Canada Closed until US Gets Covid 19 Under Control

[The AD]

34 states reporting a 50% increase in covid cases probably wont expedite the border opening.

Driven by the unvaccinated, though, and Trudeau has been quite clear they won't be welcome anytime soon.

[grinch]

Driven by the unvaccinated, though, and Trudeau has been quite clear they won't be welcome anytime soon.

It is a problem though. Vaccinated families have unvaccinated kids mingling with these hillbillies. Are these new variants transmitting from vaccinated people? Im not sure we're ready yet

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[Percy Rideout]

It is a problem though. Vaccinated families have unvaccinated kids mingling with these hillbillies. Are these new variants transmitting from vaccinated people? Im not sure we're ready yet

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Exactly. These little petri dishes harbor, incubate, and spread the same virus we are scared about this month.

Speaking of getting the world innoculated and open again, the poor countries are lagging behind with no help from the first world nations.

This is the time when a pandemic turns endemic. As I've said before we have no chance of eradicating the virus with our current (poor) worldwide vaccine rollout.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...s-tracker.html

I thought the plan was to eradicate this virus and protect the world. The handy global tracker link above tell it otherwise.

Time to "live with the virus" as your Uncle Boris made the news saying.

[grinch]

Yup, my as well give the vax to the willing. A lot more efficient than trying yo convince the morans. We should be at 80% or above with the 2nd shot soon. Govt has contracts set up for a healthy supply so now we're talking distribution to poor countries.
Looks like the vax might be ok for kiddos. Shouldnt be long before its conclusive

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[rideit]

C’mon, guys, get it together and open by August, I really want wifey and kiddo to go away for two weeks, as much as I love them.

[paulster2626]

C’mon, guys, get it together and open by August, I really want wifey and kiddo to go away for two weeks, as much as I love them.

Canada IS getting it together. The USA is not, however, and that's the problem.

[danmelon]

Canada IS getting it together. The USA is not, however, and that's the problem.

CBC reported we are actually passed 50% as of yesterday

[Thaleia]

Toronto area is %60 adults fully vaccinated!

[paulster2626]

CBC reported we are actually passed 50% as of yesterday

Both are correct. CBC reporting 50% of eligible population. This chart covers total population.

[smmokan]

Canada IS getting it together. The USA is not, however, and that's the problem.

That's the thing... they don't have to let in the idiots who won't get vaccinated. Just the smart ones.

[danmelon]

Toronto area is %60 adults fully vaccinated!

I have to say Ontario has really stepped up it's game after so many prior COVID fumbles.

[The AD]

That's the thing... they don't have to let in the idiots who won't get vaccinated. Just the smart ones.

Agreed. Seems kind of absurd to bar people who HAVE been vaxxed because they're around people who aren't. You do that you're never going to be able to let anyone in. The important thing is to get Canadians fully vaxxed, and that seems to be happening.

[altasnob]

Canada IS getting it together. The USA is not, however, and that's the problem.

What I don't get about Canada's position is not how it relates to the US, but how it relates to the rest of the world. Is Canada going to keep their doors closed to the rest of the world for the next five years, maybe forever? When do you think Brazil or India is going to reach a vaccination threshold that you deem acceptable? Sure, you can keep your country closed off for a year or two but at some point, you have to get real. And Canada may reach, say, 80%, of the population fully vaccinated but you'll never reach heard immunity because if the virus is still circulating somewhere on earth, it is still circulating in Canada.

[danmelon]

What I don't get about Canada's position is not how it relates to the US, but how it relates to the rest of the world. Is Canada going to keep their doors closed to the rest of the world for the next five years, maybe forever? When do you think Brazil or India is going to reach a vaccination threshold that you deem acceptable? Sure, you can keep your country closed off for a year or two but at some point, you have to get real. And Canada may reach, say, 80%, of the population fully vaccinated but you'll never reach heard immunity because if the virus is still circulating somewhere on earth, it is still circulating in Canada.

As I understand it, once the Canadian population is protected (e.g.: 75% of population fully vaccinated), then the border will open. I think the 75% fully vaxxed rate is less likely to lead to unmanageable stress on the healthcare system even if there is COVID still circulating among the population. People might get COVID and might get sick, but you won't have 1000s showing up in ERs and ICUs all at once.

[grinch]

I dont think its a US centric policy. Its a combo of enough of the pop. dbl vaxxed as well as a wait and see how this variant uptick will affect things. The variant is surging in euro countries. The concern with the US is their disorganization

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[grinch]

Maybe dominion could add that to the voting lists and co ordinate that. Thatd also keep the hillbillies from registering or visiting, both ours and your hillbillies

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[The AD]

The concern with the US is their disorganization

Actually I don't see disorganization in the U.S. right now. Things are organized. There's just a significant portion of the population that doesn't want to get vaccinated (and the areas where this is more prevalent are the areas being hit hard by the delta variant now--go figure).

[grinch]

Actually I don't see disorganization in the U.S. right now. Things are organized. There's just a significant portion of the population that doesn't want to get vaccinated (and the areas where this is more prevalent are the areas being hit hard by the delta variant now--go figure).

Not all disorganised but enough states that dont have adequate vax record keeping. Its been mentioned in this thread numerous times. Scouts honour doesnt work when it comes to int'l borders

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[altasnob]

Not all disorganised but enough states that dont have adequate vax record keeping.

That's not true. As I understand it, vaccination records in the US, whether its for COVID or anything else, are maintained by each counties' health department (just like birth and death certificates). This is true regardless of whether the person who got the COVID vax got a stupid paper CDC vax card or not (so when people say their CDC card is blank, that doesn't mean their name isn't in the county health department database). So there is no centralized national database, or even state database, but there is accurate record keeping.

The US has HIPAA (the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act) which is a law that controls the dissemination of people's health records and puts stringent controls on that. For instance, any agency or business can't email health records without complying with security laws. Not sure if Canada has a similar law, but I imagine so. This is a good law but it makes creating state and national databases of health records, and sharing those records, more difficult. If Canada's trusts the US criminal databases to turn away DUI convicts I don't see why Canada should have any concern relying on US counties' health department databases to determine who is vaxed or not.

[paulster2626]

What I don't get about Canada's position is not how it relates to the US, but how it relates to the rest of the world. Is Canada going to keep their doors closed to the rest of the world for the next five years, maybe forever? When do you think Brazil or India is going to reach a vaccination threshold that you deem acceptable? Sure, you can keep your country closed off for a year or two but at some point, you have to get real. And Canada may reach, say, 80%, of the population fully vaccinated but you'll never reach heard immunity because if the virus is still circulating somewhere on earth, it is still circulating in Canada.

No, but you need to understand the precarious position that our healthcare system is in. It's publicly funded, so subject to constant cuts and budget increases that don't match the population increase, and this means that during a typical flu season the system is pretty much running at capacity, and in some cases over capacity. You throw this COVID bullshit at it, and it totally gets all fucked up. Apparently we're somethign like 3.5 years behind in elective surgeries now.

With the delta variant that does have the ability to fuck up a country (we can see this in other places right now), the Canadian govts need to be very careful as to when they fully open things back up. There'll be no going back once they do, so they gotta get it right the first time. With Canada essentially at the forefront of vaccinations now, we're the test subject for effectiveness. There is theoretically an exact date when the border can safely be opened. I don't think you'd be able to find a single Canadian who would say it's worth being on the "too soon" side of that line vs. the "too late" one.

Once vaccines are proven to kick delta's ass in Canada, we're good. End of the month, maybe a week or two later. That's my guess.

[DanoT]

Once vaccines are proven to kick delta's ass in Canada, we're good. End of the month, maybe a week or two later. That's my guess.

My guess: Trudeau will time the border reopening with an election announcement, so late Sept. border opening and election call for a late Oct election.

[altasnob]

Ya, but even when Canada is at 80% fully vaccinated there will still always be 20% not vaccinated. And when the day comes that Canada lets Americans in, and Brazilians, Indians, Africans, they will bring the detla and variant de jour and there will be deaths and your health care system will be strapped. That day is coming. When, who knows, but it will happen. I look at it as a choice. Keep the border closed for the rest of time and eliminate all death. Or face the music, let the virus run rampant through those who don't want to get vaxed and unfortunately, those who can't get vaxed, and deem the deaths that follow as an acceptable risk (this is basically how the US, and most of the Western World, is looking at the situation right now).

[liv2ski]

Once vaccines are proven to kick delta's ass in Canada, we're good. End of the month, maybe a week or two later. That's my guess.

Because the virus is always trying to mutate, there will be deadlier strains after Delta. So the best any country can do is try and get to 75% vaccinated and then go on with life. We should be wearing masks in public until this shit is gone = forever. So I am hopeful policy makers will see that reality and open once Canada hits 75%.

[ex-powderbroker]

That's not true. As I understand it, vaccination records in the US, whether its for COVID or anything else, are maintained by each counties' health department (just like birth and death certificates).

i certainly never heard objections about the legitimacy of any president’s birth certificate.

[altasnob]

i certainly never heard objections about the legitimacy of any president’s birth certificate.

Canada trusts the US criminal records. The whole reason Canada doesn't let DUI guy in is because they think he's going to get sloshed and mow down a kid. The US criminal records and various databases are not 100% accurate, and yet Canada relies on these to keep Canadians safe. There will always be things falling through the cracks. I have several friends with DUIs (some multiple) who go with me to Canada and get in no problem because Canada doesn't know about their DUIs.