one else does, be blessed with a herculean genetic makeup, and have rainbows shooting out of his ass, but in close to ten years of being involved in lifting, I've never seen anyone gain 34 pounds of muscle, which is what it sounds like he's implying, in four weeks. That company includes bodybuilders, powerlifters, and strong men, and in some cases, copious amounts of Vitamin S. Gaining 34 pounds in 28 days is doable. Gaining 34 pounds of muscle in 28 days is not. Though, I'll qualify that by saying there are no absolutes.

Good luck.

First of all, thanks! And also know that this is not my goal. Just something he talks about in his book. He put on 34 pounds of muscle and reduced his body fat from 16.72% to 12.23%

Ever heard of the "Colorado Experiment"? Casey Viator gained 63.21 pounds of muscle and a loss of 17.93 of fat in 28 days with a total fluctuation of 45.28 lbs in total body weight. These are extremes, but it is possible and not unheard of. His workout routine is described in the 4HB and it is fucking stupid crazy.