ABS pack review

**Toby** · 12-10-2006, 10:21 PM

I got my ABS airbag pack from mntlion last week. So here are some pics and a few words.

Pack back:

Technical features:

You can see the gas canister, the cable that's part of the trigger mechanism, the folded airbags in the sides, the flap that covers the canister/cable compartment.

Here it is full of some gear:

And zipped up with the gear + a down jacket:

There's actually quite a bit of space left in there but the down jacket expanded so it looks packed.

The pack's heavy. <metric alert/> It weighs about 3.2kg empty. And about 9.4kg with all that stuff in there. Realistically I'll be able to cut it down to about 7kg without the rope, but that's still a lot of weight to lug around all day.

The pocket system is fairly primitive. There are no outside compartments. The lid has zip-up compartments to put various things in as long as they're smallish and/or flattish. There is a decent amount of room in there - it's bigger than my 40L Dana Design Sphinx that was my go-to daypack, even with all the airbag stuff. My down jacket's hudge, but it fits easy with all the other gear.

The ergonomics are also fairly primitive, but it's surprisingly comfortable. Maybe the most comfortable pack I've worn. Time will tell if I think the same after wearing it for long periods with weight in it. Hopefully the comfort will offset the weight.

I got the unadvertised guide-pack. Mntlion's other ones are smaller but I'm sure they fit a bunch of stuff. I wanted the guide because it only weighs 100g more or so (per the ABS spec) but has much more room. The only thing to watch out for is the length. The packs are kind of squat (all of the models?). I would've preferred them longer and skinnier. In the picture with all the gear inside, you can see my probe, saw and shovel handle are kind of A-framed in there to fit. There are skins taking up some space at the bottom of the pack and without those the long things fit straight up but the packs not much longer than 50cm (the probe's 51.5cm from memory). Maybe it's to offset the space taken up width-wise by the airbags.

The pack won't carry skis A-frame style. I will use those straps on the back to carry them diagonal. Even then, the straps are barely wide enough to fit wide Bros in each divided half. I think the gap's 115mm. Loosened there should be enough room. I dread the thought of a full pack with 192 Bros up there anyway. That won't be light.

Lastly, a sneak preview of a future TR:

I'm hesitant to cut holes in my new pack, but I'm going to anyway.

**libtech777** · 12-30-2008, 05:07 PM

What size is the pack in pictures. Im looking at getting one but the biggest it looks like they have available is 30L. Is this right?

**Toby** · 12-30-2008, 06:33 PM

Pretty sure it was marketed as 30L. The second biggest in the second oldest range. Since then I think they've brought out two new ranges, dunno how they compare size-wise. I don't know how they measure their sizes. You've gotta bear in mind that the airbags take up significant room, so when they say 30L is it 30L + airbags or 30L - airbags? I'm pretty sure it's the former, since mine fits a reasonable amount of gear, good for day tripping. The next one up seems much bigger, more for overnighters and probably too bulky for yoyoing. It'd be good to have an overnighter and a lighter day-tripper. I don't recall but maybe the new range of zip-on airbags meets the criteria without being too cost-prohibitive (i.e. buy one set of airbags for two packs).

**Toby** · 12-30-2008, 06:37 PM

OK, just looked at http://www.abs-airbag.com. The new Vario range would be the system to get if coin wasn't an issue.

**fez** · 12-31-2008, 11:46 AM

here's some food for thought:

Originally Posted by GNFAC

Yesterday, three snowmobilers were sitting on the flats below the south face of Crown Butte outside Cooke City. They had their sleds turned off when another rider on an adjacent hill unknowingly triggered the slope above them. They fired up their machines and full throttled out, but one rider’s snowmobile took one pull too many and he lost the race with the avalanche. He was tumbled for 100 yards. He was wearing an ABS airbag pack as well as a beacon. When he pulled the handle of the ABS it broke off in his hand without deploying! As soon as the slide stopped his two partners saw the ski and skid plate of the sled sticking out of the snow, rushed over and found a glove and boot wiggling frantically. They dug him up and the buried rider was ok. Even though they were in the flats, they were exposed to the runout zone of the avalanche path above them. This close call is a reminder to be extra careful since its dangerous to even be near avalanche terrain right now. We are continuing the Avalanche Warning since avalanches are likely and a HIGH danger exists on all slopes in the southern mountains.

http://www.mtavalanche.com/current/

**plywood** · 12-31-2008, 03:04 PM

a little bird told me ABS is going to bring out new stuff...such as newly designed packs for their vario line and an addition to the existing packs that allows your friends to pull the trigger of your backpack. some kind of remote control thingy.
don`t ask me how it works exactely, we`ll see at ISPO. but just imagine how much fun it would be to play around with such a remote control in a gondula with 5 guys wearing an ABS

**Cliff Huckable** · 01-01-2009, 03:12 AM

Originally Posted by plywood

a little bird told me ABS is going to bring out new stuff...such as newly designed packs for their vario line and an addition to the existing packs that allows your friends to pull the trigger of your backpack. some kind of remote control thingy.
....

When? The avalanches are angry now!

Does the little bird have anything to say about the handle breaking off, as mentioned at fez's link? SAME LINK HERE

**plywood** · 01-02-2009, 01:28 PM

as far as i`m informed (what i`m not really) they`ll present this system at the winter ISPO in munich this february. so it will be on the market next season i think. i`ve only got a link in german... ( http://snowout.de/2008/12/11/abs-fernauslosung/ ).

well, i did ask the birdie about the broken handle. and he told me following: ABS posts a statistic on their site in cooperation with the SLF, the swiss institute for snow and avalanche research. this statistic startet in 1991 and they collected quite some data regarding accidents with ABS involved. as you get a refill unit for free if you triggered the system in an accident if you report it they should be able to capture nearly all accidents - up to date (11th september 2008) they counted 167 accidents on which 200 people equipped with ABS were involved. I`ll conclude it for you as this statistic in in german too. but you can get a pdf of it here: http://www.abs-lawinenairbag.de/_doc...ang=de&dwid=25 (direct link to the pdf which will open in a new window)

so the results: from these 200 people 180 had inflated airbags. from those 180 82 were not burried, 64 were partly burried and 20 were fully burried (17 with visible airbags, on 3 occasions the airbags got covered too. 14 unknown.
from these 180 people with inflated airbags 15 got injured and 3 got killed (those 3 were fully burried, 2 died due to their fall and 1 got burried in a second avalanche). so far the "good news" as far as the statistics go.
now comes the more interesting part, also in context with the broken handle: the 20 people without inflated airbags. 16 people didn`t trigger their ABS due to "human failure" (10 didn`t trigger due to mental, physiological or mechanical reasons [4 of them dead], 4 because they didn`t install the handle [2 of them dead] and 2 didn`t want to trigger). which means that 4 times the airbags didn`t inflate due to technical failure. 2 times malfunction of a mono-airbag (early systems), on 1 accident only one airbag was inflated (on a dual airbag system) and one time the system failed due to a jammed trigger unit.
so if this guy reported the broken handle to ABS it should find it`s way to the statistic too (yeh, i know what they say about statistics - don`t trust any of them unless you faked them yourself.)

for the record: i`m not one of THEM (ABS), i just did search for these infos recently because i was very critical if those packs are really worth their money. but they could convince me...

**srsosbso** · 01-02-2009, 07:31 PM

I'm reading the latest edition of the Bruce Tremper 'Staying Alive in Avalanche Terrain' book right now and he is certainly enthused about the prospects for avalanche air bags. He goes so far as to call them "the most promising technology to come along in the past 60 years," especially in light of the rather dismal stats for avalanche transceivers (which improve survival rates only 10%- YES, ONLY TEN PERCENT) amongst recreational users.

**splat** · 01-03-2009, 07:57 PM

Hey, Toby.....long time.

Is that last gizmo a lung inflation device that hooks an avalung into the inflation canister to bypass the airbag and give you more room in the pack?

**jondrums** · 01-04-2009, 02:28 AM

I would have thought that they'd use CO2 for the airbags, but apparently not. they say its nitrogen+oxygen mixture - can these be refilled at a scuba shop?

according to wikipedia normal breathing consumes .5L per breath and 10 per minute, so that would yield something like 15 minutes of breathing air if it was hooked into one of the 75L bags.

I would think that this type of project should only be attempted by someone with more skillz and tools available than the standard homedepot type stuff. There'd be a good chance of compromising the proper inflation of the bags.

**LeeLau** · 01-19-2009, 09:36 PM

Got one and will review here

**FeralDirtbag** · 01-20-2009, 04:23 PM

Millet is now making packs that accept ABS Inserts. I just ran across these while checking out their ski touring packs.

ABS Rider 18
http://www.millet.fr/catalogue/abs-r...cPath=61_75_76

ABS Protool 28
http://www.millet.fr/catalogue/abs-p...cPath=61_75_76

ABS-Millet Partnership Fluff
http://www.millet.fr/partnerships/abs.html

**Kai** · 01-20-2009, 09:44 PM

Originally Posted by FeralDirtbag

Millet is now making packs that accept ABS Inserts. I just ran across these while checking out their ski touring packs.

ABS Rider 18
http://www.millet.fr/catalogue/abs-r...cPath=61_75_76

ABS Protool 28
http://www.millet.fr/catalogue/abs-p...cPath=61_75_76

ABS-Millet Partnership Fluff
http://www.millet.fr/partnerships/abs.html

As of last year, they weren't available in the US. (I tried to get one from the US distributer.) I wonder if they are making to the US this season.

**JoeStrummer** · 01-20-2009, 10:16 PM

hmmmmm. . . . I have been reluctant to purchase one of these, but from the science-y illustration on the Millet website there are some clear advantages in being the "Avec Airbag" guy over the "Sans Airbag" guy.

**Schnappi** · 01-21-2009, 08:35 AM

I swear I've seen another Millet ABS pack different from the ones on the Millet site. It looked nice, but not particularly burly.

After 4 or 5 years, my Deuter based ABS pack is getting pretty beat. The zippers are breaking/broken, the shovel pouch has a big tear in it and one of the shoulder adjustment straps fell off. If they weren't so expensive, I'd get one of the new packs w/ a Millet.

**verbier61** · 01-21-2009, 09:59 AM

A guy told me that there is a new ABS which is a bit more protective for the head, more like the snowpulse. But I haven't seen anything new in ABS sites etc. Can anyone confirm? the millet looks identical to the classic ABS...

**verbier61** · 01-21-2009, 10:45 AM

got it:
snowpulse

new ABS:

**Kai** · 01-21-2009, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by verbier61

A guy told me that there is a new ABS which is a bit more protective for the head, more like the snowpulse. But I haven't seen anything new in ABS sites etc. Can anyone confirm? the millet looks identical to the classic ABS...

I own both.

I just reviewed the snowpulse here:

http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...d.php?t=147673

**Micol** · 01-23-2009, 01:32 AM

I couldn't find any prices listed from any of their dealers in WY or CO
anyone have details on pricing? I've got a 15L Vario, but thinkin about a bigger volume pack to change out for overnights.

Originally Posted by FeralDirtbag

Millet is now making packs that accept ABS Inserts. I just ran across these while checking out their ski touring packs.

ABS Rider 18
http://www.millet.fr/catalogue/abs-r...cPath=61_75_76

ABS Protool 28
http://www.millet.fr/catalogue/abs-p...cPath=61_75_76

ABS-Millet Partnership Fluff
http://www.millet.fr/partnerships/abs.html

**powders** · 01-28-2009, 11:30 AM

Anyone had any experience, hassles flying in /out of the US with the ABS including the canisters?

**hway2** · 01-28-2009, 12:14 PM

MiCool - the only way I was able to find to buy the Millet ABS compatible packs is to buy them from a european store and have it shipped. Cham3S quoted me around $200 for the protool 28 and shipping to seattle. Marmot sells Millet in the US and I asked them to contact Millet and buy it for me from Millet, but Millet wouldnt do it.

In the meantime, I learned about the BCA Float 30 coming out next year and decided to save the dough and wait - and get what will most likely be a more functional pack.

**flip** · 01-28-2009, 01:46 PM

Originally Posted by Toby

Lastly, a sneak preview of a future TR:

I'm hesitant to cut holes in my new pack, but I'm going to anyway.

Did you cut this snorkel out of a BD Avalung, or were you able to get the parts new?

ABS plus avalung plus transceiver would be some serious avalanche safety gear... you planning to go jump up and down on a some wind-loaded faces while throwing m80s uphill?