Tahoe '24/'25 - This Thread Shall Not Be Privatized!!

[lepistoir]

Anti-racism education thread with a skiing problem? What have I stumbled into here?


Stop using the default signature on the app to advertise and add unnecessary bulk to your posts.

[TahoeJ]

Look, as long as no one pluralizes Sierra - we're cool.

How 'bout that forecast?

[Ottime]

Looks like Tahoe is practicing a Dry January.

Dunno. I don't think we had a snow problem. Hopefully we get back into it next month. This abstinence is not doing it for me.


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[maskinut]

Some fun facts about California and US Skiing I've been exploring.

I don't think the traffic in Tahoe is Alterra's or Vail's fault even if their solutions are as exciting and aggressive as the bunny hill was to Shane McConkey.


We’ve cut supply and increased demand, in the US and especially in CA.

- The population of California has doubled since the last major ski resort was built in 1972. (Northstar)
- We’ve lost 20-30% of the ski areas in the state to closure in the same period and around 50% nationally. (it isn't a lack of demand and I don't think it is greed, it is broken economics driven by a failure to balance preservation with access fueled by user groups suing each other or stalling.)
- Meanwhile, skier-day records were set last year and the percentage of the population participating in winter sports has risen ~35% since 1996.
-Just this year 200k acres of snowmobiling terrain in Tahoe NF was closed and in the Stanislaus National Forest now only 13% is open to sledders.
-Japan, a country with similar land mass and 3x the population has 17 times more ski areas than California. (500)
- There have only been a handful of new ski areas and arguably 1-2 major resorts built in the US since 1981. All other attempts have failed.

Why is skiing so expensive? Greed is an easy response but a big part of the cost derives from the fact that we, the passionate defenders of our mountain environment, are also its heaviest users while we decry development and sprawl, yet contribute to the very traffic and overcrowding we lament.

We can't afford to be paralyzed by competing interests like we have been for most of my life. Shit, I've been trying to build a garage at my house in Tahoe for four years, I've spent more money and time on the preparatory bullshit than I thought it would cost to build the thing.

What's some of the history of the builders?

-Walt Disney, challenged by the Sierra Club, passed before he could open Independence Lake or Mineral King, a resort designed to address traffic with trains and gondolas connecting it to a highway rather than creating a new version of Highway 89.

- Bill Hewlett blocked the creation of new terrain in Coldstream that could have been serviced by train and near Interstate 80 by buying land to help block the project.

-Troy Caldwell has a chance to open new terrain in his lifetime but will he be young enough to ski it the way he imagined when he bought it? Will I?

- Next, Peter Christodulo has mustered the courage, or arrogance, or insanity, or unshakeable vision and passion depending on your point of view to attempt new lift-served terrain in the Ruby’s. Will he be able to build it? Five others have tried and failed since 1955. Only two new "major" ski areas have succeeded in opening in the US since 1980 (Tamarack and Bohemia) and new terrain at Deer Valley in 1981.

Where are the Walt Disney’s who envision bringing 20,000 people to the wilderness with minimal cars and traffic?

Where is the entrepreneur who can set up a single lift on a ridge granting access to endless terrain like Japan or New Zealand or Silverton?

Our desire for preservation and outdoor recreation crowd everyone into the same roads, on the same days, in the same 4-5 towns.

Let's not pave paradise; but find a more realistic balance between preservation and enjoyment, between cost accessibility and bloated operating costs, between this year vs. in this lifetime.

Any billionaires wanna become millionaires but have fun doing it?

Any towns want to put a 2000' lift up in less than 2 years to serve their community?

[maskinut]

Never take B2B as an alt to KT. Always stay with the radness in the KT line. B2B sucks. Really sucks.

[fomofo]

Some fun facts about California and US Skiing I've been exploring.

-Troy Caldwell has a chance to open new terrain in his lifetime but will he be young enough to ski it the way he imagined when he bought it? Will I?

Speaking of Mr. Caldwell...

[hercule33]

Some fun facts about California and US Skiing I've been exploring.

I don't think the traffic in Tahoe is Alterra's or Vail's fault even if their solutions are as exciting and aggressive as the bunny hill was to Shane McConkey.


We’ve cut supply and increased demand, in the US and especially in CA.

- The population of California has doubled since the last major ski resort was built in 1972. (Northstar)
- We’ve lost 20-30% of the ski areas in the state to closure in the same period and around 50% nationally. (it isn't a lack of demand and I don't think it is greed, it is broken economics driven by a failure to balance preservation with access fueled by user groups suing each other or stalling.)
- Meanwhile, skier-day records were set last year and the percentage of the population participating in winter sports has risen ~35% since 1996.
-Just this year 200k acres of snowmobiling terrain in Tahoe NF was closed and in the Stanislaus National Forest now only 13% is open to sledders.
-Japan, a country with similar land mass and 3x the population has 17 times more ski areas than California. (500)
- There have only been a handful of new ski areas and arguably 1-2 major resorts built in the US since 1981. All other attempts have failed.

Why is skiing so expensive? Greed is an easy response but a big part of the cost derives from the fact that we, the passionate defenders of our mountain environment, are also its heaviest users while we decry development and sprawl, yet contribute to the very traffic and overcrowding we lament.

We can't afford to be paralyzed by competing interests like we have been for most of my life. Shit, I've been trying to build a garage at my house in Tahoe for four years, I've spent more money and time on the preparatory bullshit than I thought it would cost to build the thing.

What's some of the history of the builders?

-Walt Disney, challenged by the Sierra Club, passed before he could open Independence Lake or Mineral King, a resort designed to address traffic with trains and gondolas connecting it to a highway rather than creating a new version of Highway 89.

- Bill Hewlett blocked the creation of new terrain in Coldstream that could have been serviced by train and near Interstate 80 by buying land to help block the project.

-Troy Caldwell has a chance to open new terrain in his lifetime but will he be young enough to ski it the way he imagined when he bought it? Will I?

- Next, Peter Christodulo has mustered the courage, or arrogance, or insanity, or unshakeable vision and passion depending on your point of view to attempt new lift-served terrain in the Ruby’s. Will he be able to build it? Five others have tried and failed since 1955. Only two new "major" ski areas have succeeded in opening in the US since 1980 (Tamarack and Bohemia) and new terrain at Deer Valley in 1981.

Where are the Walt Disney’s who envision bringing 20,000 people to the wilderness with minimal cars and traffic?

Where is the entrepreneur who can set up a single lift on a ridge granting access to endless terrain like Japan or New Zealand or Silverton?

Our desire for preservation and outdoor recreation crowd everyone into the same roads, on the same days, in the same 4-5 towns.

Let's not pave paradise; but find a more realistic balance between preservation and enjoyment, between cost accessibility and bloated operating costs, between this year vs. in this lifetime.

Any billionaires wanna become millionaires but have fun doing it?

Any towns want to put a 2000' lift up in less than 2 years to serve their community?

This is all very nice flutterbutter but let’s be realistic: any new ski development in Tahoe is going to be a waterpark, not a single Silverton-like lift, as long as the ski duopoly exists.

[skier666]

Speaking of skiing...who is going to Fear the Firm this weekend? You know where to find me.

[TurxSki]

Speaking of skiing...who is going to Fear the Firm this weekend?

Was actually quite nice today. Prolly best skiing of last 3 days (Mt.Rose for last coupla hours)
...but Cinders tells me it's getting cold again tomorrow...so never mind [emoji52]

[SnowMachine]

You can't even say S#%&W anymore. The governor banned it in between his personal Firefighting efforts.

Holy fucking hell. Any of you racist savages get this new perfect strain of the flu? I'm just coming back from 6 days of near death.

I wish that upon nobody.

I'm finished with this dry January nonsense. Let's get this party started (with snow not rain).

[Powcruzer]

They look fine.

[powdork]

That was a bill the governor signed two years ago that went into effect 3 months ago. But hey keep piling on


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[fomofo]

Crash on 89, Friday 4pm'ish

[skier666]

F I R M

[J. Barron DeJong]

F I R M

Yup.

[El Chupacabra]

Looking at upcoming holiday weekends (MLK, President's) - - how's Sugar Bowl for crowds on those weekends? Is it like Ikon resorts that are actually less crowded than usual due to pass blackouts?

[frorider]

Today’s tour had 12 kinds of snow, from sun-crust to pow to corn.

[TurxSki]

Repost:
Have bc skis and bindings to sell. Mentioning it here before a proper posting. Don't know how much to ask/accept.

*New and unused*
Fischer Hannibal 100 skis in 170. (130-100-116. 170. radius 20,6).

Fischer, Dynafit Alpine Tour Bindings "Tour Classic Brake 105", in box.
Prolly from around fall 2016.

Would be grateful if you can suggest best/worst value, or want to make an offer?
(Please PM, or email Turxski at Gmail).

We are in Carson City, can bring to you anywhere around, or near to, Tahoe. Don't want to ship.

[SnowMachine]

F I R M

I skied freshly tuned SL skis today. I was on rails.

[old goat]

You sound like a lot of fun. The idea was to figure out something minimalist so we don't regret packing it if we can't get the other guests to participate or at least thumbs up the singing. I'm sure there will be an out-of-tune guitar there that we can wail on.


Stop using the default signature on the app to advertise and add unnecessary bulk to your posts.

Looking at upcoming holiday weekends (MLK, President's) - - how's Sugar Bowl for crowds on those weekends? Is it like Ikon resorts that are actually less crowded than usual due to pass blackouts?

Last saturday--end of xmas break + fresh pow + parking reservations required at Palisades= parking shitshow. They announced changes upcoming--more car pool parking, more paid preferred parking and more shuttles from remote lots--to be in effect for expected busy days. The lines themselves were long but not epic when I left at noon last Saturday. Parking was the main issue. As always, it will depend on the weather/snow. I would not expect less crowded than usual.

[jackstraw]

Epic shitshow. Parking full. Lift lines minimal. Hill empty except groomers packed.
North facing skied fine. Everything else was firm, but carvable ec style. Nothing south facing warmed enough

BC north facing has to be pretty good.

[El Chupacabra]

Repost:
Have bc skis and bindings to sell. Mentioning it here before a proper posting. Don't know how much to ask/accept.

*New and unused*
Fischer Hannibal 100 skis in 170. (130-100-116. 170. radius 20,6).

Fischer, Dynafit Alpine Tour Bindings "Tour Classic Brake 105", in box.
Prolly from around fall 2016.

Would be grateful if you can suggest best/worst value, or want to make an offer?
(Please PM, or email Turxski at Gmail).

We are in Carson City, can bring to you anywhere around, or near to, Tahoe. Don't want to ship.

If someone wants you to ship and you're OK with it, I have several cardboard ski boxes if you need one.

[SnowMachine]

Last saturday--end of xmas break + fresh pow + parking reservations required at Palisades= parking shitshow. They announced changes upcoming--more car pool parking, more paid preferred parking and more shuttles from remote lots--to be in effect for expected busy days. The lines themselves were long but not epic when I left at noon last Saturday. Parking was the main issue. As always, it will depend on the weather/snow. I would not expect less crowded than usual.

SB parking lots were full by 9am yesterday.


With the agenda of the new CEO, expect SB parking to be a lot more like PT. Also expect that she's looking for ways to get more folks on the mountain so that those short lines become long lines. All you need to do is look into what she did to her home mountain to see what her plans are for SB.

On the upside, if it keeps on, she's going to save me a couple thousand dollars next year. I won't buy the family SB passes to stand in line when PT offers vastly superior terrain on both sides. It might mean a few more BC days or going back to owning a sled, but I'm OK with that.

Disney was closed yesterday. They said it was a weather hold, but it sure didn't look windy up top. It felt very much like a PT "financial hold" or a mechanical failure they didn't want to talk about.

I knew back on opening day when they sold a couple thousand $39 tickets and had lines all the way up Jerome that SB lovers were in for it. It was a good 25 year run for me....

[PB]

SB parking lots were full by 9am yesterday.


With the agenda of the new CEO, expect SB parking to be a lot more like PT. Also expect that she's looking for ways to get more folks on the mountain so that those short lines become long lines. All you need to do is look into what she did to her home mountain to see what her plans are for SB.

On the upside, if it keeps on, she's going to save me a couple thousand dollars next year. I won't buy the family SB passes to stand in line when PT offers vastly superior terrain on both sides. It might mean a few more BC days or going back to owning a sled, but I'm OK with that.

Disney was closed yesterday. They said it was a weather hold, but it sure didn't look windy up top. It felt very much like a PT "financial hold" or a mechanical failure they didn't want to talk about.

I knew back on opening day when they sold a couple thousand $39 tickets and had lines all the way up Jerome that SB lovers were in for it. It was a good 25 year run for me....

Wow.
This is depressing if all true, and I suspect it may be. Last Tuesday Disney wasn't running all morning, and had just started spinning super slowly with no loading at Noon when I left. It was windy, but Lincoln was running just fine. The parking lots were all surprisingly full for a weekday, but lines were Ok. They have had a lot of mechanical issues over the last few years. The new terrain parks all seem very underutilized.

[powdork]

The resorts must be conspiring to save money since there were wind holds yesterday across the basin.
Or maybe you just can’t see wind when there’s no snow to blow around.


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