Real Estate Crash thread

[Toadman]

Maybe we should kill all the golfers?

#caddyshack

Gophers! Not GOLFERS!!!

[Skistack]

Gophers! Not GOLFERS!!!

We can do that. We don't even need a reason.

[Toadman]

I will take that to the bank and cancel my forbes interview.

You should still keep the NYT interview though.

[AdironRider]

was already posted and AdironRider assured us that it's a big nothingburger.

There has to be more to that story than presented in that article if it is going to amount to more than sour grapes on the counties end. That's all.

[XXX-er]

To roughly follow the advice of Dick the butcher, maybe just kill all the golfing lawyers ?

[dunfree]

~$150k a year if maxed out, not hard to see why it’s more valuable as a STR than as a home.

[AdironRider]

No hotel or STR has 100% occupancy.

That place will be booked in the summer and probably not at all in November/April and maybe 30-40% in the winter. So maybe 40-60k a year at best. At 1.3 mill that loses money after expenses (assuming there is a mortgage). Even buying cash that is a shitty cap rate at like 3%.

[liv2ski]

Looks like getting over a 3% cap rate is tough on the West Coast: https://www.mashvisor.com/blog/2019-cap-rates-by-city/

[Kinnikinnick]

No hotel or STR has 100% occupancy.

That place will be booked in the summer and probably not at all in November/April and maybe 30-40% in the winter. So maybe 40-60k a year at best. At 1.3 mill that loses money after expenses (assuming there is a mortgage). Even buying cash that is a shitty cap rate at like 3%.

Yeah but a great cash flow investment is inly a segment of the buyers

some situations that you’re not considering...explain the effect of the incentives of 1031 exchanges and what about those taking losses to offset income elsewhere?

What about those rich as fuck who could give a fuck about the cap rate and collect houses for fun?

What about ______ nationals that want their money out of ______?




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[Supermoon]

Yeah but a great cash flow investment is inly a segment of the buyers

some situations that you’re not considering...explain the effect of the incentives of 1031 exchanges and what about those taking losses to offset income elsewhere?

What about those rich as fuck who could give a fuck about the cap rate and collect houses for fun?

What about ______ nationals that want their money out of ______?




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Maybe we fucked up by creating a tax code that takes human shelter and makes it the prime avenue for money laundering.

[liv2ski]

Escrow isn't accepting a suitcase full of cash at closing so is the money being wired in from overseas? If first deposited here, supposedly the financial institution is suppose to verify the money was legit. How does a company verify a few million was in fact clean and legit when it comes from overseas? It would seem that some government agency isn't looking hard enough at these kinds of transactions?

[AdironRider]

Yeah but a great cash flow investment is inly a segment of the buyers

some situations that you’re not considering...explain the effect of the incentives of 1031 exchanges and what about those taking losses to offset income elsewhere?

What about those rich as fuck who could give a fuck about the cap rate and collect houses for fun?

What about ______ nationals that want their money out of ______?




Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

I tend to believe rich people don't get rich by not giving a fuck about returns on investment but this market seems to know no bounds so maybe?

[neufox47]

Escrow isn't accepting a suitcase full of cash at closing so is the money being wired in from overseas? If first deposited here, supposedly the financial institution is suppose to verify the money was legit. How does a company verify a few million was in fact clean and legit when it comes from overseas? It would seem that some government agency isn't looking hard enough at these kinds of transactions?

Before banks would touch weed money there were many houses bought for hard cash in Colorado.

[altasnob]

Another article on Biden's plan to dump 1031 exchanges in the NYTimes today.

Section 1031 was enacted after WWI to fuel real estate transactions after tax rates had risen to 77 percent from 7 percent for top earners. At the time, capital gains were taxed as ordinary income, and the high rates had created a “lock in” effect that discouraged investors from selling assets. Opponents of the law argue it's purpose is now obsolete. Biden's plan to dump it would generate $19.5 billion in tax revenue over 10 years. And Biden doesn't want to completely dump it, as some argue he should, but instead the deferral in any one year would be limited to gains of up to $500,000 for single taxpayers and $1 million for married taxpayers.

“If I want to sell my IBM stock and buy AT&T stock, I have to pay taxes on that sale, even though I’m swapping one stock for another,” Mr. Rosenthal said. “Why do we favor real estate over other like-kind investments? At the end of the day, like-kind exchanges are disproportionately benefiting the wealthy versus the wage earner.”

Fans of 1031 point to a Ernst & Young study that concluded that Section 1031 could support as many as 710,000 jobs that generate labor income of up to $34.4 billion this year (i.e. all the workers in the real estate industry that benefit from swapping real estate).

I personally think this law needs to go. I see no reason to keep it other than artificially prop up the real estate industry.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/08/b...smid=url-share

[Toadman]

Escrow isn't accepting a suitcase full of cash at closing so is the money being wired in from overseas? If first deposited here, supposedly the financial institution is suppose to verify the money was legit. How does a company verify a few million was in fact clean and legit when it comes from overseas? It would seem that some government agency isn't looking hard enough at these kinds of transactions?

My FIL was offered a million bucks in a brown paper bag for his Whitestone, Queens NY house back in the day. (I've told the story on here already) He declined. In the end a Columbian drug lord bought the house, tore it down and built a concrete monstrosity. Dude was busted a few years later for, wait for it...tax evasion, money laundering and drug dealing.

[Toadman]

Another article on Biden's plan to dump 1031 exchanges in the NYTimes today.

Section 1031 was enacted after WWI to fuel real estate transactions after tax rates had risen to 77 percent from 7 percent for top earners. At the time, capital gains were taxed as ordinary income, and the high rates had created a “lock in” effect that discouraged investors from selling assets. Opponents of the law argue it's purpose is now obsolete. Biden's plan to dump it would generate $19.5 billion in tax revenue over 10 years. And Biden doesn't want to completely dump it, as some argue he should, but instead the deferral in any one year would be limited to gains of up to $500,000 for single taxpayers and $1 million for married taxpayers.

“If I want to sell my IBM stock and buy AT&T stock, I have to pay taxes on that sale, even though I’m swapping one stock for another,” Mr. Rosenthal said. “Why do we favor real estate over other like-kind investments? At the end of the day, like-kind exchanges are disproportionately benefiting the wealthy versus the wage earner.”

Fans of 1031 point to a Ernst & Young study that concluded that Section 1031 could support as many as 710,000 jobs that generate labor income of up to $34.4 billion this year (i.e. all the workers in the real estate industry that benefit from swapping real estate).

I personally think this law needs to go. I see no reason to keep it other than artificially prop up the real estate industry.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/08/b...smid=url-share

Agreed.

https://www.propublica.org/article/t...2f76dcb5a25a26

Many Americans live paycheck to paycheck, amassing little wealth and paying the federal government a percentage of their income that rises if they earn more. In recent years, the median American household earned about $70,000 annually and paid 14% in federal taxes. The highest income tax rate, 37%, kicked in this year, for couples, on earnings above $628,300.

America’s billionaires avail themselves of tax-avoidance strategies beyond the reach of ordinary people. Their wealth derives from the skyrocketing value of their assets, like stock and property. Those gains are not defined by U.S. laws as taxable income unless and until the billionaires sell.

The results are stark. According to Forbes, those 25 people saw their worth rise a collective $401 billion from 2014 to 2018. They paid a total of $13.6 billion in federal income taxes in those five years, the IRS data shows. That’s a staggering sum, but it amounts to a true tax rate of only 3.4%.

It’s a completely different picture for middle-class Americans, for example, wage earners in their early 40s who have amassed a typical amount of wealth for people their age. From 2014 to 2018, such households saw their net worth expand by about $65,000 after taxes on average, mostly due to the rise in value of their homes. But because the vast bulk of their earnings were salaries, their tax bills were almost as much, nearly $62,000, over that five-year period.

[skaredshtles]

Maybe we fucked up by creating a tax code that takes human shelter and makes it the prime avenue for money laundering.

Maybe we just get rid of the mortgage interest deduction? At this point, if you're itemizing, you're pretty rich, right?

I say that as someone that is on the cusp of getting rid of a mortgage...

[XXX-er]

No hotel or STR has 100% occupancy.

That place will be booked in the summer and probably not at all in November/April and maybe 30-40% in the winter. So maybe 40-60k a year at best. At 1.3 mill that loses money after expenses (assuming there is a mortgage). Even buying cash that is a shitty cap rate at like 3%.

THis ^^

An STR does make more money per night but its never full, take out air BnB fees, cost to stage and clean up after every stay if you have to pay someone and if you don't have to pay someone then you gotta be around to do it

and with COVID no body was traveling so AIR BnB's didnt make any money

whereas my LTR has been paying less money with zero hassles for 11 years and she keeps the garden nice

[Benny Profane]

Escrow isn't accepting a suitcase full of cash at closing so is the money being wired in from overseas? If first deposited here, supposedly the financial institution is suppose to verify the money was legit. How does a company verify a few million was in fact clean and legit when it comes from overseas? It would seem that some government agency isn't looking hard enough at these kinds of transactions?

Fuck, the federal government was and still is encouraging money laundering with EB-5, which was an officially sanctioned cash for green cards scheme. Brought down Jay Peak and a few of the top people on the receiving end are now going to jail over the matter, but, still a valid fed program.

https://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/...os/7350546002/

[JimmyCarter]

What are some tips to get the appraiser to give you a lower number? What's worth pointing out with regards to wear and tear, scratch and dent, maintenance, appliances, furniture, carpet? What do they pay attention to on site versus brush off?

[altasnob]

Maybe we just get rid of the mortgage interest deduction?

Absolutely we should get rid of the home mortgage interest deduction. Studies show in mainly benefits those buying large homes, and second homes. It artificially increases the price of all real estate. And the deduction does not increase the rate of home ownership in the US (countries without the deduction have higher home ownership than the US).

But populism. Just like Californians refuse to get rid Prop 13's cap on property tax, and liberal, socialist Washington State refuses to pass an income tax, people hate getting rid of tax breaks if they are convinced it helps them out personally, even if getting rid of the law is for the greater good. And the entire real estate industry's lobbying power is just too great to overcome.

[XXX-er]

they talked about that ^^ very briefly up here capitol gains on the principal res, i think which ever party did that would be down the road

no mortgage interest deduction up here for a principal res

[Core Shot]

Heh. Ignant renters ranting at rich folk.

They capped the mortgage interest deduction. What did the rich do? Make their second third and fourth homes into LLC biz ops. Now interest is deductible again.
Winning!

The Uber rich are the cockroaches of the world.

[Supermoon]

Maybe we just get rid of the mortgage interest deduction? At this point, if you're itemizing, you're pretty rich, right?

I say that as someone that is on the cusp of getting rid of a mortgage...

Just bought a house in January and I’m pretty sure even with basically a full year of the most interest I will ever pay on this we will probably not need to itemize. So yeah, I’m right with you.

[summit]

Heh. Ignant renters ranting at rich folk.

They capped the mortgage interest deduction. What did the rich do? Make their second third and fourth homes into LLC biz ops. Now interest is deductible again.
Winning!

The Uber rich are the cockroaches of the world.

That is addressable