Atomic Hawx Ultra XTD aka Hawk Extended aka HawX

[XXX-er]

you gotta do the shell fit to check for 9-16mm behind ( a sharpie felt pen is 15mm) the heel of a bare foot in the empty shell to make sure you got the right size boot shell to begin with and then there is the question if its the right shell for your foot

an intuition liner will not fix having the rong shell

you want tight the garmont G-fit liners from 15 yars ago were crazy before molding

[eSock]

Just got pro tours and molded for my hawx today and stoked to get em out on the snow. Fixed a lot of the liner irritation I was getting with the original liners, and they feel more substantial for actual skiing.

[Jongle]

I picked up a pair of the new Hawx Prime XTD 130s with mimic liners, first impressions follow.

For reference, my feet measure 24.5 but are pretty wide at the forefoot, ~105mm. I have big calves but low-volume heels and ankles, so it's difficult to find boots that have wide cuffs and toe boxes without having sloppy ankle hold. For the past few seasons I've been skiing Nordica Speechmachine 130s inbounds and Salomon Mtn Labs (heavily punched for forefoot and midfoot width) and Atomic Backland Carbons (head-molded shells and intuition liners) in the backcountry, all size 24.5. I tried on the Hawx Ultra (not Prime) XTD in the shop a couple of years ago and it crushed my feet, couldn't even close the lower buckles because the shell was bulging open on the top of my foot.

The Hawx Prime XTD has the best fit out of the box fit of any boot I've tried, although the Speedmachine is a close second and fits quite similarly. The heel pocket of the Prime is quite a bit snugger than the Mtn Lab or Backland. The Prime toe box is way less tapered than the Mtn Labs; midfoot feels good, but a bit of a pinch across the forefoot after an hour or so of skinning. Based on my experience heat molding the Backlands, I expect that the memory fit process will provide the extra few mm needed.

The range of motion is obviously much more restrictive than the Backlands, even with tongues in, and fairly similar to the Mtn labs. The Prime XTD flex pattern is nice and progressive (vs. the Mtn Lab, which feels like a brick wall in comparison). I've only taken the new boots on a couple of short tours, so I'll have to provide updated thoughts on performance after a bunch more days, but I'm very optimistic so far. I'll likely mold shells and liners before skiing them again, so it will be interesting to see if the Mimic liner lives up to the hype.

Weights for those interested:
Atomix Hawx Prime XTD, 24.5: 1560 grams per boot, everything stock
Salomon Mtn Lab, 24.5 (w/ Intuition Pro Tour liner): 1402 grams
Atomic Backland Carbon, 24.5 (tongues included; w/ Intuition Pro Tour Liner and Booster Strap): 1188 grams

[Lantern]

I've had the XTD 130 18/19, 19/20 and just got the new 20/21. I feel like ill spend most of my season in the new boot, maybe use last years for longer tours in the spring with the lighter liner.
Im hoping the new liner fixes the few gripes I had with the older boots and works as my 1 boot quiver.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

If anyone is ditching one of the lighter liners from and older pair of size 26 XTD's I might be interested if the price is right.

[eSock]

Just got pro tours and molded for my hawx today and stoked to get em out on the snow. Fixed a lot of the liner irritation I was getting with the original liners, and they feel more substantial for actual skiing.

Took em out this weekend and the irritation was mostly eliminated but a new issue reared it's ugly head: the boots were soggy af, felt like I was walking underwater half the day. At the car, after taking em off and taking the liners out I turned the boots over and about quarter cup of water spilled out. Gotta figure out why the boots were leaking like a sieve. I'm wondering if the bigger liners/reheating them blew out the boots too much and now they can't get a good seal.

[Benneke10]

Took em out this weekend and the irritation was mostly eliminated but a new issue reared it's ugly head: the boots were soggy af, felt like I was walking underwater half the day. At the car, after taking em off and taking the liners out I turned the boots over and about quarter cup of water spilled out. Gotta figure out why the boots were leaking like a sieve. I'm wondering if the bigger liners/reheating them blew out the boots too much and now they can't get a good seal.

Have you molded the shells? What year version do you have?

[bthomson22]

Anyone mold their mimic liners without the new tools they are suggesting you use (sock & specific toe cap)? Every shop in SLC that has the new bits is charging about $100 just for a liner mold....

[Benneke10]

Anyone mold their mimic liners without the new tools they are suggesting you use (sock & specific toe cap)? Every shop in SLC that has the new bits is charging about $100 just for a liner mold....

Have you tried Black Diamond in Millcreek? I was in there about a year ago and I think they offered to to an Atomic mold for $50

[onenerdykid]

A Mimic liner will require our process and tools to get the job done in order to prevent any fit or quality issues from arising. The fitting process itself is pretty straight forward, but rather specific in order to give you the best results. If our process isn't followed or the wrong tools are used, then it can lead to issues (which is true for basically any high-end liner customization process). Our oven will need to be used at the temperature & duration we specify- normal heat stacks or hot air blowers aren't good enough because they heat from the inside out and the real Mimic material is near the outside. We make toe caps, liner socks, and a shoe horn to make the liner installation and you stepping into the boot go as smoothly & as possible. Without them (or exact substitutes) there will be risks during the fitting process. So if shops don't have the right tools for the job, then it will most likely lead to a sub-par result and you'll be pretty bummed about that. We've done a lot of training for retailers that have brought Mimic in, so at least you'll know that the shops which have the tools will do it right and you'll have an awesome fitting boot when it's all said and done.

[Jongle]

My Hawx Prime XTDs fit great but need some more room at the 5th met head. It's tricky to visit a bootfitter right now, is it possible/advisable to just use a heat gun and IR thermometer to heat the shell while wearing the boots in order to create some extra room?

[abraham]

I'm looking at these as an option for a touring boot, is the new liner worth it for someone who's unlikely to use this as an inbounds boot? I am used to lacing up my liners before putting my boots on and likely would continue to do that with these in case that carries any weight.
The sizing is also a slight concern since I don't know how easy it is to go to the local shop and try these on at the moment. I assume there's no difference between this year's and last year's?

[gregL]

I'm looking at these as an option for a touring boot, is the new liner worth it for someone who's unlikely to use this as an inbounds boot? I am used to lacing up my liners before putting my boots on and likely would continue to do that with these in case that carries any weight.
The sizing is also a slight concern since I don't know how easy it is to go to the local shop and try these on at the moment. I assume there's no difference between this year's and last year's?

The difference is the Mimic liner for '20-'21. It's heavier, probably more comfortable, and molds well to the shell interior so less slippage, etc. If you only intend to tour in the boot the old model is about 135 grams lighter; if you intend to throw the liner away you may be able to get the old model for substantially less money.

Our shop is local to you, but we are operating at 25% capacity and bootfits are nominally "by appointment only." Chances are pretty good of getting a walk-in spot midweek, however, it just depends on the day.

[GoldenBC]

Interesting as my foot is similar. However, myself, and everyone I’ve ever fit boots for, feels that the Mtn Lab has a massive ankle. How did you find the ankle retention in the Mtn lab?

I picked up a pair of the new Hawx Prime XTD 130s with mimic liners, first impressions follow.

For reference, my feet measure 24.5 but are pretty wide at the forefoot, ~105mm. I have big calves but low-volume heels and ankles, so it's difficult to find boots that have wide cuffs and toe boxes without having sloppy ankle hold. For the past few seasons I've been skiing Nordica Speechmachine 130s inbounds and Salomon Mtn Labs (heavily punched for forefoot and midfoot width) and Atomic Backland Carbons (head-molded shells and intuition liners) in the backcountry, all size 24.5. I tried on the Hawx Ultra (not Prime) XTD in the shop a couple of years ago and it crushed my feet, couldn't even close the lower buckles because the shell was bulging open on the top of my foot.

The Hawx Prime XTD has the best fit out of the box fit of any boot I've tried, although the Speedmachine is a close second and fits quite similarly. The heel pocket of the Prime is quite a bit snugger than the Mtn Lab or Backland. The Prime toe box is way less tapered than the Mtn Labs; midfoot feels good, but a bit of a pinch across the forefoot after an hour or so of skinning. Based on my experience heat molding the Backlands, I expect that the memory fit process will provide the extra few mm needed.

The range of motion is obviously much more restrictive than the Backlands, even with tongues in, and fairly similar to the Mtn labs. The Prime XTD flex pattern is nice and progressive (vs. the Mtn Lab, which feels like a brick wall in comparison). I've only taken the new boots on a couple of short tours, so I'll have to provide updated thoughts on performance after a bunch more days, but I'm very optimistic so far. I'll likely mold shells and liners before skiing them again, so it will be interesting to see if the Mimic liner lives up to the hype.

Weights for those interested:
Atomix Hawx Prime XTD, 24.5: 1560 grams per boot, everything stock
Salomon Mtn Lab, 24.5 (w/ Intuition Pro Tour liner): 1402 grams
Atomic Backland Carbon, 24.5 (tongues included; w/ Intuition Pro Tour Liner and Booster Strap): 1188 grams

[Jongle]

Interesting as my foot is similar. However, myself, and everyone I’ve ever fit boots for, feels that the Mtn Lab has a massive ankle. How did you find the ankle retention in the Mtn lab?

I was able to get decent retention in the Mtn Lab after adding some extra padding around the ankles and spacers under the liners, but it was never ideal.

Back when I bought the Mtn Lab I could only compare it with a couple of other boots that were available in a size 24 (Scarpa Maestrale RS and Hawx Ultra XTD), and the Mtn Lab seemed like it would take the least work to fit to my feet. I got a couple of great seasons out of it but I think the Prime XTD is going to ski much better.

[pyromaniacman129]

Looking for some info on the Hawx Prime XTD 130 Tech GW.
I've been trying to find a boot that can withstand resort use and still tour a bit.
I'm a big dude skiing in a 31-31.5 (size 15) coming out of Lange rs130s.
I'm sure it wont be as stiff, but anyone running the Primes and have some intel?
Trying to find something that will work with a CAST setup has proven difficult in squatch sizing.

[doebedoe]

Looking for some info on the Hawx Prime XTD 130 Tech GW.
I've been trying to find a boot that can withstand resort use and still tour a bit.
I'm a big dude skiing in a 31-31.5 (size 15) coming out of Lange rs130s.
I'm sure it wont be as stiff, but anyone running the Primes and have some intel?
Trying to find something that will work with a CAST setup has proven difficult in squatch sizing.

I'm way smaller than you (size 27) and in the Ultras. I think the only real diff between Prime and Ultra is last width -- flex should be the same. (Unlike some, I'm pretty sure Atomic Hawx series actually has different external molds for the Ultra/Prime, not just different internal plugs -- onenerdy to confirm).

I find my 130s ski just a hair softer than my Lange 130RX (Dual Core). Where they lack in comparison is smoothness of flex, a bit of rebound, and mostly dampening. A better inbounds liner would help this a bit (I'm on the orig Hawx liner which is very touring oriented.) But at the end of the day, a bolted together spine and a 2200g full PU-Ether boot is going to be better going downhill than a 1500g gram boot with a walk mode. At least for the time being.

[pyromaniacman129]

I'm way smaller than you (size 27) and in the Ultras. I think the only real diff between Prime and Ultra is last width -- flex should be the same. (Unlike some, I'm pretty sure Atomic Hawx series actually has different external molds for the Ultra/Prime, not just different internal plugs -- onenerdy to confirm).

I find my 130s ski just a hair softer than my Lange 130RX (Dual Core). Where they lack in comparison is smoothness of flex, a bit of rebound, and mostly dampening. A better inbounds liner would help this a bit (I'm on the orig Hawx liner which is very touring oriented.) But at the end of the day, a bolted together spine and a 2200g full PU-Ether boot is going to be better going downhill than a 1500g gram boot with a walk mode. At least for the time being.

Thanks for the input. Definitely can't expect something with a walk mode to ski like an RS. Gotta have compromise somewhere with a touring capable boot.
I'm actually hoping the ultra will fit my foot better than the RS which took quite a bit of boot work to really get into.
It'd be rad if the BSL of the hawx in a 31.5 was similar to my lange (356bsl) and i could pick a boot depending on the day and ski in bounds or out since im going to go CAST.
Now to see if i can even find a pair in 31.5 or 32. Oof this is gonna be expensive.
If anyone has a source let me know - most i've called say they can't get em. Might have to call Atomic directly and see who bought em. Thats how i found my Langes.

[skifishbum]

I ain't skied the new ones yet
But last year's was a boot improved from the season's before
My only gripes was cheesedick liner and a pita to git on and off
Both which are vastly improved
Strong work continuing to make a great boot better every season
Nerdykid

[gregL]

. . . ( a sharpie felt pen is 15mm) . . .

In the States, a Sharpie is 12mm . . . my finger is 15mm.

"Bend forward, I'm gonna put my finger in there . . . this may feel tight!"

[onenerdykid]

Thanks for the input. Definitely can't expect something with a walk mode to ski like an RS. Gotta have compromise somewhere with a touring capable boot.
I'm actually hoping the ultra will fit my foot better than the RS which took quite a bit of boot work to really get into.
It'd be rad if the BSL of the hawx in a 31.5 was similar to my lange (356bsl) and i could pick a boot depending on the day and ski in bounds or out since im going to go CAST.
Now to see if i can even find a pair in 31.5 or 32. Oof this is gonna be expensive.
If anyone has a source let me know - most i've called say they can't get em. Might have to call Atomic directly and see who bought em. Thats how i found my Langes.

Sent you a PM, but figured I'd repeat some of it here for public info. In our Prime and Prime XTD boots, the 31/31.5 size uses a 32/32.5 shell but with a thicker liner to fit like a 31. This isn't perfect, but it's hard to justify the mold costs given how few of these we actually sell. But I think this is good news for you because I think you will want the 32 for touring rather than a 31. You mentioned to me that you are crammed into the 31 Lange and I doubt you will want that tight of a fit for going uphill. For example, I measure 27.4cm on one foot and 27.8cm on the other. I ski a 26/26.5 alpine boot (1cm shell fit) but I couldn't do that in my touring boots, so my Backlands and Ultra XTDs are 27/27.5 (2cm shell fit). If that describes how your 31 Langes fit, then I would guess that you should search for the 32/32.5 Prime XTD. It's impossible for me to say for sure, but that's my internet guess based on how tight you said your Langes are.

[onenerdykid]

I'm way smaller than you (size 27) and in the Ultras. I think the only real diff between Prime and Ultra is last width -- flex should be the same. (Unlike some, I'm pretty sure Atomic Hawx series actually has different external molds for the Ultra/Prime, not just different internal plugs -- onenerdy to confirm).

I find my 130s ski just a hair softer than my Lange 130RX (Dual Core). Where they lack in comparison is smoothness of flex, a bit of rebound, and mostly dampening. A better inbounds liner would help this a bit (I'm on the orig Hawx liner which is very touring oriented.) But at the end of the day, a bolted together spine and a 2200g full PU-Ether boot is going to be better going downhill than a 1500g gram boot with a walk mode. At least for the time being.

We use separate molds and separate lasts for our different fits, rather than one outer mold with two different internal lasts. This allows us to provide dedicated narrow fits and dedicated medium fits. We prefer that approach instead of the other.

The current generation of Hawx XTD boots definitely provide way more damping, smoothness, and foot hold than the first ones. The new liners and new power straps really go a long way here.

[doebedoe]

We use separate molds and separate lasts for our different fits, rather than one outer mold with two different internal lasts. This allows us to provide dedicated narrow fits and dedicated medium fits. We prefer that approach instead of the other.

The current generation of Hawx XTD boots definitely provide way more damping, smoothness, and foot hold than the first ones. The new liners and new power straps really go a long way here.

I figured that diff external molds and internal lasts/plugs were necessary for boots where weight is a concern. I mention this because it recently came to my attention that the external mold of a very popular alpine boot is the same whether you get it in the "normal volume" or "standard volume" version. They just switch up the internal plug meaning the narrower one has far more plastic to work with.

And I totally believe a more downhill-oriented liner and Booster type strap would provide a much smoother ride. Heck, I noticed a real difference just switching out the first gen strap for a long Voile strap.

[doebedoe]

The new ones are easier to get on and off? Dang, that's good to know when mine finally wear out. That is my single biggest complaint. Fuck getting them on when camping in a tent in winter.

I also second not needing to size-down my XTDs. The heel pocket/instep design design is tight / anatomical enough (for me) that I can stay in my measured size without any heel lift issues.

[Eluder]

I moved from 2020 Ultras to the new Prime Xtd 130's this season. I really needed the extra space for touring but IMO the they ski better, I have just been using Pro Tours in them thus far but will put the mimics in once the lifts start spinning and give them a go there. So I think a lot of that improvement is even just the new power strap. I have run booster for years but I think I like these better, they seem to be more like the ones Pulse boot lab makes. They don't really give but they conform and fit tight. I don't need these to be an inbounds boot but if they can be.... I will say putting these boots on is a chore. With the Pro Tours its pretty simple, I put the liners on first and go, you cant really do that with the Mimic.