Kerry sex scandal. (NSR)

[ColdSmoke]

Originally posted by 1080Rider
What about .. almost getting impeached?

He did in fact get impeached. He and Andrew Johnson share the lowly distinction of "impeached presidents".

[splat]

The problems with politics and war are that politicians lie to enrichen themsleves and their cohorts - and in most wars,soldiers die under the false pretenses of fighting for freedom, when it seems that instead they are dying for politicians enriching themselves through power plays. A recurrent theme. Politics+Power+Money = dead soldiers, poor citizens and more lying than I will bother listening to.

A friend of mine said they should line all the politicians up in a field and kill half of them. And make the other half watch. Maybe then they'd take seriously their obligations to the people instead of themselves. Historically, it's worked for both the French and the British.

[grrrr]

TJ, stop hiding behind the "thank a vet" campaign to avoid the issue. This has nothing to do with you or what you did or didn't do.

Kerry had every right to protest the war in Viet Nam. More right to protest it in fact, than the politicians in DC ever had to pursue it.

If you can stand there and say he should have kept his mouth shut because he was a veteran, then you are wrong. Would you say the same to the 40,000 draftees inducted in December of 1970? They did not choose to go to Viet Nam, but they certainly earned the right to stand up and say it was wrong.

[TJ.Brk]

Originally posted by grrrr
TJ, stop hiding behind the "thank a vet" campaign to avoid the issue. This has nothing to do with you or what you did or didn't do.

Kerry had every right to protest the war in Viet Nam. More right to protest it in fact, than the politicians in DC ever had to pursue it.

If you can stand there and say he should have kept his mouth shut because he was a veteran, then you are wrong. Would you say the same to the 40,000 draftees inducted in December of 1970? They did not choose to go to Viet Nam, but they certainly earned the right to stand up and say it was wrong.

Grrr. I was 10 years old protesting that war (I was finishing Junior High when Saigon fell). With my sister shortly after her Boyfriend, Kenny (a Marine) went missing in action. It even made the National news because the protest was at the University of Cincinnati where my sister was attending cllege, and the protest got out of hand. To this day Kenny is still MIA. To this day the thought of Vietnam makes me sick to my stomach. I went into the service just a few short years after the fall of Saigon, when joining the military was anything but popular. I to was told by many in my class: "so you are going to become a baby burner". I joined the military because my father, his father, his fathers father, and his fathers fathers father did because someone has to step up and protect the USA from harm. Freedom, right or wrong, has a terrible price. Some of us are willing to pay for it with their actions. To me that wieghs more than calling someone a loser, or hiding on a chatroom.

Now your not old enough to remember that time period. You most likely weren't even born. But it was crazy. I remember watching Kerry speaking on TV during a march on Washington. Holding a sign that said: "stop the murder of children". By that statement upon the sign he held, he was making a clear statement that his fellow vets were murderers. Since you are not a Vet that has fought for this country you can have no idea how badly that hurts. Especially when being called that by one of your own. And he did this as a jumping off point for Political gain.

Now sure there have been veterans that have spoken up for Kerry. But there is alot that think he is a back stabbing piece of shit. Only they don't go on TV, or the liberal press won't put it on (for the record I am an independent). I still belong to the local VFW, American Legion, AmVet's in my home town. I still get the monthy new letters. And all are urging Vets to not support him for his previous deeds. Complete with full color picture of him with Jane Fonda. Not the one of them setting down. But of them holding hands arms raised.

I wasn't hiding behind any issue. Kerry fought hard in Vietnam. Yes he has a right to protest the USA's involvement (I did too). But calling your fellow Vets murderer's of children cross's the line.

His speeches against the special interests, and then it turns out he has accepted more special interest money than any other Current Senator. Well it's quite hypocritical. Right now Edwards has my vote.

Now if you want to discuss this more. Let's do it via PM. Who knows maybe we both might learn a thing or two. OK


*note* Senator Kerrys voting record for Veteran's and Military spending isn't good. He has voted NO on all increase's for Veteran's since he has been in the Senate, and only voted yes one time for a military increase because the contract would bring some Jobs to Mass. Senator Kerry's voting record can be found from his office website, the Library of Congress, and the GAO

[1080Rider]

Dex, you may think my comments are uneducated. I in fact know what the fack each goverment officer should do. Your clinton made a total fucking joke of the office. You as an american should be ashamed of the circus he created. The entire world laghed at us for having a complete idiot as our leader. Again, the stuff you complain about conservative presidents is politics. A president will make controvercial decisions. That is why we elect them. When a president makes a mockery of the presidential office the entire political system suffers. Since you obviously have your finger on the pulse of Washington, why don't you tell me what exactly conservative presidents have done to denegrate the presidential office.

[Tippster]

Originally posted by 1080Rider
Dex, you may think my comments are uneducated. I in fact know what the fack each goverment officer should do. Your BUSH made a total fucking joke of the office. You as an american should be ashamed of the circus he created. The entire world laghed at us for having a complete idiot as our leader...

There. Now it makes sense.

You, sir, need to stop watching Fox News or listening to Rush Limbaugh. They've curdled your grey matter.

To answer the rest:


Nixon - Watergate. He wasn't impeached because he quit first. He was about to be criminally prosecuted when:

Ford - Pardoned Nixon

Reagan - Lying to CONGRESS 27 times (under oath) in the Iran-Contra scandal: "I cannot recall..." Just how retarded was he, then?

Bush - "read my lips..." "It's the ECONOMY, Stupid..." BTW - he had a thing going with his secretary, but the LIBERAL media kept a lid on it.

Please don't tell me Clinton lied under oath. He said "I did not have sexual relations with that woman..." on television, not in court. Don't re-write history to fit your agenda. Did he lie? Yes. Was he the first to lie? Hahahaha. Did he lie about something that was PERFECTLY LEGAL? Ahhhh..... yes he did. Did it "Soil the Office?" Hardly.

[splat]

As one currently traveling Europe and having encountered people from at least 15 other countries, I've talked to them enough to hit the political issues. I'll certainly confirm they weren't laughing when the topic concerned America, Iraq, or Bush.

[Chronic]

Originally posted by 1080Rider
The entire world laghed at us for having a complete idiot as our leader.

Clinton's penchant for cigars notwithstanding, pretty much everyone I've talked to in my travels think Bush is much less intelligent than Clinton. I frequently travel to Canada, and in fact "idiot" is one of the more common terms used to refer to Pres. Bush. I think they have much less respect for the U.S. government than they did when Clinton was in office. People in other countries could afford to chuckle when Clinton was caught with his pants around his ankles, but now they're too alarmed to be laughing. Yes, Clinton embarrassed himself and the government, but I think it's nothing compared to the damage Bush has done to international relations. At the very least, Bush has severely damaged U.S. credibility with the WMD/Iraq issue.

Originally posted by 1080Rider
why don't you tell me what exactly conservative presidents have done to denegrate the presidential office.

Slooooww Pitch...

[Schmear]

Getting this thread back on topic...
This is the first news report I've seen on this topic from a legitimate source. (There may have been others and I missed them.)

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/APW...D80OG9380.html

Woman denies rumors of Kerry affair

By MATTHEW ROSENBERG
Associated Press Writer


NAIROBI, Kenya — A woman who has been the subject of rumors linking her to Sen. John Kerry denied Monday that she ever had an affair with the Democratic presidential candidate.

Breaking her silence four days after the allegations surfaced on the Internet, Alexandra Polier issued a statement to The Associated Press, saying, "I have never had a relationship with Senator Kerry, and the rumors in the press are completely false."

Kerry already has denied reports that he had an extramarital affair. On Monday, his campaign said he would have no further comment.

Polier's statement was released to the AP in Nairobi, where the 27-year-old freelance journalist is visiting the parents of her fiance, Yaron Schwartzman, an Israeli who was raised in Kenya. She previously worked as an editorial assistant for the AP in New York.

"Whoever is spreading these rumors and allegations does not know me," Polier said, appealing to the media to respect her privacy and the privacy of her fiance and his family.

Polier also took issue with reports that referred to her as a former Kerry intern.

"I never interned or worked for John Kerry," she told AP over the phone.

In a separate statement, Polier's parents, Terry and Donna Polier of Malvern, Pa., dismissed the "completely false and unsubstantiated" allegations about their daughter.

"We love and support her 100 percent and these unfounded rumors are hurtful to our entire family," the statement said. "We appreciate the way Senator Kerry has handled the situation, and intend on voting for him for president of the United States."

The statement did not address purported quotes by Polier's parents in the British tabloid The Sun that were harshly critical of Kerry.

Kerry has won 14 of 16 Democratic primaries and caucuses, and is expected to be the Democratic challenger to President Bush in November.

Rumors of a relationship between Kerry and Polier first appeared Thursday on the Internet and were picked up by newspapers in several countries outside the United States. Few U.S. publications printed her name, however.

Asked Friday about the reports, Kerry told reporters: "I just deny it categorically. It's rumor. It's untrue. And that's the last time I intend" to respond to questions about it.

Regarding her silence until now, Polier said, "Because these stories were false, I assumed the media would ignore them. It seems that efforts to peddle these lies continue, so I feel compelled to address them."

By Monday, reporters and photographers were camped outside the Schwartzmans' Nairobi home, and at one point pursued the car of Yaron's mother, Hannah Schwartzman, as she left the walled compound.

Polier and Yaron Schwartzman met at Columbia University. They arrived in Kenya last October.

Polier graduated from Clark University in Worcester, Mass., in 1999. She received her master's in journalism from Columbia in 2003.

[mr_gyptian]

the National Enquirer is not a legitamate news source?

[Dexter Rutecki]

Originally posted by 1080Rider
Dex, you may think my comments are uneducated.

You more or less admitted as much, and your following comments add further proof.

I in fact know what the fack each goverment officer should do. Your clinton made a total fucking joke of the office. You as an american should be ashamed of the circus he created. The entire world laghed at us for having a complete idiot as our leader.

No, you're wrong. This shows you don't understand what you're commenting on. The entire world laughed at the way America's right wing tried to crucify Clinton publicly for private matters. In no way did most people in Europe look at Clinton as a cowboy buffoon, as they (rightfully) tend to regard our current moron of a president.
If you don't bother following the news, I wonder what you're basing your opinions on? Unthinking ideology is my guess.

why don't you tell me what exactly conservative presidents have done to denegrate the presidential office.

'Bring it on.' 'Mission accomplished.' 'Fuck the UN [paraphrase].' 'Fuck Europe [paraphrase].' 'Uranium from Africa.'
Selling energy regulation to the highest bidder, turning a surplus into a deficit...I won't even bother going back to Iran-Contra or Watergate since AWOL George has done enough.

[1080Rider]

Again, all you argue is politics. You don't like the shit a converative president does IN THE LINE OF HIS JOB. This whole thread is about the way a person holds themself as a person and their FITNESS TO SERVE AS PRESIDENT. Its funny you call me uneducated on the matter yet can't understand the difference. I know what the fuck I'm talkin' about. What I don't do is cruise the internet for 5 hrs. a day building my house of cards against your party to expose it as a bunch of money grubbing fascists (but that's because I'd just find articles proving that your party are a bunch of panty-waists who want everyone to feel good, do whatever they want whenever they want, balloon the federal govt by making new programs to monitor the stool samples of baby's who were born to crack addicts then another program to study why american society made these poor people take crack, and also articles to prove that most liberals have the morals of a used car salesman). [side note, this just in- Communism doesn't work, when will you liberals understand that] But, you see, I don't waste my time w/ that bullshit. That's why I said I don't pay attention to the news.

I'm not supporting bush if he lied to start this war. Like I said EARLIER he gets what he deserves if that's the case. I do think Hussein needed to be taken out but YOUR president was too much of a pussie to do ANYTHING while in office. That asshole sat on the fence so long he's still got a fence post stuck up his ass, or is that a cigar.

Bottom line, you take to insulting me when I tell you my side, so go blow a goat. You don't like how I think but sooner or later you'll figure it out. Like I've said many times, you're lucky because in America everyone has the right to be wrong.

edit- my sausage fingers don't always work

[Viva]

Originally posted by 1080Rider
[side note, this just in- Communism doesn't work, when will you liberals understand that]

Sir, you are correct, communism can never work. Wanna know why? Because there will always be corrupt and inherently evil individuals willing to compromise the system for their own personal gain.

Also, the studies you lambaste as a waste of money really do provide useful information. Such studies are necessary to learn about ourselves as well as the world and universe we occupy. It's called evolving- in this case for the better. What's your alternative... Just say no!?

[Skidawg]

Schmear - I think yesterday (or Sunday) was the first offical AP release regarding the rumor. I think this shows the difference between neoconservative rumor mills (Drudge Report) and legitimate news sources (AP, CNN, FOX).

A lesson could be learned here somewhere, but somehow I don't think we'll get that far....

[mr_gyptian]

dex, for the love of god can we please drop the AWOL shit. The DOD released his records and they again show no base for this accusation.

Has anyone seen the new Dennis Miller show on CNBC?? He absolutely f'ing torched Scott Ritter the other night.

[bigAK]

Originally posted by 1080Rider
why don't you tell me what exactly conservative presidents have done to denegrate the presidential office.

ever hear of nixon?

how about reagan?

[1080Rider]

Originally posted by bigAK
how about reagan?

Yeah, I think I've heard of him. Isn't he the guy that pulled our coutry out of double digit inflation, gave us a common focus and got the country back on track to be one of the greatest economies of all time? I think I heard about him. Who was it before him that got us in such trouble, I forget???

[KQ]

Originally posted by 1080Rider
The entire world laghed at us for having a complete idiot as our leader.

On this count I have to say you're wrong. I was traveling abroad when the Clinton/Lewinsky affair hit the papers. The reaction I got from most Europeans was "What's the big deal?"

Have you ever followed politics in Europe? I'll tell you what freaks the Euros out about our politics - it's how, despite our alleged "separation of church and state," we co-mingle God with our politics. This is simply not done in western Europe.


BTW - I seriously doubt "the whole world" ever laughs at the same thing.

[grrrr]

Originally posted by TJ.Brk
Now your not old enough to remember that time period. You most likely weren't even born.

Actually TJ, I'm just about the same age as you are. I was born on an Army base in the early 60's, and can recall those days vividly. Much too vividly.

I'm not a Kerry supporter, and I'm not a democrat. I don't agree with many of his decisions since the war, but in comparison with Bush, I will vote for him.

He stood up for his convictions, and he stood up against the machinery that sent us into that ill-conceived and ill-fated mission. As did many more on the inside, usually quietly. Including my father, who was at the time a major, a career officer and a cold warrior.

I don't necessarily agree with the path he took in protesting, but I agree far less with the people whose believe that anyone who opposes the president, military operations or defense spending in any way is an enemy of this country.

I don't have any more to add to that.

[1080Rider]

Edit- Re: clinton fiasco

All I know is that it made headlines from here to Bejing, knowing what I know about what sells papers, I don't think they were laughing with us.

PS- KQ, we were in your neck of the woods this weekend. Wife may be gettin' a job out on the peninsula. What's the job market lookn' like in our field over there. I'm not too worried, there's always a sweatshop to work in somewhere I'm sure.

[SledNeck]

Have you ever followed politics in Europe?

Why should we care about politics in Europe, last time I checked this was the US. Matter of fact, if memory serves me correct, the settlers that came to Americas wanted to get the f@ck away from Europe....

[KQ]

Originally posted by Schmear
Getting this thread back on topic...
This is the first news report I've seen on this topic from a legitimate source. (There may have been others and I missed them.)

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/APW...D80OG9380.html

And.........the news is now reporting that the picture of Kerry at the rally with Fonda is a fake.

LET THE GAMES BEGIN!!!!

(Oh this is gonna be quite an election year!)

[KQ]

Originally posted by SledNeck
Why should we care about politics in Europe, last time I checked this was the US. Matter of fact, if memory serves me correct, the settlers that came to Americas wanted to get the f@ck away from Europe....

Whoa.........I didn't say you should care. I just asked a question.....but since you're asking.......

I think we should follow what's going on in the world. Isn't that what Bush did by taking out Saddam? He was paying attention to the world community.

Aren't we working towards a "world community?" We can't do that without understanding one another and understanding goes a long way to ending stress and strife.

[1080Rider]

Doesn't look like it will be an issue at all. It doesn't look like dems can stomach Dean so Kerry will get the nod w/ whatever baggage he has. I like the stuff about the picture, this is going to get pretty fackin' dirty before its over, then we can chose between two marginal candidates... politics are great.

[SledNeck]

I think we should follow what's going on in the world. Isn't that what Bush did by taking out Saddam? He was paying attention to the world community.

Disagree, he was doing what he thought was in the best interest for the US, not the world commumnity. He just played stupid politics with the world to bring it to fruition. Lucky for you liberals we dont have a conservative president thats actually a conservative. Bush is a big pussy when it comes to fiscal conservativism. The one thing and only thing I do like, his stance on war. Thus I will vote for him, again.