Shoulder Seperation? Dislocation? Imagination?

[CaddyDaddy77]

Landed on hardpack yesterday directly on my left shoulder, felt like a pretty good knock, got up retrieved my ski and pole, and couldn't hold my pole with my left hand.
Got to the bottom, moved it around a bit, and can't get it above chest level.
Iced it all night long, and it feels better this morning, but I have some funky popping when I raise it about chest-level.
My friend who dislocated his said to give it some R&R, ice and wait for the swelling to subside, and if pain persists with limited range to have it checked out for a seperation and/or dislocation.

I checked related threads, seems like this one , about WSD injury had the most info, but I don't know how to figure out if it's actually dislocated, seperated, just hurting???

Thanks in advance.

[Magoo]

Sounds like when I broke my collarbone... Sure makes washing your hair a bitch....

[CaddyDaddy77]

The hair was ok, just used the righty, but putting on socks and shoes was a freakin ordeal. Really unhappy as this wasn't anything spectacular, just a dumb high-speed fall.

[Magoo]

Ya know, I'd get an Xray, if ya can. At least to get a better understanding of what ya got. They don't do much for a broken collarbone, just arm in a sling and painkillers if necessary (mmmm, Vicoprofin!).
Could also be a torn rotator cuff...

[jibij]

wouldn't hurt to get an xray. i had very similar symptoms and a similar fall that resulted in collarbone breakage. i'd have bet money it wasn't broken until they showed me the xray.

[TJ.Brk]

It's very difficult to diagnos what is wrong with that kind of an injury. But here is two things that can tell you.

1. Palm flat w/fingers extended raise your air strait out infront of you (if it hurts like fuck don't do it).

2. With arms at your side. Roll your shoulder to the back in a circular motion. (again if it hurts like fuck don't do it).

Now I imagine you are asking this because of lack of health insurance reasons. You need to see a Doctor and get an x-ray. It is cheaper if you go to one of those "Urgent Care" centers than to an E-room.

You truly cannot tell what injury you have without seeing it, feeling it, and having an x-ray. Sorry. But ice it the best you can do untill you see a Doctor.

[Vinman]

Kind of tough to tell from your description what you might have done.

1. were there any pops or snaps when the injury hapened? I got popping after the fact.

2. does the shoulder or collar bone look funnny in the mirror. Compare the two sides does anything stick out that usually is not there

3. Any swelling, if so where, again look in mirror and compare sides

4. Did the should feel like it came out of joint or a sliiping sensation in the shoulder?


Possibilites include:

Shoulder separation: a tear of the ligaments that hold the clavicle (collar bone) to the scapula (shoulder blade)

Clavicle fracture: possible to be able to move the shoulder around and have a fractured clavicle especially if the fracture is out at the end of the bone.

rotator cuff tear: possible with the popping above chest height

labrum (cartilage) tear: also possible with popping sensation

partial dislocation (sublux): shoulder actually dislocated and immediately goes back in on its own:

So in short try to get it checked out.

[lph]

unfortunately, as stated, it can be tough tell from mechanism and your description of pain.

If i had to guess, i would say ac seperation, but who the hell knows.

you prolly should have it checked it out though. That is the only way to know for sure what it is and how bad it is.

Hard pack conditions this weekend in tahoe, I lost count of the number of wrist fractures i saw, ac seperations probably 5, dislocations 3, clavicle fractures 4. only a few broken backs and none of them that bad.

Oh and a really bad knee dislocation from dancing.

[Vinman]

Originally posted by lph
Oh and a really bad knee dislocation from dancing.

Patella I hope and not tib-fem??

[lph]

Originally posted by Vinman
Patella I hope and not tib-fem??

Nope, not patella, anteromedial tib-fem. Torn ACL, and bagged the entire posterolateral corner including Biceps femoris. Also, really big impaction fracture of the anteromedial femoral condyle from banging against the tibia.

[CaddyDaddy77]

Okay, have been doing the insurance-hoopla lately and have been changing companies, have to see what my new coverage is like.
TJ q's
Broken my collarbone before, but on the other side, pretty sure it isn't it, no discoloration in that area or noticeable lumps and / or change in position.
The palm out with flat fingers hurts like hell.
Rotating it around is possible just slight stich in the middle of the arm.
V-man q's
No popping that I remember.
Shoulder's line up pretty well, that's one of the first things I checked.
Swelling is questionable, I foreran a few times for the kids GS this weekend so I got some lumps in the gates.
Doesn't feel like it's slipping just pain, in the middle of the arm when I reach out or try to bring it above chest level, feels like it's running vertically down the upper part of my arm.

Seems like the notion is get the insurance card and go test it out.

grrrr.

[lph]

well, now with that description, ac seperation and broken collar bone are seeming less likely.

could be a torn rotator cuff (which unfortunately won't show up on xrays).

[Vinman]

I agree with LPH, not likely you collarbone or separation although a mild sprain in this area with be very painful. Torn rotator cuff or torn labrum or even just a bad bruise are up there on the list now.

[CaddyDaddy77]

Being the cheap bastard that I am, and completely idssatisfied with the medical facilities in this area, would there be anyway to tell if it's a rotator cuff or labrum? I know it will take me a day or two to get in to see the doc with my health ins., and am wondering if it's worth me waiting a day or two to see if the pain subsides.

Thanks again.

[Beaver]

I've landed on my shoulder and not been able to hold my pole or lift my arm above my shoulder. The grip problem wentaway realtively quickly (5min) but I could not raise my arm for a couple hours. It hurt but it was not excruciating like when I dico'd my shoulder.

If you have coverage go see a doc. If not, wait, if it doen't get better as a bruise/sprain would then go to the doc. If it hurts to raise your arm don't do it.

[Beaver]

heh heh "not able to hold my pole" heh heh

[Butthead]

Shut up Beavis.

[drdirt]

Do you remember if your arm was extended when you crashed?
If you were well tucked it might well be a partial dislocation/ligament strain, ice and lots of ibuprofen or vioxx/celebrex (you can try to get some free samples from the er doc if he's cool) and time is your friend.

[CaddyDaddy77]

Originally posted by drdirt
Do you remember if your arm was extended when you crashed?
If you were well tucked it might well be a partial dislocation/ligament strain, ice and lots of ibuprofen or vioxx/celebrex (you can try to get some free samples from the er doc if he's cool) and time is your friend.

It was tucked, left a nice impact on my side that way.

Thanks for the help all, and dammit I can too hold my pole, just not with misses leftie for a bit....

[Vinman]

CD, probably not without being abto to examine your shoulder. Also with the description of having the arm tucked in rotator cuff doesn't likely either. To me landing like that could be more likely a bruise, a sprain of the AC joint without separation, or still possibly a fracture to the end of the clavicle.

I had a guy come see me who was dropped on his shoulder in a tae kwon do class and I sent him for an xray and sure enough he had a fracture to the distal end of the clavicle. There was no deforemity that I could see or feel but he did have some popping when he moved the arm.

This is a tough one without seeing you. Too many possibilities.

[watersnowdirt]

sorry to hear that! I have nothing medical to offer, but I will say get it checked out ASAP. When I dislocated mine in September (and in my experience, you know if you've dislocated it - it's about the worst pain I've ever felt, and it looked totally deformed), I didn't get an MRI for 3 months, and then I had to get it done by lph since Kaiser refused to do one. Found out my rotator cuff was fully torn, and now I'm having surgery in 3 weeks. I wish I'd known earlier and just had the surgery done right away rather than having to have 2 separate rehab periods.

So, my point is...if you think you've done something nasty to it, and it sounds like you may have, deal with it sooner rather than later. Get if fixed, do the PT - hatever it takes. Shoulders suck.

Good luck!!

[Creamy Goodness]

A good test for the Rotator Cuff is the empty glass test. Arm straight out like you are holding a glass (if it helps think beer can )
and turn your hand like you are emptying the glass or can. Pain in bicep area is generally a positive sign of rotator cuff. As LPH said, will not show up on xrays, but most physicians will make you get an xray, then proceed to a MRI with contrast injected into shoulder joint -- arthrogram. MRI will show both rotator tear and labrum (SLAP lesions). Best of luck to you. Ice the hell out of it!
Ice as many times as you want but no more than 15 minutes at a
time.

[FLEX]

It's prob. your imagination . I've dislocated my shoulder 3 times, separated it once and broken my collarbone ,all on the right side . Every one of these injuries required a trip to the Emergency room because of severe pain and the joint being visibly fucked up. I didn't need to ask anyone's advice on weather to see a Dr. or go to the hospital. So, unless you have an extremely high pain threshold, or are stubborn and a little stupid ( I have a friend like this,he's made his own cast on 2 occasions, + with other broken bones after being set and put in casts,he's cut them off himself, once after 3 days,+once after 6 days...both times they were supposded to be on for 3 weeks) I would guess its not too serious...........but if its bothering you...........see a doc.