Real Estate Crash thread

**Kinnikinnick** · 06-02-2021, 09:46 AM

Originally Posted by teleee

Yep, thats pretty much where I fall in this. Total dick move, realtor (fuck broker, they are a realtor, use whatever word you want to make yourself feel better). The REALTOR, assisted the seller in collecting the offers and then at the end called the seller and said they would like to submit a higher offer and buy it himself. I am sure it is legal, fucking no where near ethical in my book.

So he bought it himself? Yeah maybe dick move, but his legal relationship is with the seller so you weren’t ever a party to it.

But hey, this is lawyer stuff now. Hire a lawyer and sue if you were harmed.

Maybe the lawyers have a different take.

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**Kinnikinnick** · 06-02-2021, 10:00 AM

Originally Posted by babybear

damn, calling everyone ignorant for not knowing the nuances of an industry where they maybe interact 1 to a small handful of times in their lives?
You sound like a really helpful whateverthefuckyouare

Not knowing something is literally being ignorant of it.

“lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about a particular thing.”

As far as being helpful, now you know. Everyone who read that is no longer ignorant!!

Dirt Pimp? Sure.

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**Danno** · 06-02-2021, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick

So he bought it himself? Yeah maybe dick move, but his legal relationship is with the seller so you weren’t ever a party to it.

But hey, this is lawyer stuff now. Hire a lawyer and sue if you were harmed.

Maybe the lawyers have a different take.

No, it seems like whatever issue that is here, if there is one, is between the realtor and his client. With the listing agent and buyer being one and the same, it seems like a situation ripe for shenanigans, but any shenanigans would only legally injure the seller and not any potential buyers. So maybe there's a formal ethical issue there, maybe not, but either way, the potential buyers don't have any legal grounds to object.

**4matic** · 06-02-2021, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by schuss

Or the inflation will normalize as supply chains get fixed.
Also, nice graphs with zero context there on what question or item they represent.

https://data.sca.isr.umich.edu/charts.php

**Danno** · 06-02-2021, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick

Not knowing something is literally being ignorant of it.

“lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about a particular thing.”

As far as being helpful, now you know. Everyone who read that is no longer ignorant!!

Dirt Pimp? Sure.

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You do realize that "ignorant" is a pejorative term, right?

**teleee** · 06-02-2021, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick

So he bought it himself? Yeah maybe dick move, but his legal relationship is with the seller so you weren’t ever a party to it.

But hey, this is lawyer stuff now. Hire a lawyer and sue if you were harmed.

Maybe the lawyers have a different take.

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Yea, no thanks. Like I said I am sure it was legal, just because something is legal doesn't mean it isn't a dick move, it was a dick move.

And why would I want to bring in more vultures to go after a vulture?

**concretejungle** · 06-02-2021, 10:08 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

You do realize that "ignorant" is a pejorative term, right?

He’s a dirt pump not a fucking editor.

**Kinnikinnick** · 06-02-2021, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

No, it seems like whatever issue that is here, if there is one, is between the realtor and his client. With the listing agent and buyer being one and the same, it seems like a situation ripe for shenanigans, but any shenanigans would only legally injure the seller and not any potential buyers. So maybe there's a formal ethical issue there, maybe not, but either way, the potential buyers don't have any legal grounds to object.

Yeah.

I dont know, just an unhelpful DirtPimpTM but maybe there is some legal recourse for marketing laws. Bait and switch. ‘You marketed it for sale but de facto you never intended to sell it’

The Realtor

Association could field an ethics accusation

https://www.nar.realtor/about-nar/go...#DutiestoCandC

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**Kevo** · 06-02-2021, 10:25 AM

Originally Posted by 4matic

Attachment 376256
Attachment 376257

“The demand boom is over. Charts don’t lie – once supply comes back on stream, the demand downturn will cause inflation to morph into deflation.”

Any backstory on how the vertical axis is measured? And is there an article? I'd be interested to read it.

**Ted Striker** · 06-02-2021, 10:28 AM

Originally Posted by teleee

We put an offer on a place of my dreams, got out bid by the sellers realtor? Still trying to wrap my head around that. Where does that fall in the realtors code of ethics (oxymoron)

Originally Posted by teleee

Yep, thats pretty much where I fall in this. Total dick move, realtor (fuck broker, they are a realtor, use whatever word you want to make yourself feel better). The REALTOR, assisted the seller in collecting the offers and then at the end called the seller and said they would like to submit a higher offer and buy it himself. I am sure it is legal, fucking no where near ethical in my book.

Setting aside the RE agency ethics debate...

The listing agent (correct term) paid market value (or over) for a house that you wanted. Factually, that's no different than being outbid by a third party. Were you represented by your own agent, and did you submit your best/highest offer? If so, how were you harmed? If not, that's your agent's fault.

**Danno** · 06-02-2021, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by Ted Striker

Setting aside the RE agency ethics debate...

The listing agent (correct term) paid market value (or over) for a house that you wanted. Factually, that's no different than being outbid by a third party. Were you represented by your own agent, and did you submit your best/highest offer? If so, how were you harmed? If not, that's your agent's fuck up.

Except that the listing agent may have wanted the property and did things to create downward pressure on offers, so that s/he could step in and make the highest offer. Which again means that the potential buyers did not suffer any damages (ie I agree with you), but that doesn't mean this was purely a market transaction.

**Ted Striker** · 06-02-2021, 10:35 AM

Assuming facts not in evidence

**teleee** · 06-02-2021, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

Except that the listing agent may have wanted the property and did things to create downward pressure on offers, so that s/he could step in and make the highest offer. Which again means that the potential buyers did not suffer any damages (ie I agree with you), but that doesn't mean this was purely a market transaction.

I have some pretty insider information (I happen to be friends with the sellers son in law). This is pretty much exactly what happened. I was told I never had a chance to purchase.
Ted I am sure you have your opinion and it wont change, but I pretty much have the facts, not opinions and it was a douche move. Regardless nothing is going to change the outcome and I am not going to pursue it any further.

**Danno** · 06-02-2021, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by Ted Striker

Assuming facts not in evidence

do you know what the word "may" means?

**MontuckyFried** · 06-02-2021, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by teleee

I have some pretty insider information (I happen to be friends with the sellers son in law). This is pretty much exactly what happened. I was told I never had a chance to purchase.
Ted I am sure you have your opinion and it wont change, but I pretty much have the facts, not opinions and it was a douche move. Regardless nothing is going to change the outcome and I am not going to pursue it any further.

You COULD at least file a complaint against the agent. Maybe won't go anywhere, but it's the least that shady people like that deserve: https://realestate.utah.gov/submit-a-complaint/

**XXX-er** · 06-02-2021, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick

I could never figure out why members of the public get mistreated by real estate agents...

Maybe...

Nah couldnt be as much because the public are assholes as because the average RealtorTM is an asshole. Its BOTH! Maybe people largely get the service that they deserve.

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I got a buddy who's whole fam is in the game I asked why she quit after 13 yrs

she said she just couldnt take the people anymore

**Ted Striker** · 06-02-2021, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

do you know what the word "may" means?

It was a joke

**Ted Striker** · 06-02-2021, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by teleee

I have some pretty insider information (I happen to be friends with the sellers son in law). This is pretty much exactly what happened. I was told I never had a chance to purchase..

I agree, that is fucked up.

And frankly stupid on the listing agent/seller's side.

**Kinnikinnick** · 06-02-2021, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by teleee

I have some pretty insider information (I happen to be friends with the sellers son in law). This is pretty much exactly what happened. I was told I never had a chance to purchase.
Ted I am sure you have your opinion and it wont change, but I pretty much have the facts, not opinions and it was a douche move. Regardless nothing is going to change the outcome and I am not going to pursue it any further.

The seller would be the party injured if the price were suppressed. That’s why there should be all kinds of disclosure to the seller by their broker or agent in this circumstance. Because it opens the door for the seller being fleeced.

I wouldnt buy my own listing in general but certainly not if there were other buyers.

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**Toadman** · 06-02-2021, 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by 4matic

Attachment 376256

“The demand boom is over. Charts don’t lie – once supply comes back on stream, the demand downturn will cause inflation to morph into deflation.”

But the $64k over asking price question is; how soon for that supply to come back on stream?

**Supermoon** · 06-02-2021, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick

Nope just a broker, but there goes the ignorant public conflating the two.

A Realtor is not a legal thing. Its a club and the fact that people think that its the legal thing shows how effective the Realtor Association propaganda had been and how gullible the public is.

Stop saying realtor if you want to sound smart.

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I’m a Realtor (TM) and it’s fucking stupid. I pay them a bunch of dues that they use to lobby my city/state/county to pass laws that hurt me both personally and professionally, not to mention being ethically dubious IMO, make me take bullshit CE ethics courses, and have some standard of practice that’s so full of loopholes and back doors it only serves as a way for other Realtors (TM) to fuck each other over if they don’t get along. All this so my brokerage can put the Realtor (TM) logo on our business cards.

(I literally had to take an online course all about where and how I can refer to myself as a Realtor (TM) and how I can’t.)

99% of real estate law is just to CYA the agents involved and none of it really protects buyers. I do think agents can bring value to most people but the industry is pretty fucking whack.

**liv2ski** · 06-02-2021, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by Supermoon

99% of real estate law is just to CYA the agents involved and none of it really protects buyers. I do think agents can bring value to most people but the industry is pretty fucking whack.

Agreed, there are agents with the experience to bring value to the relationship, however at what cost? My hoods average price is $3M with listing agents getting at least 2% ($60k) per transaction. I have an issue with that, but obviously people pay it.
I remember the days of $125k prices and 3% commissions ($3,750). Even 3% on $500k seems excessive to me for the work done. At $100 per hour are agents really putting 150 hours into the sale of a listing? Not even close in most circumstances.

**4matic** · 06-02-2021, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by Kevo

Any backstory on how the vertical axis is measured? And is there an article? I'd be interested to read it.

All part of umich monthly data. It’s just numbers. No story. You can visit the survey site for inputs

**4matic** · 06-02-2021, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by teleee

I have some pretty insider information (I happen to be friends with the sellers son in law). This is pretty much exactly what happened. I was told I never had a chance to purchase.
Ted I am sure you have your opinion and it wont change, but I pretty much have the facts, not opinions and it was a douche move. Regardless nothing is going to change the outcome and I am not going to pursue it any further.

With zero commission the price would have to be ~%. If the seller is happy isn’t that all that matters?

**54-46** · 06-02-2021, 12:13 PM

Weird one - Some moron out of town agent listed a prop down the street for $740K that was worth about $950K then accepted an offer for $780K in about a day.

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/2...ource=txtshare