Real Estate Crash thread

[Toadman]

What's XOM and HON?

And, I said new hires.

Pensions really are an awful incentive, though. Encourages people to hang around for at least a decade too long.

My older brother is friends with the asst mgr. at a Les Schwab Tire store. They apparently have a pension and a profit sharing bonus program. Company contributes 15%. Don't know if it still open to new hires since they were recently purchased by a PE firm. Not an easy way to make a living slinging tires though.

[MontuckyFried]

And in the case of Colliers Hill, the problem was created not by drilling and fracking coming to a neighborhood, but by a neighborhood coming to the oil and gas operation.

Bingo.

Sandra Duggan said she and her husband Eric, 31, are hoping to have a baby through in vitro fertilization, but have delayed the procedure. “With IVF you want to create a safe, stress-free space,” Duggan said. “I worry about side effects correlated with early pregnancy and fracking emissions.”

Nothing says upper-middle class white yuppies more than this statement.

Having been a frac worker myself, I have to laugh at all of it. First off, each well only takes about a day to complete the perf/frac procedure (when things go right) to a few days (when there are complications) so it ain't gonna last forever. That said, yup! It is LOUD AS BALLS every time that fleet of diesel V12's rev up. Each of those engines is like 3000+ cubic inches and has like 2500hp/7000+ lbs of torque. They are beasts. Would I want a frac operation in my backyard? Hell no. Would I move to an overpriced house in the middle of an existing gas field if I weren't partaking in some sweet royalty action? Also no. The people quoted in the article are all so freaking stupid it hurts.

[easyrdr]

I live across the street from Colliers Hill. You cannot swing a dead cat around here w/o hitting a frack site. 30 seconds on Google Maps would have told them that.

Yep, I don't consider buying/renting anywhere until I type the address into google earth and see what's around it. Found a killer beach house in Florida only to discover it was the first house next door to a waste treatment facility. Saved me from a shit smelling weeks vacation. Always consult the google earth, always...........

[Benny Profane]

From the Bay Area and driving large PU trucks does not compute. Most likely a Prius. Pretty dumb move though. Tons of stories of people doing dumb shit like this during the recession.

Well, they're in Colorado now. When in Rome....

[Name Redacted]

I used to fly in and out of Erie a lot for work. The airport is constantly getting noise complaints from the surrounding neighborhoods. When you buy these homes, there is actually a disclosure that you must sign that states that you will be living next to an airport and it will be noisy. Yet, they still get complaints all the damn time. What is it with Erie and people like this?

[RoooR]

Below market pay. That's a hoot. The NYT just ran an article about Suffolk cops who average 200 grand a year. They didn't go into detail about their retirements, but, I'll betcha they're mostly out at 55 with very high pensions and the wonderful sweetener that nobody else gets, COLA adjustments. And they aren't the only police force with that deal.

And don't start with the dangerous job shit. When was the last time an L.I. cop got shot?

Cops are clearly the exception. Almost every large city if you look up the highest paid employees they're all cops who manage to game the system and rack up insane overtime. Not to mention every-time a city tries to pay them less they threaten to stop doing their jobs. Basically every other skill set pays less than the private sector. The person a couple pages back was making $150k to run a 150+ person department? That's a VP level position in any fortune 500 and will come with $300k base + stock.

Government doctors, scientists, lawyers, programmers, analysts, economists, engineers, managers, all take pay cuts to work for the government. But there are other incentives, lots of time off, stability, "important" work. I just lost of of my best data scientists to the DOL. He took over a 20% paycut but the work is more interesting than what I can offer.

[Danno]

Holy shit, I saw Erie and thought y'all must be talking Pennsylvania, didn't realize it was the suburban fracking wasteland of Colorado!

(for the Erie residents, I know some of it is nice)

[Danno]

Government doctors, scientists, lawyers, programmers, analysts, economists, engineers, managers, all take pay cuts to work for the government. But there are other incentives, lots of time off, stability, "important" work. I just lost of of my best data scientists to the DOL. He took over a 20% paycut but the work is more interesting than what I can offer.

I could fairly easily make twice what I am making if I worked in the private sector. But then I'd be working in the private sector.

[RoooR]

The perks listed here do not align with my time working for a federal department. Subpar insurance, subpar pay, and questionable stability.

The PTO is sweet though. 10 holidays (2 more than most private sector jobs) + 20 days of PTO if you've been there over 3 years and 26! if you've been there over 15.

[Benny Profane]

The person a couple pages back was making $150k to run a 150+ person department? That's a VP level position in any fortune 500 and will come with $300k base + stock.

Yeah, but, that Fortune 500 company is a Fortune 500 company because it exists in the rough and tumble world of capitalism, and has succeeded by showing a ton of revenue and profits for an extended period. So, good, the employees benefit from the spoils. If the company goes under, poof to those jobs. Your public administrator just has to suck up to politicians and play a decent game, and run to the taxpayer for more money. They are also privey to a lot of insider info. In this case, housing plans that could make them or relatives slowly rich, if they are smart.

And, wait. 150 employees?? Maybe that department is a tad bloated?

And, it's not just cops. Google highest pensions being paid out there right now for various states. It's all public, although tricky to find. School administrators live a pretty set life in retirement after a life of summers off, just to mention one "profession".

[AdironRider]

Not to mention the no questions asked sick time. Almost 3 weeks a year in Teton County WY. Guess they get a lot of colds, probably on Fridays.

And a county administrator, at least here and it sounds like Grand County, is the equivalent of the CEO of an organization in the private sector. Unlike a private sector admin, which is a glorified secretary. So 150 employees seems about right by the time you take 20 cops, fire department, solid waste, etc and all the employees involved with those county functions.

[old_newguy]

Not to mention the no questions asked sick time. Almost 3 weeks a year in Teton County WY. Guess they get a lot of colds, probably on Fridays.

.

I thought the no questions asked thing up to 3 days was state or federal law? Anyways, with kids in the equation it’s easy to burn several weeks a year between doc appointments for self and kids, and sick days for self and kids. Any decent organization doesn’t want sick people bringing their sickness to work to spread across the office and bring down productivity.


That Erie, CO thing is hilarious. The obvious solution for these people with so much money they can buy houses unseen and not even bother to take a flight out during the 30 day closing period is to sell the house and move.

[old_newguy]

Yeah, but, that Fortune 500 company is a Fortune 500 company because it exists in the rough and tumble world of capitalism, and has succeeded by showing a ton of revenue and profits for an extended period. So, good, the employees benefit from the spoils. If the company goes under, poof to those jobs. Your public administrator just has to suck up to politicians and play a decent game, and run to the taxpayer for more money. They are also privey to a lot of insider info. In this case, housing plans that could make them or relatives slowly rich, if they are smart.

And, wait. 150 employees?? Maybe that department is a tad bloated?

And, it's not just cops. Google highest pensions being paid out there right now for various states. It's all public, although tricky to find. School administrators live a pretty set life in retirement after a life of summers off, just to mention one "profession".

This is going to blow your mind, but there are actually government executives that are interested in running a tight lean ship. Some of them even get bonuses for improving services , implementing efficiencies and lowering costs.

They are paid well because otherwise they would be in the private sector. Some of the better ones I have worked for came out of the military.

[old_newguy]

The PTO is sweet though. 10 holidays (2 more than most private sector jobs) + 20 days of PTO if you've been there over 3 years and 26! if you've been there over 15.

And the maxi-flex schedule is hard to beat.

But yeah, benefits and pay were better at even the local level at my last job and private sector blows it out of the water. Good place to be if you are uninterested in 60 hour weeks and want stability and flexibility.

[dan_pdx]

My older brother is friends with the asst mgr. at a Les Schwab Tire store. They apparently have a pension and a profit sharing bonus program. Company contributes 15%. Don't know if it still open to new hires since they were recently purchased by a PE firm. Not an easy way to make a living slinging tires though.

Yeah, the profit sharing bonus was discontinued by the new management: https://www.oregonlive.com/business/...-dividend.html.

I'm sure it's just a matter of time for the pension as well, it's a crying shame that the kids (grand kids?) of Les Schwab would rather cash in than keep running what he built.

[Benny Profane]

This is going to blow your mind, but there are actually government executives that are interested in running a tight lean ship. Some of them even get bonuses for improving services , implementing efficiencies and lowering costs.

They are paid well because otherwise they would be in the private sector. Some of the better ones I have worked for came out of the military.

Well, pffft, the military. Now there's a lean, cost saving operation.

[pepperdawg]

Not about RE - but about public sector gigs

As mentioned above the Benefits can easily outweigh some private sector pay (and other factors)

My current gig ( IT for a public university - state job)

15 Sick days a year (cannot carry into next year) - can be used for dental appts; taking kids/spouse to appointments and many other stuff.

2 PTO days a year - (cannot carry into next year)

12 Holidays....if you work one the "lesser" holidays when the organization is open - e.g Good Friday; Presidents day, MLK etc - you get a day of comp time - so there an extra 5-6 days a year.

Vacation Time - Earn 1.75 a month and additional 1.75 on 12/31 each year. (22.75 days a year) - can accrue up to 65 days. Only paid out 45 on separation tho.

401A - EE puts in 5% ER puts in 8% = 13% ---or-- oldschool type pension - I took 401

Employee Retiree Healthcare if I make it that long. Free tuition for my kids. Old school health plan (at least for a few more years)

35 hour work week. No (rare) On-Call - earn comp time if need to be on call.

I griped about the pay when I came here ~10 years, from private sector financial services - but at time was burned out...the lure of no "On-Call" was the biggie. With 2 kids figured the free tuition would be worth it alone

But lots, I mean lots of dead union weight - frustrating sometimes..but now lots of that retiring/being pushed out for younger hipster types....circle of life...other downsides - no more bonus's; no more pay based on individual performance

[Ski220]

Yeah, the profit sharing bonus was discontinued by the new management: https://www.oregonlive.com/business/...-dividend.html.

I'm sure it's just a matter of time for the pension as well,

Well the PE guys need to pay themselves a big fat bonus for getting the deal done.

And if an employee doesn't like it and quits, there is always somebody wading
across the Rio Grande that will be thrilled to fill the position.

[m2711c]

10 more months and the gubmint gonna pay me to stay home.....







giggity.

[Toadman]

And the maxi-flex schedule is hard to beat.

But yeah, benefits and pay were better at even the local level at my last job and private sector blows it out of the water. Good place to be if you are uninterested in 60 hour weeks and want stability and flexibility.

What's the accountability factor like? Low to nil? I hear you can roll over PTO, at least at the fed gov't level. Lots of private sector companies seem to be of the use it or lose it variety.

[RoooR]

What's the accountability factor like? Low to nil? I hear you can roll over PTO, at least at the fed gov't level. Lots of private sector companies seem to be of the use it or lose it variety.

This is why you move to a state where use it or lose it is illegal. Montana for example. Got me a pile of PTO to get paid out if/when I leave.

[old_newguy]

What's the accountability factor like? Low to nil? I hear you can roll over PTO, at least at the fed gov't level. Lots of private sector companies seem to be of the use it or lose it variety.

Feds can keep up to 240 hours at the end of the year. And it pays out.

Accountability where I am is good. Other places I have worked not so much. I’ve had that experience in the private and public sector though. Firing someone requires lots of paper.

[sirbumpsalot]

Someone started a Pension Thread for you guys....guess its time to start a new RE thread instead and rename this one

[Skistack]

Holy shit, I saw Erie and thought y'all must be talking Pennsylvania, didn't realize it was the suburban fracking wasteland of Colorado!

(for the Erie residents, I know some of it is nice)

It’s an hellhole, avoid it at all costs! Between the frack sites, the airport, the gun range and the dump it paid to research the neighborhoods.


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[Benny Profane]

And yet, 400-700 grand. What. The. Fuck.