Obama to Cancel US Manned Space Program Cancelled - NASA to focus on Global Warming

[jfost]

dear jfrost, I am NOT a republican.
...

I can see that, my rant was more aimed at REDSCARE apologists like xxx who jumped on this bandwagon because it was something else to "pin" on Obama. All of a sudden, space exploration became the talking point of "Democratic" failure. Anyway... I know a few NSF budgeteers who have long held beliefs that NASA was wasting money in space, but supported their earth-based pursuits. I guess that you really can't have one without the other, and the govt funding "carrot" is probably essential to the rapid pace of innovation that we have come to know.

I think that the "nuke" powered craft will be a tough sell in the wake of things like Challenger & Atlantis. The public won't want to have nuclear things exploding over their heads, whether or not the risk is actual.

I do hope we don't skewer the jobs of some of our brightest minds, it would be funny to see scientists immigrate to India or China - maybe it is already happening?!?

[summit]

Dear PNWBrit and Natty Dread, this is a thread about SPACE EXPLORATION so, yes, there is going to be some small amounts of science and technology in it. Since you clearly can't or won't understand such concepts, feel free to get back to grabbing each other's chest hair while you 69 each other.

there are other nucular spaceship designs that can be even stranger (exploding bombs and riding the blast wave is one of them).

Yea... Project Orion was feasible... in the you could build a bridge from San Fransisco to Toyko type of way... you could do it but is it necessary? You only get so many bombs. It was more feasible launching it on the ground but how fucking insane is that? If you don't launch it on the ground, it means you have to use chemical rockets to get everything into orbit and that's some HEAVY shit. Plus, if nuclear reactors are a political problem, hundreds of fission bombs are DEFINITELY a problem. Nevertheless, testing was done for low ablative materials with some good progress before it was abandoned. Still... rather outlandish.

NTR's made much more sense at the time (and still do). Launch a reactor into space, fuel it with reaction mass from the moon or a captured comet, fly around to wherever and refuel wherever you can find water. Plus, they are a lot simpler design.

NERs are reaction mass limited, but with SI of up to 30,000, you can carry a lot of effective fuel.

[Rubicon]

Yeah the reaction from the right seemed a little out of place. Can someone like Rubicon answer this?

I can truly understand both Summit and AD's point of view.

My POV aligns perfectly with Summit's on this issue. So, what exactly is the question?

[jfost]

The manned space program is one of the most important(if least urgent) things we as a people can do. If it ever becomes urgent, it will be too late.

This is just retarded.

My POV aligns perfectly with Summit's on this issue. So, what exactly is the question?

yeah, yeah, me too! I hate Obama too...

[montanaskier]

I can't begin to fathom the difficulty all presidents face. When you go to cut programs...that program is the life of somebody..some group...someone whose life depends on it so to speak. It is impossible to make everyone happy.

[ArmadaBC]

serious lulz

17.2 billion, that NASA's budget for the whole fucking year. Does anyone in their right mind somehow think that 17.2 billion dollars is gonna make any fucking difference in the grand scheme of things. Fuck this year's deficit alone is 1.7 trillion, so explain to me how killing shit like NASA makes any real difference.

But hey lets do the easy thing like cut small programs that actually do shit rather than actually attempt to deal with the shit that actually causes 1.7 trillion dollar deficits. This isn't a republican/democrat issue its the 1,000,000th example of how American gov't totally fails on anything that isn't instant gratification.

As an aside did I miss the memo where we all decided that making loot was the singular and ultimate purpose of humanity ?

[PNWbrit]

Dear PNWBrit and Natty Dread, this is a thread about SPACE EXPLORATION so, yes, there is going to be some small amounts of science and technology in it. Since you clearly can't or won't understand such concepts,

Dear Buzz Lightyear,



Sorry.

Yours etc.

PNW.

feel free to get back to grabbing each other's chest hair while you 69 each other.

Oooooooh! Natty dear did you hear what she said about us?

What a nasty bitch!

[ProHoHater]

You know the real reason why Obama is shutting this down the manned program is because of the aliens. He is probably being controled by the alien overlords or even an alien walkin himself. Either way, if true, and we are surrounded by a much more advance alien species that is running the show, manned space travel might just be a mute point, and Obama know this. An advance alien species ability to travel interdensionally or through spacetime in ways we havent dreamed of yet, might just make our febil efforts in a manned program seem pointless.

My theory, Im pretty sure the aliens are pissed of since we shot that rocket into the moon in a feeble attempt to show them that we could fight back if necessary. What a stupid idea. I mean they must be so far up Obama's ass after that, they were probably annally probing him while they we were like "and you know what, no more trips to space, biatch".

[gh444]

It is clear now that President Obama represents a HUGE step backward for all of human civilization.

Dont worry, the private market is the solution to all gov't.

Its obvious, Obama saw Avatar and realized sending men into space was a bad idea for intergallactic humanities. Michael Cameron is to blame, not Obama.

'

James Cameron?

The manned space program is one of the most important(if least urgent) things we as a people can do. If it ever becomes urgent, it will be too late.

This is just retarded.

Dont worry, the private market is the solution to all gov't.

[highangle]

serious lulz

17.2 billion, that NASA's budget for the whole fucking year. Does anyone in their right mind somehow think that 17.2 billion dollars is gonna make any fucking difference in the grand scheme of things. Fuck this year's deficit alone is 1.7 trillion, so explain to me how killing shit like NASA makes any real difference.

i would think it's one item in a bunch

smaller government, remember?

and i think it's the cuts before the taxes go up...

[Lane Meyer]

This article has more information on this topic.

NASA to get $6 billion for Commercial Space Flight

NASA to Get $6 Billion for Commercial Space Flight
January 28, 2010 by Mark Whittington

Vague Answers on Exploration Fuels Concern

In response to stories that the Obama administration is planning to cancel the return to the Moon program, the White House arranged from a conference call with the Orlando Sentinel and Florida Today to clarify its plans for NASA.

The Constellation program to return astronauts to the Moon and destinations to Mars is still dead. In its place if a nearly $6 billion investment to create commercially run space craft to take astronauts to and from low-Earth orbit. In addition, a technology program will be initiated, some infrastructure improvements to the Kennedy Space Center will be funded, and the International Space Station will be extended to at least 2020. The average increase to the NASA budget will be $1.3 billion per year.

NASA officials were vaguer about reported plans for a heavy lift launch vehicle rumored to be in development to send astronauts beyond low-Earth orbit. According to the Orlando Sentinel, "However, none of the officials would say how much money or what plans existed for creating a NASA spaceship capable of launching humans beyond the space station. When asked, officials repeatedly dodged the question of what plans the administration had for a heavy-lift rocket."

The heavy lift launcher is described as a "Saturn V class vehicle." Administration and NASA officials did not elaborate about what that meant. The Saturn V was capable to launching 262,000 pounds of payload into low-Earth orbit. By contrast the planned Ares V, now slated for cancellation, would have launched 327,000 to 410,000 pounds into LEO.

Administration and NASA officials also refused to state how the new heavy lift launcher would fit into a new exploration program. Left unanswered were questions about when astronauts would voyage beyond low-Earth orbit and where they would go. Previous indications had suggested that under the Obama plan, America would bypass the Moon and Mars in favor of Earth approaching asteroids, the Moons of Mars, and points in empty space.

Administration officials claim that the new space program would create 1,700 jobs at the Kennedy Space Center and 5,000 jobs across the country. That would partly offset the anticipated loss of 7,000 jobs at KSC and many more across the country as a result of the end of the shuttle program.

While the Obama administration is confident that Congress and the public would view the space plan favorably once the details are revealed in the FY2011 budget request for NASA this Monday, some are already expressing skepticism. Florida Today quotes Florida Republican Bill Posey as saying, "My biggest fear is that this amounts to a slow death of our nation's human space flight program, a retreat from America's decades of leadership in space, ending the economic advantages that our space program has brought to the U.S., and ceding space to the Russians, Chinese and others. The president's U-turn on this issue is both bizarre and misguided."

The vague answers that the Obama administration is giving about any exploration program that might replace the one being canceled are bound to fuel those concerns. The abandonment of the Moon is seen by many as short sighted and driven more by a desire to save money than to conduct a serious exploration program. While voyages to asteroids and other places in deep space have some merit, the Moon is the closest place to Earth where humans can live long term. The Moon represents a venue filled with both scientific and commercial opportunities. Other destinations could only be visited briefly and have relatively limited value.

It is possible that the administration will have more detailed answers in the following week as the budget request is presented. In any event, the proposal is going to be chewed over and debated in Congress in the months to come.

edit - note that this article is more like a blog post than an article....

[Arty50]

Dear KQ, nobody gives a fuck that you are a lawyer, and you don't contribute much of anything to these forums was my point. You are the one arguing about "wrong forum," remember?

Correction, YOU don't give a fuck. I know a lot of us that like having her around. You on the other hand...we've wanted you gone for a long time.

KQ: beloved, long time member who's brought more good will to this community than any of your rambling overly aggressive diatribes filled with personal attacks (ie. this thread); look no further than her excellent culinary threads.

Summit: retard from CO; see comment above about rampant douchbaggery.

Now back to your regularly schedule discussion about manned space exploration.

I think David Cross put it best, "Yay! We're sending a man to the moon! Fuck yeah! Wait, didn't we do that already? Oh well, who cares. We're going to the moon! Hey, I have an idea. How about we put a man in an apartment."

As for mining the moon (much less other planets) and bringing the materials back. Do you have any idea how much that will cost? Paying for material extraction on this planet is costly enough. What are we going to run out of here that we'll have to get from there? Many building materials can be reused, recycled, or regenerated. And science/society has proven especially adept at finding new sources of materials that are more efficient and/or plentiful than their predecessors.

[P_McPoser]

I am totally going to get my MS and PHD in MOON MINING ENGINEERING! Booyah

[highangle]

we can presume you'll be matriculating at Booyah U?

[splat]

I had no idea gay guys twirled each others chest hair while 69'ing until summit clued us in on that shit.
Somethings are better left unsaid.

Forget sniveling about this shit.
Just go park your ass on the boundary of area 51 and you'll find our capabilities far exceed this simplistic going to the moon crap.

How about controlling population? Now there's a fukking challenge that doesn't require leaving the stratosphere.

[f2f]

[Hugh Conway]

I am totally going to get my MS and PHD in MOON MINING ENGINEERING! Booyah

I'll sell you one for $100.

[highangle]

how'd you like to be black and have to say, "Yes NASA", "No NASA" all the fkn time?

[Chainsaw_Willie]

..snip...

How about controlling population? Now there's a fukking challenge that doesn't require leaving the stratosphere.

How dare you mention this! This topic is VERBOTEN! Do you understand? Do not speak of this ever again!!!

[splat]

[prokeke]

Correction, YOU don't give a fuck. I know a lot of us that like having her around. You on the other hand...we've wanted you gone for a long time.

KQ: beloved, long time member who's brought more good will to this community than any of your rambling overly aggressive diatribes filled with personal attacks (ie. this thread); look no further than her excellent culinary threads.

Summit: retard from CO; see comment above about rampant douchbaggery.

Now back to your regularly schedule discussion about manned space exploration.

I think David Cross put it best, "Yay! We're sending a man to the moon! Fuck yeah! Wait, didn't we do that already? Oh well, who cares. We're going to the moon! Hey, I have an idea. How about we put a man in an apartment."

As for mining the moon (much less other planets) and bringing the materials back. Do you have any idea how much that will cost? Paying for material extraction on this planet is costly enough. What are we going to run out of here that we'll have to get from there? Many building materials can be reused, recycled, or regenerated. And science/society has proven especially adept at finding new sources of materials that are more efficient and/or plentiful than their predecessors.

It's actually a really good idea in 30 years. Nuclear fusion. http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/space/1...ing/index.html
Helium-3

[splat]

Nuclear fusion, ice at the poles and lunar rocks.
It'd be like a real planet.
Let's waste this place.
We got the moon.

[Arty50]

It's actually a really good idea in 30 years. Nuclear fusion. http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/space/1...ing/index.html
Helium-3

You missed this part:

Professor Manuel Grande of University of Aberystwyth led the British involvement of the European Space Agency's Smart-1 mission to observe the moon. He believes that focusing on mining self-sustaining minerals would be more beneficial than trying to harvest and then transport helium-3.

"It is dubious whether it will ever be economically viable even if nuclear fusion works commercially or if helium-3 is a better option than other elements available on earth," he told CNN.

"There are plenty of other minerals on the moon that would be easier to get at and help provide resources for a self-sustaining base. Oxygen could be derived from ilmanite reserves there and water could be extracted to make rocket fuel or sustain life on a base.

"Put it this way, I wouldn't buy shares in the moon for the economic return. Lunar tourism will be the first money maker there," Manuel Grande told CNN.

Basically, what that article is advocating is that we spend billions upon billions of dollars of taxpayer money to bring back a mineral that may or may not power fusion reactors that aren't even developed yet and may never be. Not to mention the fact that these reactors will no doubt be owned and operated by major corporations who will be paying rock bottom prices for this fuel which in no way shape or form will ever pay for the total expenditure outlayed by the American people. Oh and then there's the idea being tossed around that the mining operation will most likely be international in scope, which always means the US will bear the brunt of the costs.

I'd much rather spend that money on developing new clean energy resources in the US, becoming a world leader in those technologies, and then shopping them to the rest of the world. This would create millions of jobs here, foster the development of new US based companies, and gain us a competitive advantage in one of the world's largest burgeoning industries.

Edit: Something like this... http://arstechnica.com/science/news/...-biodiesel.ars

But that's not as exciting as shooting Buck Rogers to the moon, so fuck it. We're going to the moon!!!

[splat]

[highangle]

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_elevator[/ame]