Why your SUV sucks in the mountains

[GeezerSteve]

RE: East/west side of cascades

I'm happier driving in the cold zones at elevation. I feel like it's drier & more predictable at elevation, rather than the transitional wet/icy zone that I invariably need to cross coming up from the lowlands.

No doubt. W side of Casades 31F slick-as-snot and transitional conditions either side of same is dangerous shit.

[GPP33]

Won’t make the mistake of buying a Subbie again.

You and I both. 2005 XT was a fun car to drive while it worked but got sick of fixing it. It seems Subis either last forever or are total piles of shit. Not sure it classifies as a "lemon" when the piles of shit account for 50% of their production, I think it's just terrible engineering/execution and sometimes they get lucky.

[TAFKALVS]

RE: East/west side of cascades

I'm happier driving in the cold zones at elevation. I feel like it's drier & more predictable at elevation, rather than the transitional wet/icy zone that I invariably need to cross coming up from the lowlands.

Having lived on both sides of the hill, I would say I agree for the most part, but we also get some savage freezing rain events on this side which can make driving pretty horrible. I think it's a 6 to 1 1/2 dozen to another type deal. I think the dry snow argument applies more to further inland nearer the WA/OR border with Idaho/The Rockies.

[GeezerSteve]

6 to 1 1/2 dozen

that reduces to 1-to-3 bro

[jackattack]

lol

Punctuation is critical.

[TAFKALVS]

you all knew what I was saying. you're lucky I even give you people the time of day. my insights are unique and highly valuable.

[liv2ski]

4WD with all-season tyres (tires?) = 4 wheels spinning. Don't even consider stopping or turning which is generally important.

Winter rubber compound makes a huge difference, even on roads that are just wet when it's below 40*F. It's the price of doing business in places where it snows with some regularity.

Not entirely true. I have an AWD Volvo wagon and when mounted with Conti DWS tires (or any other M+S tire I have owned) I have never had a problem driving hundreds of miles in pretty scary conditions. One winter I walked into the time share office and the lady asked me how I got there (after a massive dump) and I replied I drove up the driveway. She was shocked.
But ya, good trend on a quality tire helps.

[PNWbrit]

Not entirely true.

Never mind that 4 wheels spinning is also a fundamental misunderstanding of how almost all AWD/4WD drive-trains actually work.

[Woodsy]

Never mind that 4 wheels spinning is also a fundamental misunderstanding of how almost all AWD/4WD drive-trains actually work.

if they go fast enough on a treadmill can they take off?

[TAFKALVS]

if they go fast enough on a treadmill can they take off?

Only with a Studless Nokian Tire.

[hutash]

Moose are no joke. Survived this a little over 3 years ago.
Attachment 257526

Wrong tire choice, obviously

[hutash]

The problem some us have have is we spend 99.5% of the time on dry warm roads, so winter tires are just not practical. I can drive 320 miles are perfectly dry, warm roads (death to snow tires), and maybe 10 miles (often 1/2 mile) on actual snow. M+S tires are just the only practical option, and work very well for such conditions.

That said, when I had my TT Quattro and ran real summer/performance tires, I did switch to snow tires and just had to accept the fact I was destroying them for the vast majority of the drive. It was a pain because I had to switch them several time each season unless I was doing back to back Mammoth trips.

[nickwm21]

Conti DWS is in another league for that all season / m/s tire. Seems to bridge the gap a little...


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[Rideski]

I wonder if we have a thread about all season tires.

[reckless toboggan]

you all knew what I was saying. you're lucky I even give you people the time of day. my insights are unique and highly valuable.

[blackalps]

this thread inspired me to go drive a couple Subarus today. Holy fuk, I did not know that A: a non-STI WRX could accelerate and handle like that and B: that my 4runner was anywhere near as bad as it is on the highway, in comparison. I mean, it scares me on a daily basis but shit. I didn't know it was that bad. In my defense, my last three vehicles were a 91 C1500, an 88 Ranger, and a 91 4x4 conversion lifted E350, and I DO actually spend a lot of the summer offroading. If there's a Subie that drives like that WRX with a bit more room I think I may have found my new car.

[GPP33]

this thread inspired me to go drive a couple Subarus today. Holy fuk, I did not know that A: a non-STI WRX could accelerate and handle like that and B: that my 4runner was anywhere near as bad as it is on the highway, in comparison. I mean, it scares me on a daily basis but shit. I didn't know it was that bad. In my defense, my last three vehicles were a 91 C1500, an 88 Ranger, and a 91 4x4 conversion lifted E350, and I DO actually spend a lot of the summer offroading. If there's a Subie that drives like that WRX with a bit more room I think I may have found my new car.

05 to 09 outbacks came with a turbo and the manuals were wicked fun to drive. Piles of shit though. They dropped the turbo in 10 and improved the shit rear suspension design, the newer V6 may have some balls but their CVT, while efficient, is the polar opposite of fun. We ditched the Subaru and got a highlander, significantly bigger and 50 more HP and ft-lb but the auto and extra weight make it slower and less fun. If it were my vehicle I would have gotten a Durango RT (hemi baby!) but the Toy was a better choice for my wife. The 4 runner and LX350 (same vehicle, LX350 is a better buy on the used market) come with decent V8s, they won’t handle like a WRX but can wheel and can get out of their own way. I’m assuming you have an older 4 runner?

[shroom]

buy the lgt or lower that outback xt and get that weight where it was engineered to be; not many bolt-ons to get to wagonrx.

[blackalps]

05 to 09 outbacks came with a turbo and the manuals were wicked fun to drive. Piles of shit though. They dropped the turbo in 10 and improved the shit rear suspension design, the newer V6 may have some balls but their CVT, while efficient, is the polar opposite of fun. We ditched the Subaru and got a highlander, significantly bigger and 50 more HP and ft-lb but the auto and extra weight make it slower and less fun. If it were my vehicle I would have gotten a Durango RT (hemi baby!) but the Toy was a better choice for my wife. The 4 runner and LX350 (same vehicle, LX350 is a better buy on the used market) come with decent V8s, they won’t handle like a WRX but can wheel and can get out of their own way. I’m assuming you have an older 4 runner?

yeah, I have a locked 5spd 98 with 200k. It's seriously good for offroading (done some very gnarly, nearly rock crawling trails in it with just 32's and no mods at all), is basically unstoppable in snow with the Blizzaks, has great interior space, etc. But it's a dog on the mountain passes here, which I spend at least an hour and a half to 2 hours a day driving on, sucks to drive on the interstate in general, and the gas mileage is killing me. Plus it's due for a lot of work, not to mention the shit ton of work I've already put into it in the last year. Basically the engine and electronics are every bit as reliable as Toyota's rep, but all of the moving parts around it have completely fallen apart in the last 15k miles. I'm reluctant to let go of the T4R, I just want something that's easier to drive on all these highway miles I'm doing, with better MPG, that I don't have to constantly replace parts on. and I cant' really afford to keep both at the moment.

[blackalps]

buy the lgt or lower that outback xt and get that weight where it was engineered to be; not many bolt-ons to get to wagonrx.

explain that last part?

[jackattack]

W agon R X

[jamal]

this thread inspired me to go drive a couple Subarus today. Holy fuk, I did not know that A: a non-STI WRX could accelerate and handle like that and B: that my 4runner was anywhere near as bad as it is on the highway, in comparison. I mean, it scares me on a daily basis but shit. I didn't know it was that bad. In my defense, my last three vehicles were a 91 C1500, an 88 Ranger, and a 91 4x4 conversion lifted E350, and I DO actually spend a lot of the summer offroading. If there's a Subie that drives like that WRX with a bit more room I think I may have found my new car.

How new are your shocks and when's the last time you got an alignment?

But yeah the wrx has had about the same power as an sti for awhile now. Big difference is the transmission, diffs, brakes. Well and they are completely different engines after 2015, but strangely it's the wrx that got updated. Sti engine hasn't really changed since 2004.

[blackalps]

W agon R X

yes, i got that part. I was wondering about some specifics.

[blackalps]

How new are your shocks and when's the last time you got an alignment?

But yeah the wrx has had about the same power as an sti for awhile now. Big difference is the transmission, diffs, brakes. Well and they are completely different engines after 2015, but strangely it's the wrx that got updated. Sti engine hasn't really changed since 2004.

shocks and coils old. Steering rack, bushings, tie rods, ball joints, end links, all new. alignment very recent.

[Dromond]

All ice tires (e.g., Blizzak, X-Ice, Hakka, Conti WinterContact) are snow tires. But not all snow tires are ice tires.

We have X-Ice xi3 on one vehicle, Blizzak DM-V2 on the other vehicle. I've had older Blizzaks on 2 other vehicles. X-Ice are wee better for all-around driving, although the DM-V2s are much better all-rounders than my older Blizzak models. Blizzaks seem a wee better on ice. Both are much better on ice than non-ice snow tires. Overall performance score where we drive Dec-March is a tie. Research suggests X-ice ice compound may last longer than Blizzak. If that's true, that would be the tie breaker.

Nice. I run xi3 on a Forester and have been very happy, but the Blizzak tread looks more open and like it might be better in deeper snow.

Regardless, if you want a legit winter tire that handles everyday driving well, the xi3 appears to me a great choice.

All the talk of not needing winter tires for 90% of the drive falls apart for me if/when the 10% involves making it up a sketchy twisting road with death fall off the side in blizzard/icy conditions. I’m willing to eat the cost of some suboptimal premature tire wear to avoid sliding off the road or needing to swap back to all seasons every time the weather warms up a little bit. CA does seem trickier where you are doing really long drives in legitimately warm, sunny weather 99% of the time.