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  1. #17451
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    Quote Originally Posted by jono View Post
    I don't follow this thread completely so apologies if it's been covered, but I hear Renton has been an interesting case lately with Section 8 and the Red Lion as a temporary homeless shelter. I'm curious how you see that fitting in re: homeless moving between Seattle and surrounding areas.
    A couple years ago now, we went in for a PreApp meeting on a large affordable housing project (300+ units) in a larger south-sound city. The meeting went well, with no big hurdles to overcome and all potential issues having feasible solutions the developer was fine with addressing. As we were leaving, the city manager pulled us (the project applicant team) aside to have an offline conversation. He said, and i quote cause it was fairly shocking to us all, "The City has no appetite for any affordable housing projects, and we will do anything we can to kill this project. So be aware of that if you choose to move forward with the project". Halfway through permitting the project the developer killed the project due to a combination of challenging site design issues and the City being exceptionally difficult to work with.

    IME city's dislike affordable housing. Reason ive been told is it brings in problem people, and it costs the jurisdiction much more in services (schools, public transport, police/medical, etc) than is funded by the additional tax base.

  2. #17452
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    A couple years ago now, we went in for a PreApp meeting on a large affordable housing project (300+ units) in a larger south-sound city. The meeting went well, with no big hurdles to overcome and all potential issues having feasible solutions the developer was fine with addressing. As we were leaving, the city manager pulled us (the project applicant team) aside to have an offline conversation. He said, and i quote cause it was fairly shocking to us all, "The City has no appetite for any affordable housing projects, and we will do anything we can to kill this project. So be aware of that if you choose to move forward with the project". Halfway through permitting the project the developer killed the project due to a combination of challenging site design issues and the City being exceptionally difficult to work with.

    IME city's dislike affordable housing. Reason ive been told is it brings in problem people, and it costs the jurisdiction much more in services (schools, public transport, police/medical, etc) than is funded by the additional tax base.
    Why let in the unwashed at all, right?

    One of the things I ran across regarding the Red Lion was Renton complaining about that vicinity getting a larger fraction of their police calls--even while their total police calls plummeted over the same time period. Maybe the one didn't cause the other, but that seems like a win--even moreso considering where that eyesore sits. But, sure, a bigger win is pushing a few percent of their police calls to Seattle. Renton deserves that.

  3. #17453
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenstateofmind View Post
    ^^^Great Map
    1. The south is segregated to this day.
    2. Give Texas back to Mexico
    3. If we could just convince people to build in the dakotas.
    Climate change might either convince people or force people. Depends on water supply in the Dakotas
    "We don't beat the reaper by living longer, we beat the reaper by living well and living fully." - Randy Pausch

  4. #17454
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    Quote Originally Posted by jono View Post
    Why let in the unwashed at all, right?

    One of the things I ran across regarding the Red Lion was Renton complaining about that vicinity getting a larger fraction of their police calls--even while their total police calls plummeted over the same time period. Maybe the one didn't cause the other, but that seems like a win--even moreso considering where that eyesore sits. But, sure, a bigger win is pushing a few percent of their police calls to Seattle. Renton deserves that.
    Its not so much worrying about the "unwashed and undesirables", though the police services thing is most certainly a large factor. Its finding the funding to hire more teachers, more school bus drivers etc to handle the extra kids who's parents cannot contribute taxes to pay for it. Affordable housing tends to attract multigenerational households with kids, usually immigrant families- meaning that g-ma and g-pa will rely on public tranportation and free medical services along with the kids. In fact, i think it was the school district that was the loudest naysayer in regards to this specific project. Additonally, lower income folks arent going to spend as much money in the local community as the 30yr old yuppies who can afford non-subsidized rent, so their is opportunity cost along with actual realized cost associated with affordable housing.

    Gotta remember that it starts getting red really quickly when you leave the immediate Seattle/Tacoma metro area.

  5. #17455
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    All true. Keep those dirty unwashed breeders away from good tax paying citizens.
    A few people feel the rain. Most people just get wet.

  6. #17456
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    Kids cost 20+ years in taxes, so the easy route is to attract rich retirees/luxury stuff that has a much better person/tax revenue/area ratio. Most communities here play chicken with letting others pick up the density for working/middle class while they focus on luxury condos and dispersed developments.

  7. #17457
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    Quote Originally Posted by wooley12 View Post
    All true. Keep those dirty unwashed breeders away from good tax paying citizens.
    With WFH being more of a thing going forward, that's a lot of tax base that could be evaporating from cities, so they will be looking even harder at the financial implications of future projects i think. It will be interesting to see what the financial/economic shifts are that come from the pandemic in 5 years.

  8. #17458
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    Meanwhile in the Really Big:


    A new program in Big Sky is offering landlords up to $14,500 to convert vacation rentals or seasonal homes into long-term rentals amid a shortage of available and affordable housing.

    The Big Sky Community Housing Trust, a nonprofit that aims to address the town’s housing crisis, kicked off the “Cash for Leases” program on Aug. 1.

    The program is funded by donations from the Spanish Peaks Community Foundation and through the area’s resort tax. The nonprofit plans to spend about $110,000 to convince homeowners to rent to locals long-term.

    “We’re trying to get creative,” said the nonprofit’s executive director Laura Seyfang.

    The housing and wealth disparity in Big Sky has grown. From July 2020 to July 2021 the median price of a single-family home spiked by 111% to about $2.9 million in the greater Big Sky area, according to data from the Gallatin Association of Realtors. The median price for condos and townhomes was nearly $1 million this July, a 47% increase from July 2020.

    The average monthly rent in Big Sky is $1,200 per bedroom and there’s virtually no long-term vacancy, while the median income for a four person household was about $88,900, according to the nonprofit.

    “People call me when they’re losing their house. I’ve sure had a lot of that this summer,” Seyfang said. “I don’t have enough solutions for them.”

    The housing trust has worked to convince owners of the some 1,200 vacation rentals in Big Sky to rent long-term to local residents, offering up inexpensive property management services and background checks for renters.

    “We tried to take away the excuses and concerns to rent local,” Seyfang said.

    Through that program about 14 housing units were converted from vacation rentals to long-term residences, she said.

    But Big Sky needs about 655 more houses by 2023 to address the current housing shortfall, according to the nonprofit.

    “The reality is that people can make more money renting short-term than they can to long-term locals,” Seyfang said.

    The housing trust estimated that homeowners make on average about $7,000 more annually on short-term rentals than by renting long-term.

    The program aims to match that in the hopes that more homeowners will rent to residents. A portion of the fund will also go to landlords who commit to renewing long-term leases for locals.

    The program will give eligible homeowners — who sign leases with locals —$1,500 for a new 6-month lease, $6,750 for a new or renewed one-year lease and $14,500 for a new two-year lease.

    In its first two weeks about three homeowners have expressed interest in the program, Seyfang said. She hopes the program grows and more homeowners consider renting to locals.

    “This is a big problem and it’s going to take a lot of different people to work together to find a solution,” she said.
    I have been in this State for 30 years and I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem.

  9. #17459
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    With WFH being more of a thing going forward, that's a lot of tax base that could be evaporating from cities, so they will be looking even harder at the financial implications of future projects i think. It will be interesting to see what the financial/economic shifts are that come from the pandemic in 5 years.
    My nephew makes a good living remodeling subsidized housing (The Projects) in NYC. Maybe we'll have to tax the rich. Nah, not gonna happen.
    A few people feel the rain. Most people just get wet.

  10. #17460
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    I just have to laugh when I see Black Lives Matter and other racism is bad lawn signs every now and then in my very upscale suburban CT. town. I imagine they were put there when the correct thinking but very naive children of the homeowners insisted. They don't realize that towns like this owe their whole existence to racism, and their parents would take up arms if "affordable housing" was constructed anywhere near that lawn.

    The world is perfect. Appreciate the details.

  11. #17461
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bunion 2020 View Post
    Meanwhile in the Really Big:
    The problem with this program is that I’m sure the homeowners want to use the property for 3-6 weeks every year, too. STR’s make that easy. Full time residents would be a bit more complicated, I would think. But I wish them luck.
    Forum Cross Pollinator

  12. #17462
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    Quote Originally Posted by wooley12 View Post
    All true. Keep those dirty unwashed breeders away from good tax paying citizens.
    Agreed. Put them next to the dirty rich billionaires who pay no taxes. Those two groups deserve each other.
    "We don't beat the reaper by living longer, we beat the reaper by living well and living fully." - Randy Pausch

  13. #17463
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    Interesting LTR idea in big sky.

    But the only real solution is new construction deed restricted apartments

    No STR. No turning condo. Worker housing.

    And market rate. But one year lease.
    If the market lease gets too high, build some more.

    I’ve seen more than a few lottery houses that house deadbeats that coast through life. It’s not fair to the hard working class.
    “I’m a subhuman jizz monkey”

    Thx mods. It’s an awesome signature.

  14. #17464
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toadman View Post
    Agreed. Put them next to the dirty rich billionaires who pay no taxes. Those two groups deserve each other.
    That would be Medina. Bill Gates hood. The town didn't have enough money to hire life guards for the public beach.
    A few people feel the rain. Most people just get wet.

  15. #17465
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bunion 2020 View Post
    Meanwhile in the Really Big:
    Multiple seasons of shit-fuck snowfall like Tahoe experienced is the only hope.

  16. #17466
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    Good article in the NYT all about the insanity of New Jersey shore development. Hope you can read it.

    The Long, Slow Drowning of the New Jersey Shore https://nyti.ms/3yI4IaH

    The world is perfect. Appreciate the details.

  17. #17467
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bunion 2020 View Post
    Meanwhile in the Really Big:
    That's a good incentive, hope it works.

  18. #17468
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    This is what a starter home in Seattle goes for these days. Good grief. Interesting to look at the progression on the sales history.

    https://www.redfin.com/WA/Seattle/63...5fbnVtYmVyPTA=
    "We don't beat the reaper by living longer, we beat the reaper by living well and living fully." - Randy Pausch

  19. #17469
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    Up 20k from 2005 to 2014.

    Up 378k from 2014 to 2021.

    Holy shit.

  20. #17470
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toadman View Post
    This is what a starter home in Seattle goes for these days. Good grief. Interesting to look at the progression on the sales history.

    https://www.redfin.com/WA/Seattle/63...5fbnVtYmVyPTA=
    Whoa, this is a starter house? I mean it's kind of weird that they apparently moved the washer/dryer from the bathroom to out in the open in a bedroom (?), but otherwise, that house looks pretty great to me.

  21. #17471
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    Quote Originally Posted by JayPowHound View Post
    Up 20k from 2005 to 2014.

    Up 378k from 2014 to 2021.

    Holy shit.
    And $238,000 from 1998 to 2014.....thats +200%.

    Not so shocking now is it?

  22. #17472
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    But "Year Built Effective" is 2003. I don't think this is the same house that sold for 112k in '98

  23. #17473
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    Cease to resist, prices are sky high
    Drive my car down Rainier
    You'll think I'm dead, but I sail away
    On a wave of gentrification
    A wave of gentrification
    Wave of gentrification
    Wave
    Wave

  24. #17474
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan_pdx View Post
    Whoa, this is a starter house? I mean it's kind of weird that they apparently moved the washer/dryer from the bathroom to out in the open in a bedroom (?), but otherwise, that house looks pretty great to me.
    That isn't a starter home. They are fishing for down sizers from ? Thing is, if you could buy it for $795k, with 20% down the PITI is still $4,100 a month Surely you could rent it for less or are rents that much there?
    Quote Originally Posted by leroy jenkins View Post
    I think you'd have an easier time understanding people if you remembered that 80% of them are fucking morons.
    That is why I like dogs, more than most people.

  25. #17475
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    Quote Originally Posted by liv2ski View Post
    That isn't a starter home. They are fishing for down sizers from ? Thing is, if you could buy it for $795k, with 20% down the PITI is still $4,100 a month Surely you could rent it for less or are rents that much there?
    A Seattle mag will have more context, but I've looked at some rentals in Seattle just in case the whole Bellingham thing doesn't work out, and $4k doesn't seem out of the question as rent for that house. I've seen some pretty grim stuff in the $3k range.

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