Check Out Our Shop
Page 16 of 41 FirstFirst ... 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 ... LastLast
Results 376 to 400 of 1005

Thread: United Healthcare CEO shot to death in front of NYC investor meeting

  1. #376
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    slc
    Posts
    18,867
    Quote Originally Posted by stealurface831 View Post
    teddy boy mailed his death devices from the safety of his sheltered, secluded world. luigi went out boots on the ground and capped somebody ass. who is the real softie here?
    Solid counterpoint. But, compromises must be made if your goals are as lofty as Ted's.

    Quote Originally Posted by Skistack View Post
    Let's withhold ranking until we see this guy's manifesto. 35,000 words on a manual typewriter sets a pretty high bar.
    Reports are three pages and didn't even mail it to the Times, bush league.

  2. #377
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    4,773
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    In this context, yes. In this context it's people who are no different than those who ordered thousands of beheadings during the French Revolution. Thankfully they don't have the power to do what they want.

    Ya know, this world has a lot of bad shit going on in it. Rich health insurance executives being worried that their own health might be at risk if their policy coverage decisions don't prioritize the life and wellbeing of their policy holders, won't bother me much.

  3. #378
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Edge of the Great Basin
    Posts
    6,905
    Quote Originally Posted by Tamburello Rouge View Post
    Only for those that can afford it.

    And when those demands get ignored for decades, as they have been in this case and so many others, then what?
    It is basic math that we cannot reduce healthcare costs in this country without reducing the amounts we pay doctors and hospitals. If we want to pay more then taxes need to go up. If we want to pay less than we need to either deregulate or enact price controls like the United Kingdom's NHS or Canada's health care system

    Take Trackhead's case, for example. Despite the hassle and small out of pocket expense those greedy health insurance bastards covered the rest of a $1,000,000 bill. I'm happy he's alive. He (and we) got the deal of lifetime. By many accounts the NHS is no longer providing that level of care


    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    Ya know, this world has a lot of bad shit going on in it. Rich health insurance executives being worried that their own health might be at risk if their policy coverage decisions don't prioritize the life and wellbeing of their policy holders, won't bother me much.
    Who decides, though? You're describing a system where hospitals are given a blank check to charge whatever they want. If that's what people want then they should demand a law requiring insurers pay any and all expenses no matter what

  4. #379
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    in a freezer in Italy
    Posts
    7,735
    More of the system that got us to this point isn't gonna fix the system. Business as usual is business as usual.

  5. #380
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    4,773
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    Who decides, though? You're describing a system where hospitals are given a blank check to charge whatever they want.
    Health insurance should prioritize the policy holders needs 1st. And then fight the hospital about overcharges after. If the insurance thinks the hospitals are price gouging, then they can sue the hospital and the hospital, drug provider have to show proof for why something costs as much as it does. this would likely result in standardization of healthcare costs.

  6. #381
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Edge of the Great Basin
    Posts
    6,905
    Quote Originally Posted by ötzi View Post
    More of the system that got us to this point isn't gonna fix the system. Business as usual is business as usual.
    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    Health insurance should prioritize the policy holders needs 1st. And then fight the hospital about overcharges after. If the insurance thinks the hospitals are price gouging, then they can sue the hospital and the hospital, drug provider have to show proof for why something costs as much as it does. this would likely result in standardization of healthcare costs.
    What we have is a government-subsidized payment plan funneled through insurance companies. It's not really insurance in the economic sense. Americans pay large amounts hidden as private insurance premiums to disguise the fact it's big government.

    Our insane healthcare payment system is in fact highly regulated to do what californiagrown describes. When it come to Medicare & Medicaid the costs are mostly standardized. Doctors will tell you private insurance authorizes more and pays better

  7. #382
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    4,773
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    What have a government-subsidized payment plan funneled through insurance companies. It's not really insurance in the economic sense. Americans pay large amounts hiden as private insurance premiums to disguise the fact it's big government
    I don't have a problem with private insurance if the insurance coverage is fair and swift. Where i can understand some "activism" is when insurance companies delay/deny covered care as a policy point to increase profits. Time is money to them, but time is health/life to the policy holder. That is theft of services resulting in bodily harm and/or death, and it is unacceptable. It is morally unacceptable and the people responsible for such policies should be treated the way a violent mugger would be.

  8. #383
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Edge of the Great Basin
    Posts
    6,905
    The issue is the “benefits” are bestowed by hospitals and presented as if they are nicer people than the other side who want to deny these benefits. That way they can hide the costs and scare people even if it costs people more than it should

  9. #384
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    the ham
    Posts
    14,002

  10. #385
    Join Date
    Mar 2024
    Posts
    213
    Insurance reform should be Elon and Vivek's second job. We all know it.

  11. #386
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    4,773
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    The issue is the “benefits” are bestowed by hospitals and presented as if they are nicer people than the other side who want to deny these benefits. That way they can hide the costs and scare people even if it costs people more than it should
    The nice people are the ones trying to save my life. The bad guys are the ones who kneejerk deny coverage of anything expensive as matter of policy, no matter if it is time sensitive or not.


    There are two distinct issues and maybe we are talking past each other. There is the issue of fraudulent denial/delay of claims and care by insurance companies. And there is the issue of price gouging and fraudulent insurance claims by healthcare providers.

    The first is an issue of right vs wrong with lives on the line. The second is an issue of right vs wrong with money on the line. The problem that should be prioritized seems clear.

  12. #387
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    3,300
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    Yes, political and vigilante violence. Go read his Ted Kaczynski review in the post above. Assassinating someone over abstract ideas is not the act of an ordered mind. Something people should keep in mind when trying to map the horrible act of someone going through a mental health crisis onto a political cause
    Interesting that I see an industry that doesn't keep faith with its customers and you see a political statement. Seems industry has really gotten too close to politics and maybe we should change that

  13. #388
    Join Date
    Dec 2020
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    1,925
    The first reducing that needs to be done is to profits distributed to shareholders of hospitals and insurance companies. Reducing drs pay will just result in fewer drs in the lower paying specialties.


    This is a story on out-of-network shenanigans by a company called Multipath and the ins cos that crushed folks and some providers.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/07/u...smid=url-share


    TL;DR

    “I knew they were not fair,” said one former MultiPlan negotiator, Kajuana Young."

  14. #389
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Wenatchee
    Posts
    15,652
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    He is wrong. There are lots of places in the world where political violence is routine. It's a nightmare. There needs to be unbreakable fundamental condemnation of political and vigilante violence. The alternative is societal collapse. His actions should be condemned openly without qualification. He deserves a fair trial with competent legal representation and zero sympathy
    Clutch your pearls harder. Violence will always be an answer, when dialogue breaks down and things get bleak people will resort to violence. I’m not saying that is the case with this murder though. Seems like a kook and not motivated by desperation.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  15. #390
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    关你屁事
    Posts
    9,921
    Quote Originally Posted by RTsucks View Post
    Insurance reform should be Elon and Vivek's second job. We all know it.
    lol. None of their friends have health insurance grifts, they DNGAF. They are allin on lining their pockets.

  16. #391
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Edge of the Great Basin
    Posts
    6,905
    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    Clutch your pearls harder. Violence will always be an answer, when dialogue breaks down and things get bleak people will resort to violence. I’m not saying that is the case with this murder though. Seems like a kook and not motivated by desperation [
    Quote Originally Posted by dan_pdx View Post
    Interesting that I see an industry that doesn't keep faith with its customers and you see a political statement. Seems industry has really gotten too close to politics and maybe we should change that
    The assassin is a kook who quite literally made a political statement


    If you want to change things, one place to start is the fact that no one knows how often private insurers like UnitedHealthcare deny claims because as a general rule they are not required to publish that data.



    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    There are two distinct issues and maybe we are talking past each other. There is the issue of fraudulent denial/delay of claims and care by insurance companies. And there is the issue of price gouging and fraudulent insurance claims by healthcare providers.

    The first is an issue of right vs wrong with lives on the line. The second is an issue of right vs wrong with money on the line. The problem that should be prioritized seems clear.
    The two issues are absolutely related. How is that not obvious?

  17. #392
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Wenatchee
    Posts
    15,652
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    The assassin quite literally made a political statement


    If you want to change things, one place to start is the fact that no one knows how often private insurers like UnitedHealthcare deny claims because as a general rule they are not required to publish that data
    ? Wasn’t there a chart posted in this thread about UHC and the rate of denial or percentage of denials that they have in relation to other insurance companies? They were the worst, probably why he was targeted.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  18. #393
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    SW Jongistan
    Posts
    490
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    It is basic math that we cannot reduce healthcare costs in this country without reducing the amounts we pay doctors and hospitals. If we want to pay more then taxes need to go up. If we want to pay less than we need to either deregulate or enact price controls like the United Kingdom's NHS or Canada's health care system
    I'm not sure that's actually correct. The US system spends a lot of money on all of the middlemen - for example, the recent investigations of pharmacy benefit manager companies, who theoretically control drug costs but in practice make plans more expensive for the purchaser. AFAIK, the total effect of the PBMs is not a huge percentage of drug costs, but these middle layers of the healthcare system are everywhere. I know somebody who studies this stuff professionally who regularly points out that the main difference between the US and European healthcare systems is that the US has about the same level of care outcomes but spends 2-3x as much per capita.

    I don't condone vigilante violence at all or think it's funny; one reason is pure self-interest, if violence becomes more common, I'm more likely to be a subject of it than some rich exploiter guy who can buy security. However, I think pearl-clutching about how terrible this is, is ducking the issue that consolidation of power in rich people and corporate America is priming the pump for explosions of rage, including from people who are only a little out of balance.

    Living in a country where the guy with enough stamina to write a 35 page manifesto committed acts of terrorism was tolerable. Living in a country where everyone pissed off enough to write a long Amazon review rant feels the way they can be heard is to commit violence, will not be.

  19. #394
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Edge of the Great Basin
    Posts
    6,905
    Quote Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner View Post
    The first reducing that needs to be done is to profits distributed to shareholders of hospitals and insurance companies. Reducing drs pay will just result in fewer drs in the lower paying specialties.
    Maybe fewer doctors, maybe not. The AMA works hard to reduce the supply of doctors and also to limit the type of work nurses, PAs, and NPs can do.

    Take for example anesthesiologists discussed earlier in this thread. It went viral that insurers were limiting the amount paid out to anesthesiologists. Anesthesiology is one of the cushier well paid specialties in medicine. Their job can actually mostly be done by nurse techs, but thanks to the cartel that elevates the status of doctors in the U.S., they instead receive exceptionally high pay for a job that doesn't necessitate that level of training


    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    ? Wasn’t there a chart posted in this thread about UHC and the rate of denial or percentage of denials that they have in relation to other insurance companies? They were the worst, probably why he was targeted.
    Right, I mentioned that on the previous page. What we know about UHC denying claims is based on consumer surveys, not legally required publicly available information. I'm saying it should be a legal requirement

  20. #395
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Edge of the Great Basin
    Posts
    6,905
    Quote Originally Posted by coldfeet View Post
    I'm not sure that's actually correct. The US system spends a lot of money on all of the middlemen - for example, the recent investigations of pharmacy benefit manager companies, who theoretically control drug costs but in practice make plans more expensive for the purchaser. AFAIK, the total effect of the PBMs is not a huge percentage of drug costs, but these middle layers of the healthcare system are everywhere. I know somebody who studies this stuff professionally who regularly points out that the main difference between the US and European healthcare systems is that the US has about the same level of care outcomes but spends 2-3x as much per capita.
    The U.S. spends a lot of money for health care. But we pay more but get nothing in return story is simply not true. If a person has a good health plan in America they mostly get better care with shorter wait times here than other countries. If a person has a serious life threatening illness America is a better place to be than a socialized system that will declare advanced treatment not cost effective and phase it out

    A lot of insurance claim denials are for the most advanced most expensive treatment options that might not even be available at any cost in other countries

  21. #396
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    12,139
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    If a person has a serious life threatening illness America is better place to be than a socialized system that will declare advanced treatment not cost effective and phase it out

    A lot insurance claim denials are for the most advanced most expensive treatment options that might not even be available at any cost in other countries
    Can you provide examples please

  22. #397
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Posts
    7,090
    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn View Post
    ? Wasn’t there a chart posted in this thread about UHC and the rate of denial or percentage of denials that they have in relation to other insurance companies? They were the worst, probably why he was targeted.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    Yes. UHC denies at twice the industry average.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	A7316816-4303-449E-AF75-1698819DD3BC.jpg 
Views:	69 
Size:	186.7 KB 
ID:	506933

  23. #398
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Big Sky/Moonlight Basin
    Posts
    15,225
    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVerse View Post
    I disagree completely



    Untied Health Care is more profitable because the company denied a higher percentage of claims than most other insurance companies. That's true. The answer is to demand additional reforms to the health care and insurance system

    To bad digitaldeath isn’t posting, he would call you a bootlicker.
    "Zee damn fat skis are ruining zee piste !" -Oscar Schevlin

    "Hike up your skirt and grow a dick you fucking crybaby" -what Bunion said to Harry at the top of The Headwaters

  24. #399
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Edge of the Great Basin
    Posts
    6,905
    Quote Originally Posted by bennymac View Post
    Can you provide examples please
    Sure, here's a Canadian example of woman who is diagnosed with cancer and told she has maybe 2 years to live and that she is not a candidate for surgery but Canada would provide medical help committing suicide. The woman decides to consult with foreign doctors and get treatment in Baltimore.

    “Universal healthcare really doesn’t exist,” Ducluzeau said. “My experience is it’s ‘do it yourself’ health care and GoFundMe health care:

    https://globalnews.ca/news/10118619/...united-states/

  25. #400
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Edge of the Great Basin
    Posts
    6,905
    Quote Originally Posted by Harry View Post
    To bad digitaldeath isn’t posting, he would call you a bootlicker.
    McDonald’s keeps posting enormous Ws

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •