the answer to "WTF is wrong with my boots?"

[Duffman]

if that doesn't make enought room for the instep nothing will and the boot is NOT the right thing to work on.

but yes. I have sent a few skiers out with no boot board. Some keep skiing that way, some put it back in as things pack out

Gotcha. Haven't skiied them yet but tried on with the stock nearly flat footbed, there is enough room in the instep , maybe a focal bite pressure point ,but overall volume is definitely sufficient.

[theetruscan]

I changed boots recently. Skiing Hawx Ultra Professionals or whatever they're called. Shellfit length is correct, snug but not quite race snug. Forefoot width pre-cooking and instep height pre-cooking were very snug.

Cooked the shells, cooked the liners, shot foam in the liners. Have a custom footbed, and swapped to the high volume (thin) tongues.

I still needed some instep height and shaved the bootboards a little bit. The left foot(My flatter foot) is pretty good. My higher foot has pressure across the instep, most intense above the most medial part of the foot but covering probably 2/3 of the width of my foot there. I have some cold toes (as expected) from pressure. I also have tingling in my middle three toes for 36-72 hours after I take off my boot. This latter bit seems bad.

I do have an unnecessary ridge that was meant to be for metatarsals I think on the footbed, and that's under the ball of my foot. I tried to crush it with a giant vice, but that's not been entirely effective. Is this ridge likely the entire cause of the days of pins and needles, or should I be looking for something.

[TexasGortex]

Anyone know where I can get some boot boards for a 29.5 Lange XT3? I’d like to experiment but they are so flimsy I’m worried I’ll destroy them immediately.

[Duffman]

Subtitle: WTF is wrong that I can't ski a normal flex boot.....

So working on these new Cochise 130 27.5 as posted above.

Forefoot punch done ,fits well there. As mentioned above the instep is lower than the old Cochise, I could ski them with my normal footbeds, but a lot of pressure led to some frozen toes and pain over the medial instep after an hour + or so. Definitely need to work on the liner tongue here and / or grind zeppa, but the toebox volume is fairly high so I don't want to get any more vertical volume in the toe area. Does that rule out grinding zeppa?

One thing I noticed is other than the fit issues in the instep, the shin fit and ankle fit felt great and much more comfortable through rough terrain than my ProWraps on the upper shin. It was nice to have some suspension and flex there. But something felt off, I felt like it was way harder to get the skis on edge aggressively and generally didn't feel confident.

So after this for day 2 due to the instep pressure I switched in my well loved and used 28 ProWraps from my OG Cochise 130 pro 27.5. Still tighter instep than with the old boots ,but tolerable. I felt 100% more confident making aggressive turns , with the trade off of aggressive pressure on shins in bumps and uneven terrain .

The question here is why the ProWrap seems to ski so much better. I get that the Cochise 130 isn't a race boot, but it's not a noodle and should be sufficient for my non charger old ass. From my understanding the new shell version 9s significantly stiffer.than the original . Am I just so used to a stupid stiff setup w the ProWrap that I've forgotten how to ski a boot with any flex or travel, or can there be something more to it?

[Duffman]

Bump to add:. The new walk mode is way superior to the old one but the range of motion is so much better w the stock liners than the ProWrap which is another reason I'd like to try and make these work if possible.

[milestogo]

Picked up a pair of 2016 scarpa F1s, and they fit pretty well. Only issue is space over the instep. Historically I only use boots with an instep buckle due to my low volume foot. Already have a superfeet insole in there, and cranking down the boa makes the whole boot tighter, but still the gap above the instep. Any solution for this? Are there instep pads I can attach to the boot or the liner? Is that the way to go?

[m599a0]

Hey everyone - new forum member here. I recently purchased the Hawx boot and have paired them with a hybrid Black Crow ski. I'm generally happy with the setup which I use 60% resort 40% touring. But, the tongue on the liner is really bruising my upper inside ankle shin area. Before skiing the boots, I had the boots and liner heat molded (separately heated but in the same session) and they felt great. But I now know after three days of skiing that major changes are needed! The liner has a hard plastic wrap on the tongue area which I have not seen before and that seems to be the source of the problem.

I'm in MA and am looking for a professional boot fitter to work to get the issue resolved. Anyone have a recommendations or experience with this issue?

Or what about removing the hard plastic on the tongue...my fear being that it's not very thick foam underneath the plastic so maybe that will mess with the integrity of the liner..??


Thanks for helping the newbie!

[98brg2d]

Question for those running kryptons: how much punch have you achieved over the medial malleolus? Reason for question is I’m getting very tired of heating up my scorpions to get them off at the end of the day but I have about a 1-cm punch in that spot which looks like it’s right over the cables where they cross under the cuff above the pivot of a krypton. On the scorpions the punch includes the pivot. Also have punch rearward and lower than medial malleolus and navicular. The lower punch might be on the pivot of a krypton. Looking at krypton because I heard the plug used for the scafo was the same as the scorpion and I needed no forefoot work on those.


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[WMD]

Boot fit question. I've got really weird feet but have found I can get a good fit in Atomic Hawx Ultra 130s in a 25.5. They are hard to get on and off due to my high insteps, but are ultra comfortable while skiing. A couple years ago I bought a used pair of Hawx Ultra 130 XTD's for the backcountry. The liners are tiny and they are impossible to put on if at all cold. I finally give up and it's time for new touring boots. Because these XTD's are so small (the liner is noticeably shorter than the non XTD Hawx) I'm wondering if I should go up a size for my touring boots? Anyone do that (size up for touring)? I've tried on a 26.5 XTD (they didn't have a 25.5) and they are easier to put on for sure. I didn't have my insoles but the boots felt not as snug as my performance fit regular Hawx. I'm worried they may feel too large eventually.

Do people recommend a slightly larger touring boot? Did I just get a funky sized XTD and I should check out a different 25.5 XTD? Thoughts?

[lowsparkco]

Picked up a pair of 2016 scarpa F1s, and they fit pretty well. Only issue is space over the instep. Historically I only use boots with an instep buckle due to my low volume foot. Already have a superfeet insole in there, and cranking down the boa makes the whole boot tighter, but still the gap above the instep. Any solution for this? Are there instep pads I can attach to the boot or the liner? Is that the way to go?

The F1 still comes with an Intuition?

I’ve always cooked the liner and molded it with a piece of foam over my instep. I crank them down as hard as I can while they cool and find that when I buckle them to normal pressure there’s a pocket that relieves the pressure on the top of my foot.

[milestogo]

The F1 still comes with an Intuition?

I’ve always cooked the liner and molded it with a piece of foam over my instep. I crank them down as hard as I can while they cool and find that when I buckle them to normal pressure there’s a pocket that relieves the pressure on the top of my foot.

Yeah, my problem is the opposite. TOO MUCH room in the instep. I have, as they say in the business, a very "low volume" foot.

[lowsparkco]

Yeah, my problem is the opposite. TOO MUCH room in the instep. I have, as they say in the business, a very "low volume" foot.

If you’re trying to take up volume I’ve always felt that it’s more important you really get an Intuition hot, so it puffs up to full thickness. Then when you mold it be gentle and don’t buckle the buckles very tight. Higher volume replacement liner? Smaller last boot? I can see how a skinny long foot would present problems.

[TexasGortex]

How do I stop my boots from leaking? My last two pairs of boots have been Lange and cold as shit. First pair XC120 with Intuition Dreamliners and the second XT3 120 with Zipfits. Both required bunion punches and widening. Today was my first day in the XT3s and the exterior of the Zipfits had ice on them. Tried boot gloves without much success on my last pair.

[jackattack]

duct tape on the toe "gasket" where the overlap starts is the tried and true method to keep snow out of the clog. the amount of water intrusion seems to vary from boot to boot. The old RX130 leaked like a sieve, the new XT3 is not so leaky, time will tell on the Xr9.

[PowderPig]

Boot fit question. I've got really weird feet but have found I can get a good fit in Atomic Hawx Ultra 130s in a 25.5. They are hard to get on and off due to my high insteps, but are ultra comfortable while skiing. A couple years ago I bought a used pair of Hawx Ultra 130 XTD's for the backcountry. The liners are tiny and they are impossible to put on if at all cold. I finally give up and it's time for new touring boots. Because these XTD's are so small (the liner is noticeably shorter than the non XTD Hawx) I'm wondering if I should go up a size for my touring boots? Anyone do that (size up for touring)? I've tried on a 26.5 XTD (they didn't have a 25.5) and they are easier to put on for sure. I didn't have my insoles but the boots felt not as snug as my performance fit regular Hawx. I'm worried they may feel too large eventually.

Do people recommend a slightly larger touring boot? Did I just get a funky sized XTD and I should check out a different 25.5 XTD? Thoughts?

My $0.02.. I got my Hawx Ultra XTD 130 in the same size as my alpine boots (Salomon Falcon 10), which have a performance fit. The difference for me when trying them stock (ouch - I’ll lose nails and possibly a toe), with my custom insoles (tight, but toes should be safe), and after molding (yay!) was quite big, so I wouldn’t size up.
Disclaimer - I’ve only used them inbounds so far - no touring…

[TexasGortex]

duct tape on the toe "gasket" where the overlap starts is the tried and true method to keep snow out of the clog. the amount of water intrusion seems to vary from boot to boot. The old RX130 leaked like a sieve, the new XT3 is not so leaky, time will tell on the Xr9.

Hotronics moved to new boots and duct tape in my bag.

I don’t care how good Lange ski, I’m buying any other brand next time if I can’t get this under control!

[CaliBrit]

Bump to add:. The new walk mode is way superior to the old one but the range of motion is so much better w the stock liners than the ProWrap which is another reason I'd like to try and make these work if possible.

Went from 130 Cochise to concept MV. Haven’t looked back. Put powerwraps molded to Cochise straight in. No issues.

Concepts are great. Not too stiff. I’m only 160 lbs as well.

[WMD]

My $0.02.. I got my Hawx Ultra XTD 130 in the same size as my alpine boots (Salomon Falcon 10), which have a performance fit. The difference for me when trying them stock (ouch - I’ll lose nails and possibly a toe), with my custom insoles (tight, but toes should be safe), and after molding (yay!) was quite big, so I wouldn’t size up.
Disclaimer - I’ve only used them inbounds so far - no touring…

Thanks!

[EWG]

Ok, my daughters boot issues are become epic, and expensive. Super annoying. Would love some advice.

She's 18, in Nordica Promachine 105s, 22.5. She wears a size 7 shoe, or just under and is a fast, powerful, skilled skier based in Salt Lake. She's been working with Larry's in Boulder, CO, a very well respected fitter, with a woman there who has 20+ years of experience. She's been having trouble for a while - when she buckles them tight enough for control she cramps in her calf and foot, when she loosens them enough to not cramp she has no control, she says.

Solution at the last visit was to throw away the stock liners, add off the shelf Soul footbeds and then use new intuition liners. The fitter was worried about getting her calf enough room to help alleviate the cramping. So she used the Intuition Scarpa Pro Flex Evo liners which are supposedly a little thinner. Daughter then went back to SLC, so she can't easily return to Larry's in Boulder.

First time out she loved how much control she had, but said she was cramping pretty bad. We decided she should ski a few more times to let them pack out. After a couple days she was getting much less cramping but they were starting to "feel loose at the end of runs." Now, day 4, she's still cramping but is saying they are way too big. That she can pick the entire front of her foot up off the footbed no matter how tightly she buckles them (buckles set in the tighter position on the shell and then buckled to the second or third tightest notch), that she feels like she has space above her foot, and that her foot is sliding forward and backward in the boot even when she's super focused on slamming her weight into her shin. She's pretty upset and say they just feel way too big

Are we just screwed here? Did we just spend $250 for liners that are too thin? Any other thoughts? This is getting super frustrating.

[mntlion]

sounds like the shells/boots are a bit big in volume for her level of skiing?

Maybe a 95mm nordica, and put the liners in that?

MAYBE a foam liner in the pro might be firm enough and fill in teh volume needed?

I assume she is using a good supportive custom footbed already?

[EWG]

sounds like the shells/boots are a bit big in volume for her level of skiing?

Maybe a 95mm nordica, and put the liners in that?

MAYBE a foam liner in the pro might be firm enough and fill in teh volume needed?

I assume she is using a good supportive custom footbed already?

Soul off the shelf footbed for now.

The Promachine is a 98 last. The only smaller last I see on their website is a 93mm Dobermann.

What do you mean by a foam liner? I thought that's what I was doing with the intuition. Sounds like the thin intuition was a bad plan. Which sucks.

There are very few boots that are true 22s, and you can't get anything smaller, so I kinda got to make these work if at all possible.

Maybe she just needs thicker intuitions?

[mntlion]

the pro is 98mm. Nordica (and most others) make a true 22 in 95 or 93mm. Almost no one makes a 21, but I'm guessing a lower volume 22 will work well

thinker intuition might help, but over time will pack out as well. Starting with narrower shell is better long term

Foam liner / injection liner. Its like a deflated liner, that you fill with foam, to make a VERY exact fit of the foot. Also CAN fill up volume, lasts 200-300 days of skiing.

A better footbed will also help to stabalize the foot. Will not change the boots volume, but can make things move around a lot less.

[jackattack]

Are we just screwed here? Did we just spend $250 for liners that are too thin? Any other thoughts? This is getting super frustrating.

shims are cheap https://www.tognar.com/ski-boot-insole-shims-pr/

If that doesn't help with the excess volume, try a true 21.5/22 and use the LV intuition liner that's molded to her foot. I recall seeing a lot of inexpensive plugs at level9 on 33rd last time I was in there, but it's been a while.

[mntlion]

Ok, my daughters boot issues are become epic, and expensive. Super annoying. Would love some advice.

She's 18, in Nordica Promachine 105s, 22.5. She wears a size 7 shoe, or just under and is a fast, powerful, skilled skier based in Salt Lake. She's been working with Larry's in Boulder, CO, a very well respected fitter, with a woman there who has 20+ years of experience. She's been having trouble for a while - when she buckles them tight enough for control she cramps in her calf and foot, when she loosens them enough to not cramp she has no control, she says.

Solution at the last visit was to throw away the stock liners, add off the shelf Soul footbeds and then use new intuition liners. The fitter was worried about getting her calf enough room to help alleviate the cramping. So she used the Intuition Scarpa Pro Flex Evo liners which are supposedly a little thinner. Daughter then went back to SLC, so she can't easily return to Larry's in Boulder.

First time out she loved how much control she had, but said she was cramping pretty bad. We decided she should ski a few more times to let them pack out. After a couple days she was getting much less cramping but they were starting to "feel loose at the end of runs." Now, day 4, she's still cramping but is saying they are way too big. That she can pick the entire front of her foot up off the footbed no matter how tightly she buckles them (buckles set in the tighter position on the shell and then buckled to the second or third tightest notch), that she feels like she has space above her foot, and that her foot is sliding forward and backward in the boot even when she's super focused on slamming her weight into her shin. She's pretty upset and say they just feel way too big

Are we just screwed here? Did we just spend $250 for liners that are too thin? Any other thoughts? This is getting super frustrating.

maybe this as a starting point?

22 and 94?mm shape

https://www.levelninesports.com/fisc...ki-boots-2020/

[EWG]

maybe this as a starting point?

22 and 94?mm shape

https://www.levelninesports.com/fisc...ki-boots-2020/

Thanks for all of this. She is remote so the process will be slow, but I'm starting.