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  1. #1476
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4matic View Post
    Marketing strategy.
    it's too bad his strategy exhausted his niche.

  2. #1477
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bromontane View Post
    VWAG did right by their customers in the wake of dieselgate. Plus, they're solvent.
    Like a guy apologizing to his wife for cheating because he got caught. They used the environment like a cheap hooker.

    Nothing will say hypocritical douchebag like an Audi EV SUV.


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    Last edited by 4matic; 03-08-2019 at 07:49 AM.

  3. #1478
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    www.apriliaforum.com

    "If the road You followed brought you to this,of what use was the road"?

    "I have no idea what I am talking about but would be happy to share my biased opinions as fact on the matter. "
    Ottime

  4. #1479
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    Quote Originally Posted by muted View Post
    it would have to match telsas price, range, and be a a bit faster (not match) Tesla's model y's 0-60 to be a true shark. So no to 2 of those. Price wise, based on the E-tron I'm guessing it's a lot lot lot more as the 'y' is suppose to be 10% more than the '3'.

    This will probably sell well though, a nice interior and good enough range will go a long way for Audi fans. And you can check it out in a dealership.
    And...shocker...get it repaired at a dealership. Huh..novel idea

  5. #1480
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    At 6.3 sec 0-60 the Q4 will be quick enough for average Joe, most people shouldn't own 3-4 sec cars as they are above their skill level to drive.



    teslas-self-driving-strategy-is-outdated-and-possibly-dangerous

    An overhaul to Tesla's Autopilot webpage might represent the clearest acknowledgment yet that the company has failed to deliver on Elon Musk's ambitious vision for a self-driving future.

    "You will be able to summon your Tesla from pretty much anywhere," Musk wrote in July 2016. "Once it picks you up, you will be able to sleep, read or do anything else enroute [sic] to your destination." Indeed, he predicted, Tesla customers with full self-driving capabilities will be able to have their cars join a ride-hailing network in order to "generate income for you while you're at work or on vacation."

    In January 2016, Musk predicted that Tesla cars would be able to drive autonomously coast to coast "in ~2 years."

    Needless to say, this hasn't happened. And after more than two years of peddling unrealistic visions of Autopilot's future, Tesla's Autopilot page has finally been updated to reflect that reality.

    The page's headline has changed from "Full Self-Driving Hardware on All Cars" to "Future of Driving." A sentence about Tesla's ride-sharing network has been deleted. The "Full Self-Driving" section now includes a disclaimer that "future use of these features without supervision is dependent on achieving reliability far in excess of human drivers as demonstrated by billions of miles of experience."

    In other words, despite Musk's bluster over the years, Autopilot is still just a driver-assistance system. And it will continue to be just a driver-assistance system for some time to come.

    Musk still wants to gradually improve the safety of this driver-assistance system. Eventually, the technology could become so good that it will no longer require human oversight.

    But there's reason to doubt that this strategy is going to work. More importantly, there's reason to worry that it could get people killed.

    https://www.kbb.com

    "The German automaker says the Audi Q4 e-tron will go into production in late 2020. It is likely to go on sale in the U.S. in 2021 with an estimated price in the $50,000 range."

    So priced comparably to the Y which we all know isn't going to be $35k +10% = $38.5k

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    german-regulators

    Tesla’s approach to pricing has drawn criticism since the company started using it on Model 3 order pages, though the scrutiny increased after it added the “after savings” prices to Model S and Model X order pages last November. While tax incentives and the cheaper cost of electricity compared to gasoline can ultimately reduce the cost of ownership, Tesla’s inclusion of these factors in the upfront pricing has been called “scammy,” “dubious,” and “confusing.” One pro-Tesla blog even referred to the pricing structure as “optimistic.”
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    "If the road You followed brought you to this,of what use was the road"?

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  6. #1481
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bromontane View Post
    VWAG did right by their customers in the wake of dieselgate. Plus, they're solvent.
    And they know how to make a lot of cars profitably.

  7. #1482
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    On September 10th 2018, investors filed a $10 billion lawsuit in Braunschweig, Germany against the company, seeking compensation for the up to 37 percent hit to Volkswagen’s share price following the revelations by the EPA. They argue that VW failed to meet its duty to warn shareholders about the scandal’s financial impact. “I expect the lawsuit to be successful,” Ferdinand Dudenhöffer, professor of Automotive Economics at the University of Duisburg-Essen, told The Verge. “Including this case and all other pending lawsuits, I assume that Volkswagen will have to pay another $15 billion in fines.”


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  8. #1483
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vt-Freeheel View Post
    At 6.3 sec 0-60 the Q4 will be quick enough for average Joe, most people shouldn't own 3-4 sec cars as they are above their skill level to drive.

    It's a good point it will probably be equivalant price-wise to an AWD drive model Y and not a base model. As for the rest, I don't pay attention to self-driving shit and don't see that's an advantage to getting a tesla, although it probably is to others as driver-assist..

  9. #1484
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4matic View Post
    On September 10th 2018, investors filed a $10 billion lawsuit in Braunschweig, Germany against the company, seeking compensation for the up to 37 percent hit to Volkswagen’s share price following the revelations by the EPA. They argue that VW failed to meet its duty to warn shareholders about the scandal’s financial impact. “I expect the lawsuit to be successful,” Ferdinand Dudenhöffer, professor of Automotive Economics at the University of Duisburg-Essen, told The Verge. “Including this case and all other pending lawsuits, I assume that Volkswagen will have to pay another $15 billion in fines.”


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    And, whatever happens, they'll be making cars in ten years , and Tesla won't.

  10. #1485
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    Quote Originally Posted by muted View Post
    It's a good point it will probably be equivalant to an AWD drive model Y and not a base model. As for the rest, I don't pay attention to self-driving shit and don't see that's an advantage to getting a tesla, although it probably is to others as driver-assist..
    Which is why I left out the self driving upgrade.

  11. #1486
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    Aren't German cars notorious for having electric issues already? I think I'd pass on a German EV until their reliability is proven.

  12. #1487
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    Quote Originally Posted by The AD View Post
    Aren't German cars notorious for having electric issues already? I think I'd pass on a German EV until their reliability is proven.
    Indeed. Better only lease one if you're interested in trying one out!

  13. #1488
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bromontane View Post
    How trumpian of you to embrace whataboutism. The fraud and incompetence of Tesla should be ignored because VWAG pooped on the floor. Just brilliant logic. That it's spouted by a guy who's made a life of driving 8 and 12 cylinder benzes adds icing to the stupidity cake.
    It's not about me. Why make it so? That's really as weak as it gets. Like Benny or Spook. I didn't make this thread about Audi, Porscheboy. Audi's suck anyway.

  14. #1489
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    Absolutely


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  15. #1490
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    You’re reaching. I’ve never claimed any virtuous notion. I do feel good about being contrarian to this thread if I were going to take a long position. You all are so convinced the collapse is nigh.


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  16. #1491
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    .
    Last edited by Groomer Gambler; 12-13-2019 at 07:49 AM.

  17. #1492
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bromontane View Post
    I bet $37 TSLA equity goes sub $80 by June 2020.

    Are
    you
    game


    bro
    Sure. That will keep it interesting.

  18. #1493
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    Quote Originally Posted by Groomer Gambler View Post
    Being able to order car online and never have to interact with sleazy car salespeople is absolutely brilliant. Especially for the millennial crowd.
    Tesla only had 24 stores and 80% sales were already online.

    Caravana already doing similar for used cars.

    I assume a user network or something like Turo for test drives.

  19. #1494
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    online-only retailers have been opening physical stores because the customer acquisition costs are lower than other alternatives. The biggest/best way to convince someone Tesla's are nice cars is to get them in the seat to drive one, there's a real high conversion rate in my observation. I don't think their "just get a testdrive with an existing owner" is a scalable solution. you will need some facilities, somewhere, to offer test drives/handle deliveries/handle returns - their expanded showroom network may be illsuited to that; but then they should have thought of that before the signed many year business leases. the whole u-turn on stores clusterfuck should give one pause, but it won't to stock bulls.

    maybe I'm just old and see the "buy car online, have it delivered to your door to find out the particular example they gave you is shitty, then fight for weeks to return it/get your money back" as a pita compared to prior practice.

  20. #1495
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunfree View Post
    maybe I'm just old and see the "buy car online, have it delivered to your door to find out the particular example they gave you is shitty, then fight for weeks to return it/get your money back" as a pita compared to prior practice.
    Where are you getting that from? It's literally the underpinning of the sales model that this is not the case.

  21. #1496
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    Tesla is closing dealerships but not its galleries. A gallery is where you can look and schedule a test drive but it's not a point of sale. There will still be close to 100 galleries in US still open and suspect that number continues to rise. More than 100 worldwide too.

    I suspect Tesla started dealerships just in case regulatory pressure required it (Texas and Michigan for example). Now that that risk is largely past there's no need to have them.
    Last edited by 4matic; 03-10-2019 at 11:13 AM.

  22. #1497
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    Wasn't Dunfree more talking about Carvana? They may not have many but Tesla does have showrooms.

    Personally I'd rather buy a car from Carmax than Carvana, at least you can look at it, sit in it and drive it before making any commitment. I think Carvana relies in buyer inertia at some level, "oh well, it's already here, I might as well just keep it..."

  23. #1498
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bromontane View Post
    this reporting backs up what's otherwise been noted in online customer feedback and summarily ignored by supporters.

    *they sent a full $40k refund to a guy that took delivery of his car without even paying (because the delivery personnel refused to accept payment, fwiw)*

    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/21/tesl...-detailed.html

    Attachment 273347
    More than a dozen people sampled, wow. What shit journalism, that doesn't back up anything. At least they said "in extreme cases' before explaining the real fuck ups, but still the average joe will read that article thinking it's a huge issue. Do I know if it is a huge issue? No, and it actually may be, but that article interviewed under 20 people.

  24. #1499
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    Carvana is an interesting model, but they could not compete in price with Carmax for me — found a cherry model in FL, payed to have it transferred to VA, still less than Carvana


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  25. #1500
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    Quote Originally Posted by iceman View Post
    Wasn't Dunfree more talking about Carvana? They may not have many but Tesla does have showrooms.
    more tesla, because they are trying to convert a brand into sales and get new customers in cars and Tesla's plan week before last was to close most of their showrooms. And tesla's had widely reported/forumed flakiness with operational issues. edit: I see between my typing and hitting submit, fanboy muted has come swooping in to say "nothings wrong" the reportings shit, as expected.

    carvana's just trying to sell used cars; if you are trying to buy a used Toyota Tacoma you know what you want or you can showroom it from a different dealer and all you need from carvana is too see if its in good shape. if carvana's really a "no questions 7-day moneyback" it's easier than some asshole on craigslist and probably alot less flakey.

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