The Ethics of Outdorr Recreation in Times of COVID-19

[m2711c]

[m2711c]

[kuus]

[old goat]

Mikey--what's wrong with wool pants and gaiters? (see my avatar--taken in the 70's on Mt. Washington)

[AK47bp]

Oh shit! Love it. Thanks for the laugh.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[::: :::]

https://www.oregonlive.com/travel/20...-off-road.html

Gorge highway closure extended after trespassers violate barricades, throw signs off road

All public land is closed within the Columbia River Gorge National Scenic Area due to the coronavirus outbreak, but that hasn’t stopped crowds from showing up, with some people going so far as to trespass onto parks and trails.The Oregon Department of Transportation announced Tuesday that it will shut down seven additional miles of the Historic Columbia River Highway, which leads to many of the area’s most popular hikes and waterfalls, following an influx of unruly crowds.
...
The new road closures will be staffed by state park rangers. Roads will be kept open for local residents and emergency services.

[plugboots]

I mini-golfed w/ Kedar:

[frorider]

Gold, Kuus.

[garyfromterrace]

Shit yeah, thanks for the chuckle. However.... it's close to the truth up this way...

[old goat]

Crowding on beaches, in parks, on trails and in parking lots is not a negligible problem but the closures of those areas, not to mention the closures of whole towns--mainly in the mountains it seems--has gone way overboard. Make masks mandatory in public building or outside if 6 feet can't be maintained. Enforce that and then think about closures. The masks will do a lot more good than the closures. Closing a whole town or county is a total joke if the residents are walking around without masks.

We should also figure out how to get good masks to supermarket employees. In most of the country that's where most of the cases have to be coming from. Every mask that prevents an infection also prevents the need for dozens if not hundreds of masks needed to care for an infected patient. I was in Safeway today--not a single employee was wearing a mask.

[mall walker]

Crowding on beaches, in parks, on trails and in parking lots is not a negligible problem but the closures of those areas, not to mention the closures of whole towns--mainly in the mountains it seems--has gone way overboard. Make masks mandatory in public building or outside if 6 feet can't be maintained. Enforce that and then think about closures. The masks will do a lot more good than the closures. Closing a whole town or county is a total joke if the residents are walking around without masks.

We should also figure out how to get good masks to supermarket employees. In most of the country that's where most of the cases have to be coming from. Every mask that prevents an infection also prevents the need for dozens if not hundreds of masks needed to care for an infected patient. I was in Safeway today--not a single employee was wearing a mask.

+1

[BCMtnHound]

Crowding on beaches, in parks, on trails and in parking lots is not a negligible problem but the closures of those areas, not to mention the closures of whole towns--mainly in the mountains it seems--has gone way overboard. Make masks mandatory in public building or outside if 6 feet can't be maintained. Enforce that and then think about closures. The masks will do a lot more good than the closures. Closing a whole town or county is a total joke if the residents are walking around without masks.

We should also figure out how to get good masks to supermarket employees. In most of the country that's where most of the cases have to be coming from. Every mask that prevents an infection also prevents the need for dozens if not hundreds of masks needed to care for an infected patient. I was in Safeway today--not a single employee was wearing a mask.

The Provincial Parks just shut everything down today. No idea how they will enforce it, over such a large area. While most of the park trails around here are still covered in snow, with only a few ski or snowshoe tracks on the shorter ones, I suppose they thought there would be a rush during this long weekend. The closing of the toilets and such are definitely a concern if the trails and viewing platforms are open, for obvious reasons. The park closure has the forest rec site staff in an tizzy or what do do for their trails, especially since many of them are linked to the prov parks.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

Boulder is now threatening to shut down the parks if people don't stop acting like turds.

[hutash]

Los Angeles county just required all essential businesses wear masks and strongly advises all people out in publis wear them.

[Ottime]

Boulder is now threatening to shut down the parks if people don't stop acting like turds.

They just shut them down in Santa Cruz for a week. Because - turds.

[old goat]

The Provincial Parks just shut everything down today. No idea how they will enforce it, over such a large area. While most of the park trails around here are still covered in snow, with only a few ski or snowshoe tracks on the shorter ones, I suppose they thought there would be a rush during this long weekend.

"What is a weekend?"--Violet Crawley, the Dowager Duchess of Grantham

[Dshack89]

I appreciated reading this rational POV (a rarity in these times): https://utahavalanchecenter.org/blog/54021?

Some good quotes:

"If it takes “don’t overstress or endanger our health care system” as the catalyst for someone to back off of a decision that has as much gravity as an avalanche accident represents, then perhaps that person should rethink their backcountry decision making process in general."

and

"Next season, assuming that (hopefully) COVID19 is but a distant memory, will your avalanche terrain decision making process be any different? Or will you be more willing to risk breaking a femur or getting buried next season than you are today? "

[lowsparkco]

Thanks for posting that ^^^^ I've been thinking the same thing.

[jimmiepoison]

Good article. Nearly everything we do carries a certain amount of risk and we make decisions every day that accept those risks. I think the x-factor is how many decisions are made out of emotion. This often clouds judgement and accurate risk assessment. Not only is it happening with the current pandemic, but it has been happening for years in the BC following a big storm. There are a lot of unknowns in both scenarios and all we can do is make the best informed decisions possible and understand the risks associated with those decisions.

[skifishbum]

I hate it when I say im done and don't
a salt of the earth mag stopped by last night
dudes been sar fore I met him helping he and his wife and furkids move to a utardia apartment
Ya know time passes made multiple hut trips and shared a lot of turns with him and another sar cat
They have a sweet crib now horses chixs and fuck it stokes me out to ski with his skin kids now and see them progress every season
Hes no rookie and has dealt with death and body recovery's before and I like to think I know him pretty good
so he despite his and others best effort were unable to save a 32 yo male climbers life last night
and I know this persons body language mannerisms and how this affected him.
ive dealt with death as have a lot here
shit sucks
is sumthins I think we can all agree on
he passes no judgement on how or where you choose to recreate within your personal moral ethical risk tolerance skill sets and laws
He and a lot of others wouldn't mind if ya turned it down a notch maybe 2 for some bmf's
which seems like a reasonable request
id encourage you to consider thanking donating or in some manner using a little time or effort to try and do something positive for a 1st responder today or in the future.
I chose to break social distancing and give my/our friend a hug cause it what I thought he needed
and a few vodka ginger ales and a place to decompress/talk before returning to sheltering at home
bless him and others
please attempt to stay safe and sane in some manner

[new yabyum]

I hate it when I say im done and don't
a salt of the earth mag stopped by last night
dudes been sar fore I met him helping he and his wife and furkids move to a utardia apartment
Ya know time passes made multiple hut trips and shared a lot of turns with him and another sar cat
They have a sweet crib now horses chixs and fuck it stokes me out to ski with his skin kids now and see them progress every season
Hes no rookie and has dealt with death and body recovery's before and I like to think I know him pretty good
so he despite his and others best effort were unable to save a 32 yo male climbers life last night
and I know this persons body language mannerisms and how this affected him.
ive dealt with death as have a lot here
shit sucks
is sumthins I think we can all agree on
he passes no judgement on how or where you choose to recreate within your personal moral ethical risk tolerance skill sets and laws
He and a lot of others wouldn't mind if ya turned it down a notch maybe 2 for some bmf's
which seems like a reasonable request
id encourage you to consider thanking donating or in some manner using a little time or effort to try and do something positive for a 1st responder today or in the future.
I chose to break social distancing and give my/our friend a hug cause it what I thought he needed
and a few vodka ginger ales and a place to decompress/talk before returning to sheltering at home
bless him and others
please attempt to stay safe and sane in some manner

Way past time to respond to the responders, Help 'um out any way you can.

[Ottime]

Crowding on beaches, in parks, on trails and in parking lots is not a negligible problem but the closures of those areas, not to mention the closures of whole towns--mainly in the mountains it seems--has gone way overboard. Make masks mandatory in public building or outside if 6 feet can't be maintained. Enforce that and then think about closures. The masks will do a lot more good than the closures. Closing a whole town or county is a total joke if the residents are walking around without masks.

We should also figure out how to get good masks to supermarket employees. In most of the country that's where most of the cases have to be coming from. Every mask that prevents an infection also prevents the need for dozens if not hundreds of masks needed to care for an infected patient. I was in Safeway today--not a single employee was wearing a mask.

+1. I've been biking with a buff for a few weeks, so if I come near anyone, my face is covered. On my ride yesterday, I passed about 10 people coming the opposite direction. Half of those were between 4-6' away, and half between 2-4' away. I did over take two hikers at one point, but it was on fire road and I was about 6-8' away from them. Today all public trails in the county are closed. It is a loose closing, as it does not define trails. Is a fire road a trail? If it is an illegal trail that is commonly ridden (posted to protect the property owner from lawsuits, but actually they don't care - UCSC, private land, etc - we have a lot of these type of trails) is is public? Its a bummer, as we've been hiking on "public" trails, and often chose trails that we don't see anyone for the entire 3-5 mile loop. So why close them?

I appreciated reading this rational POV (a rarity in these times): https://utahavalanchecenter.org/blog/54021?

Some good quotes:

"If it takes “don’t overstress or endanger our health care system” as the catalyst for someone to back off of a decision that has as much gravity as an avalanche accident represents, then perhaps that person should rethink their backcountry decision making process in general."

and

"Next season, assuming that (hopefully) COVID19 is but a distant memory, will your avalanche terrain decision making process be any different? Or will you be more willing to risk breaking a femur or getting buried next season than you are today? "

Good points. But I have always adjusted my risk level depending on the situation. I became more and more cautious as I approached the birth of my son. I new I would piss my wife off if I can home with a broken femur two weeks before he was due. Snow conditions change how aggressively I ski. I make choices based on the snow stability. In short, I never want to get caught in a slide, ever. But I want to get caught in one less now. If I was BC skiing currently, I would manage it differently than I normally due. I am for sure managing my biking differently. I'm also not surfing (not just because surf zones closed last night at midnight) because I just finished my shoulder PT from dislocation, and never got a chance to "test" it I the surf after PT and before pandemic. Because it could land me in Urgent Care for a few hours getting x-ray twice, I'm choosing to do other things until this is over. Does not mean I don't plan to surf again, just don't want to take that chance right now.

I hate it when I say im done and don't
a salt of the earth mag stopped by last night
dudes been sar fore I met him helping he and his wife and furkids move to a utardia apartment
Ya know time passes made multiple hut trips and shared a lot of turns with him and another sar cat
They have a sweet crib now horses chixs and fuck it stokes me out to ski with his skin kids now and see them progress every season
Hes no rookie and has dealt with death and body recovery's before and I like to think I know him pretty good
so he despite his and others best effort were unable to save a 32 yo male climbers life last night
and I know this persons body language mannerisms and how this affected him.
ive dealt with death as have a lot here
shit sucks
is sumthins I think we can all agree on
he passes no judgement on how or where you choose to recreate within your personal moral ethical risk tolerance skill sets and laws
He and a lot of others wouldn't mind if ya turned it down a notch maybe 2 for some bmf's
which seems like a reasonable request
id encourage you to consider thanking donating or in some manner using a little time or effort to try and do something positive for a 1st responder today or in the future.
I chose to break social distancing and give my/our friend a hug cause it what I thought he needed
and a few vodka ginger ales and a place to decompress/talk before returning to sheltering at home
bless him and others
please attempt to stay safe and sane in some manner

Amen. Sometime we just need to say fuck it and give a hug.

[old goat]

Just remember that when you assess the risk of skiing in avalanche terrain you are assessing the risk to yourself, your touring partners, your friends and family. When you assess the risk of skiing in avy terrain in the middle of a pandemic you are also risking the depletion of critically endangered medical supplies and potentially hospital and icu beds. You are risking the lives of people whose existence you are not even aware of. Obviously the impact of one injured skier is very small, but it's not negligible and the impact of multiple injured skiers would be significant. So factor that in.

[bodywhomper]

Just remember that when you assess the risk of skiing in avalanche terrain you are assessing the risk to yourself, your touring partners, your friends and family. When you assess the risk of skiing in avy terrain in the middle of a pandemic you are also risking the depletion of critically endangered medical supplies and potentially hospital and icu beds. You are risking the lives of people whose existence you are not even aware of. Obviously the impact of one injured skier is very small, but it's not negligible and the impact of multiple injured skiers would be significant. So factor that in.

That NV County SAR trip to find a lost skier during the onset of the last storm cycle northwest of Truckee from last Saturday that I posted about.... the search team, including base camp support, was 50 people....

Has anybody been prancersizing? You will have no problem with keeping that 6+ foot space from others. It’ll really up your game.

[ill-advised strategy]

I’ve tested and implemented an open-farting policy.
If you’re close enough to be bothered, you’re too close.

I blasted a doozy at the grocery store the other day when a pair of head-to-toe-camo bumpkins were crowding me in the aisle. Results were as intended.

Gentlemen, we’ve now entered a golden age, perhaps the singular golden age of public flatulation.