Bro 188 Stiff, Stockli Stormrider DP, Blizzard Titan 9

[comish]

Me:
5ft 9in
160ish lbs
Non racer, weekend warrier mostly off-piste western skier with Mammoth as home mtn.
Tested at Mammoth on spring conditions for a few runs (3-5) each

Previous skis liked: Dynastar 4x4 Big (favorite flex), 180 Pow +, Sugar Daddy is ok, Thought Head IM85 and Explosive were ok.

Previous skis disliked: Sanouk (too long and soft, tips flopped all over, only good for really soft long turns for me), Rossi's (B4, XXX)

Previous review of LP and Mantra
http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=72467

My search for the ultimate mid 90mm 180ish everyday ski for me continues. My gear hording as a result is progressing to epic levels at the moment. Coming to a gear swap near you in the fall, Comish's redunkulous overabundance of skis. I have basically been riding a pair of the Orange race room LP's most of the season mounted I think a little forward (thats how they were when I purchased them). I'm absolutely in love with these on anything smooth. Groomers, corn, smooth off-piste. Its when things get bumpy, cruddy, or tight that my love affair dies. They are heavy and a wee bit too stiff for this kid in the bumpy cruddy off-piste that i get bucked around. Maybe its the mounting point, maybe its a wee big too much ski... Hence my ongoing search.

'07 Stockli DP 184
These had been skied a few days but were in good shape. The ski is a bit lighter and softer than the LP and actually seems to be a hair longer running surface wise because of the flat tail. The main difference though is the flex pattern. The front 12 - 18inches is reeeally soft. Shockingly soft for a Stockli. The LP has a nice soft tip, but its just the front say 6 inches and its just slightly softer, while the DP is downride soft. The middle and tail are still firm, but overall this isn't a beast of a ski as some of the past models were.

I think it will be awesome in the mid-winter off-piste. The soft tip just absorbs all sorts of bumps, crud, etc and allows one to stay forward and charge and not get bumped / banged into the backseat. The ski is still relatively stiff underfoot so its still stable and damp. On groomers, that same soft tip that makes it awesome in the off-piste doesn't bite into the snow. Its that aspect of the LP's that makes them so fricken awesome / amazing on the groomers, but also makes them a little too much in the off-piste for me. Still pretty smooth and damp. Can't say there is a big difference there. Damn it. Maybe there is no "perfect ski". The other nice thing about the DP is its a little lighter than the LP giving me a little more confidence in the steep / tight that I will get the dang thing around.

Need to try them in winter snow, but basically awesome off-piste, ok on-piste. Could be a good 1 ski quiver.

'07 Blizzard Titan 9 181:

This thing is a very short 181 because of the moderate twin. Higher than the LP, but not a full black Goat twin, although it did seem to have a longer running surface than the 178 Bro in my highly scientific base-to-base and eyeball the length test. Really nice feel / flex. Stiffish, but definitely softer than the LP. Doesn't have quite as soft a tip as the DP so bites better on the groomed. Its got a slightly livier feel than the LP and is definitely lighter than either the DP or LP and with its tighter turn radius was pretty dang fun to arc turns on. This ski in a 185 w/ a wider (say 95mm) waist would be perfect. The 188cm is apparently more like what I wish the 181 was. When bombing the bottom of the ch23 bowls I was wishing for a bit more length and prolly a longer turn radius so don't think this is enough ski for mid-winter charging through crud. Very fun on the groomed, in the bumps, the corn, and just enough girth for the slush. All in all a really really fun ski. Might be my western US hardpack ski in the future. Tighter turn radius enables more turns, stiffish flex seems to hold pretty well... Very solid ski.

188 Bro stiffs
I hadn't ridden a pair of Bro's since some of the earlier demo's Vets used to drive around with. I found these to be a better ride than I remembered and torsionally stiffer. A perfect flex. I wouldn't have changed that at all. Slots in nicely as softer than the LP and probably similar to the DP but with a stiffer tip than the DP. No metal so the ski is lighter and more lively than either of the other skis. When you got it arced way over on edge the ski held very well and was quite stable. I didn't find the sidecut as easy to make different size turns as the LP. (another of my favorite aspects of the LP is its ability to make all kinds of turn shapes) Ultimately if this were around a 183cm ish length and a few cm narrower I would consider the Bro. I have narrowed 95m underfoot down as my favorite waist width for hardpack, groomers, and > 2 or 3 days after a storm. The 99mm (if I remember correctly) can absolutely be skied in those conditions, but I'm finding something a little narrower to be more fun, hold on the hardpack better, and fit what I'm looking for more. I also found them a touch long for me (yes I'm a pansy). I could ride them at that length fine, and if all I did was charge 100% of the time making big turns then the length would be good, but for a versatile everyday ski for me, a wee bit too long. I think I also have grown to like skis with the damp, smoooooth feel of metal in them. This wouldn't be a deal breaker for me and the Bro's because I thought the flex was so good, just something I do like about the DP and LP.

My search continues...

[pechelman]

that is one hell of a solid comparison

nice work!

Im with you on the LPs. I love mine, but wish they took a little weight out of them and softened them up a TAD throughout. Otherwise theyre freaking fun.

[dk_alaskan]

Have you heard anything about the 193 DP's? if so, how do they compare to the 184 DP's or the 188 Stiff Bro's with an upturned tail and lots o camber?

[splat]

I wish you had skied the 179 fats, Doug.
I think they would have blown you away.

[J-Rad]

Have you heard anything about the 193 DP's? if so, how do they compare to the 184 DP's or the 188 Stiff Bro's with an upturned tail and lots o camber?

Haven't skied the 193 DPs but the guys in the shop claim it is the stiffest in the DP series. In fact, one of the guys called it "ridiculously stiff". The 201 softens up quite a bit again and is supposed to be the easiest DP to ski. Having disliked the uber soft tip of the 184, I would like to give the 193s a spin.

Comish - have you tried the SS Pro? A lot stiffer then the DP and a lot more ski. Much better bite on the groomed - they are the fastest and most stable wide ski I have ever been on. Length is somewhat tricky - comes in a 178 and 188 neither of which were quite right for the rest of the dimensions of the ski for me (I might have bought the SS Pro in a 184 if it came in that length).

[philippeR]

The 193 DP is not 'ridiculously stiff', but medium. I flexed a pair a few weeks ago (demos, mint condition, end of seaon sales, for 200E with bindings...)
It had a rather soft tip for a Stöckli.

[comish]

I wish you had skied the 179 fats, Doug.
I think they would have blown you away.

Wish I had too, but too little time, too many skis. I also really wanted to try Dookey's AK King Salmons, but same dealeo.

Considering I'm looking for something around 95mm that is why I didn't jump on them, but hopefully sometime next year. Splat, another thing, are we ever gonna make turns or just continue drinking? It seems I only ever see you at the bar Roberto's with teh ski press, Sidedoor with your Frenchies, etc...

[XtrPickels]

Comish- The AK King Salmons might be the boat that you are looking for. They are a bit stiffer throughout than the DP's. Engage a carve easier than a 188 Bro and for a 180 track really well when they are on edge.

Dimensions are in the range you want.

Compared to the narrower 179 stiff, AKs move edge to edge quicker, engage a carve quicker, but lack in float(I mounted my bro's -1, which is about the same as the line on the AK's). My bros are also flat cambered, while the AK's are normal cambered. This makes the bro's a little more "surfy" and not as locked into a turn. Keep in mind, that these skis are pretty similar and when I'm pointing out differences, they are far from drastic. Both skis are very stable and intuitive.


The only thing I would say is that float is not all that spectacular. Mine are mounted on the line, I would mount them -2 if you ski primarily softer snow. On the line they are very versatile... handling hardpack with a centered stance and fresh snow with a slight shift back.

[Steven S. Dallas]

Comish, have you ever skied the Seth Pistol or Vicious? If so I'm interested to know what you thought of those- I've wanted to try a couple of the boards you have reviewed, and the first gen Pistol is still my favorite ski evah.

[splat]

Wish I had too, but too little time, too many skis. I also really wanted to try Dookey's AK King Salmons, but same dealeo.

Considering I'm looking for something around 95mm that is why I didn't jump on them, but hopefully sometime next year. Splat, another thing, are we ever gonna make turns or just continue drinking? It seems I only ever see you at the bar Roberto's with teh ski press, Sidedoor with your Frenchies, etc...

What's even worse is that bar-meeting extends all the way to Cham - and still we haven't skied.