Second/Vacation Homes

[Stu Gotz]

Curious to know if folks who have purchased/inherited family vacation homes have enjoyed them or came to think of them as a burden? Both?

[MarcusBrody]

I'll be interested to hear replies to this.

I've always wanted one and am in a good professional/time position for one as I'm a professor and my wife has a remote job, so we have summers off, but I still worry that it wouldn't get used enough. Or I'd feel like I always need to go there on vacation to get good use out of it. We live far away from family and so we end up spending a lot of travel time going to visit them and then there is the rest of the world to explore, so do I really want to be tied to one place? If I was super rich, I probably wouldn't care if I only visited a place I owned a few times a year, but I'm not, so I think I might feel constrained.

On the other hand, it would be nice to just live away from Southern NV in the summer and if we got the right place, it could serve as a family gathering place. I know some extended family who are basically all still really close largely because of a vacation home bought long ago.

I think the middle ground is a weekend place. Something 1-3 hours away that provides something different than your current place. You go there during the year and then travel further during bigger breaks. I still keep my eye on those, though now my worry is that we won't stay in our current area permanently and would have to sell two houses.

We do have one coming via inheritance at some point. It's in a lovely place which I'd be very happy to spend time in. Except it's in an Indian hill station that's probably 36 hours travel from where we live in a country that has wild bureaucracy surrounding land. So it's looking to be in the burden category. My mother in law isn't that old, so hopefully it isn't an issue for a long time. My wife's brother lives in the Bay Area, so my ideal scenario would be convincing her to sell the Nilgiri's house and using the money as a down payment on a place near Tahoe where we could all meet up, but that will be an uphill battle.

[dan_pdx]

Interested to see where people land on this. My recent experience moving to Spokane while renting out our Portland house was that it's fucking miserable taking care of houses in multiple locations. I now think my perfect setup would be one house that I live in full-time and some rural acreage that has a covered deck or something similar where I can roll out a camping mattress.

[skaredshtles]

F**k the hassle of owning yet another property. I've actively avoided it because I think home ownership is a PITA.

I also don't really like the idea of being "tied" to a specific location. I know you're really not, but that's generally how it has worked out for people that I know with a vacation home.

Obviously, YMMV.

[zion zig zag]

Both enjoy and a burden. Ours is only 3.5 hours away so we use it a lot. My wife works from home full time so it's not uncommon for her to go up for a week or two at a time and then I'll go up on the weekends. I'm guessing someone is there 75-100 nights a year, maybe more including letting friends/family use it. We really enjoy being there, but there is work involved. I spent a day last weekend in the crawl space pulling out mouse infested batt insulation for example. I mean it's everything you have to do at home, just somewhere else I guess. Yard work, maintenance, etc. I don't really mind it.

We bought it just before COVID and had every intention of making it an airbnb that we used occasionally. But then I went on an every other week work from home schedule and we got used to staying there quite a bit and leaving our stuff staged around the house like we lived there.

As far as feeling like we have to use it? Not really, we still travel quite a bit but I have noticed that we don't really camp anymore. Seems like camping trips have been replaced by staying there. I would definitely do it again if I had to go back in time, especially considering the run up in property values post COVID as we'd absolutely be priced out of that market now.

[liv2ski]

F**k the hassle of owning yet another property. I've actively avoided it because I think home ownership is a PITA.

I also don't really like the idea of being "tied" to a specific location. I know you're really not, but that's generally how it has worked out for people that I know with a vacation home.

Obviously, YMMV.

I have come to that conclusion also, especially in light of the fact of how hard it is to get insurance in Mammoth these days. My new mantra is 3 months a year in Europe.

[skaredshtles]

<snip> My new mantra is 3 months a year in Europe.

[Mofro261]

Have you considered the joys of fractional ownership? It comes with one free-all-you-can-eat Shrimp dinner.

[Ted Striker]

Not me but my parents: major headache that wasn't worth the time & effort. But financially, they've done more than ok on second properties.

[skaredshtles]

Have you considered the joys of fractional ownership? It comes with one free-all-you-can-eat Shrimp dinner.

There it is.

[XXX-er]

F**k the hassle of owning yet another property. I've actively avoided it because I think home ownership is a PITA.

I also don't really like the idea of being "tied" to a specific location. I know you're really not, but that's generally how it has worked out for people that I know with a vacation home.

Obviously, YMMV.

Someone I skied with from colorado shot me a pict of the family " cabin " it was really a pretty nice house on a lake back east, she said there were fond memories of the summers but nobody in the family wanted it cuz of taxes/ upkeep

around here STR is a dirty word so people in BC who have " invested " in condos are stuck with something they can't STRrent because they need to also be living in the STR, so its affected property management companies, house cleaners ... so cry me a river on that

I could barely afford 1 house let alone 2 houses and the costs that would entail, I think early retirement was > having another house to take care of but i am lazy

[BCMtnHound]

My wife came to our union with a cabin by Pemberton. 5hr drive away. Her ideas on use (puttering around with the landscaping and interior decorating, while I slaved at the yard work and significant upgrades to Cabin and outbuildings) differed from mine (base for recreation at Whistler or up the Duffy, etc.). Make sure you are in lockstep with the partnership.

I finally convincered her to sell, we bought a travel trailer, which we use as much or more than we used the cabin. We now have more flexibility, and lower annual maintenance costs. But the trailer is a depreciating asset (although resale has remained high after COVID).

YMMV

[singlesline]

My grandparents owned a cottage on Lake Michigan in SW Michigan (well, technically up the hill in the woods off the lake, but it had deeded beach access down a path which I think was the best of both worlds). My grandpa was an architect and he designed and self built a guest cottage/bunkroom on the property as the family grew. They owned it from before I was born up until a couple years after I finished college.

I'm incredibly sad that it is not in the family anymore. But the timing of them wanting to be free of it just didn't work out with either my dad or his sister's ability to buy it...and they did the classic grumpy old man thing of not really being willing to discuss their finances or motivations for selling with their children. They started trying to sell it in the wake of the financial crisis (though it took several years) and my Aunt/Uncle had just made the choice to move further away and buy a more expensive house than they were planning on...a little "heads up" or willingness to work out the money (e.g. answer questions like "what do you need the money for? How much do you actually need *right now*? etc.) could have changed things.

Was a very special place where the family came together. Once it was gone, we saw significantly less of each other. I grew up in MN, but my parents were self employed and always made room for at least one extended stay up there every year (and sent me to be alone with grandparents a few times). My aunt/uncle/cousins lived in Chicago for most of my childhood, so they would spend significant amounts of time up there and my uncle would commute back to Chicago for work. Grandparents left Chicago for a place outside Asheville in retirement, but they would generally spend the entire summer in Michigan. I ended up in Chicago for college (and then work), so had the ability to go up there with friends.

It worked for a few reasons:

1. At least some of the users always lived within driving distance. You get a lot more use out of a vacation home that is a 2 hour drive than a 2+ hour flight...can easily spend weekends there.

2.It provided a clear change of scenery. The primary users all lived in either urban or suburban locations and there's clearly a pretty big difference between driving to a public beach or a wooded hike for the day vs spending time time living there...staying for sunset and a bonfire, hearing the sounds of nature through the window as you sleep, early morning walks to find beach glass, etc.

3. It was used by extended family. Provides justification for the expense...rentals/hotels are cheaper if you just want a vacation, but you're paying for the family bonding and memories created by having a place where people can gather and have overlapping stays.

4. It created a neutral space for family/friends, especially with spread-out living quarters. You don't feel like you are invading someone else's home so extended stays are encouraged. The vibe of a secluded beach house also begs you to stay longer--disconnect and live without a schedule, no money to spend other than stocking up groceries, no having to make dinner reservations. And changing weather--you want to stay for a while because you want that sunny clear beach day, you want the day with big waves for bodysurfing, you want the windy days to go sailing, you want the rainy day to cozy up to a book.

5. Low maintenance property (and the maintenance labor can be split among the family members). No yard or anything to have to pay someone to take care of when you're gone. No HVAC besides some glorified space heaters (and in the final years, a portable AC). Low end durable finishes. Place was seasonal, so you just shut off the water, winterized it, and boarded up the windows, and left until next year.

If you can get most of those things, I think it is a reasonable thing to do. If you can't...just spend your money renting hotels/airbnbs. Certainly not limited to beach homes...e.g. a ski condo or mountain house could serve the same purpose. Where I grew up in Minneapolis, it was super common for people to have some crappy little cabin on a little lake "up north" to go on the weekends. edit: mountain homes are going to be a lot harder/expensive though...you'll want the place to be able to handle winter, need to worry about snow removal, and have to compete with year round residents (vs owning in a place where nobody wants to live in the winter). Condos solve some of that I guess?


If they had waited a little longer to sell it, I would have been in a position to maybe chip in to keep it in the family (although I probably would never have moved to Montana if that were the case). I'm sure I would have seen a lot more of my grandparents and uncle before they all passed.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure I could get a place like that today even if I still lived in Chicago. Most of the remaining old cottages have been bought out and $$$ homes have been built on the lots...which have $$$ upkeep and expenses (and in my opinion kind of ruin the feel of being out in the woods...why have central A/C, a big screen TV, and all the amenities of home if you're trying to get away?).

[fomofo]

F**k the hassle of owning yet another property. I've actively avoided it because I think home ownership is a PITA.

Buy a house, get a hobby!

There's another angle** to all this which is well outlined here...

Can a vacancy tax "fix" mountain town housing problems?

**More so the impact to the local community and your part in it as a second homeowner, not just the potential to have to pony up for a vacancy tax

[riser4]

My wife and siblings are dealing with shared ownership of their deceased parents' farm. I don't wish it on anyone. Dysfunctional family much? Holy shit balls. We're 45 minutes away so a lot of work falls on my wife especially right now while they are doing a ton of deferred maintenance to be able to keep a renter in the house. However , we do manage to get up there for some cool things. The property is awesome. Her sister is 6 hours away, but loves to come over, play the martyr card and try to do whatever she can minimize effort and maximize credit/acknowledgement for in the eyes of the neighbors. "Look at me! I'm awesome!" Plus she's horrid to my wife. The older brother is on the West coast, vetoes any and every suggestion and would still live too close to me even if he were in another galaxy. The younger brother is helpful and lives literally on the opposite side of the planet. I wish he lived next door.

[singlesline]

Oh and maybe I'll add one more thing to the list that helped it to work:

6. Like minded neighbors. There were a few rental units and others with different use patterns, but most of the other cottages were used the same way--some primary user who lives within driving distance and spent a fair amount of time/weekends there.

If you have friends in the area, kids/grandkids have other kids to play with on the beach, etc. you'll be more likely to go and visit and actually use the place.

The downside of owning the vacation home is you don't have to plan/book in advance to use it...you just show up. You'll always be fighting the FOMO of leaving home...there's always something going on at home, some chore you need to do, some activity for your kid, that will make you say "nah, lets just stay home this week" and before you know it, the season is over and you barely used the place. Having some social connection to the vacation home creates more of an incentive to go.

That can be something structured like Saturday morning sailboat racing or a group bike ride, or something less structured like people having casual BBQs or just running into people on the beach. Plus, neighbors can keep an eye on things and let you know if there are issues without you having to pay someone to monitor the place.

[XXX-er]

These " cabins " have gone WAY up in value so the taxes are thru the roof, my buddy from colorado said sure its nice but the taxes are 35K

so who wants to spend an extra 3 K per month on taxes ?

I think some people really like to own things, me not so much

So as oposed to acres and acres of just acres

I would rather be crawling distance to the craft brew

[AdironRider]

My wife's family has a lake house in Maine. Her and her sister stand to inherit it in 10-15 years. It is a camp that her parents built their year round home next to. We love the place. It is actually two buildings, so it might just work having her and her sister own it without being weird. They get along ok, but aren't like best sister friends either, so I'm a little hesitant about the whole thing, but I'm pretty sure my wife would quit her job, sell our current house, and move there if push came to shove. Her parents are old enough that with me being the only man in the family, am stuck putting in and pulling out docks two weekends a year, plus usually a bunch of smaller projects. Her parents are more old school frugal Mainers so the whole place has been DIY'd, so its kind of a mess but charming none the less. It is 2.5 hours away so we use it basically every weekend in the summer, and we can both swing Monday and Fridays working remote so we get a lot of 4 day weekends. Don't short change the amount of work a second home takes. It is actually usually more than your primary because things sat unattended and unmaintained for longer. That always increases the frustration level. That said, it is great to have a place to get away and just change things up.

I'm not really sure how my opinion will change once she inherits it. The taxes, maint, and utilities would be a significant expenses (probably 10-15k per year for her half all in). A large part of the cost is driven by larger projects that will inevitably need to be done. That would be tough for us to swing currently, but by then we will probably be a promotion or two ahead of where we are now and will probably be able to swing it. I do fear my sister in law's ability to pay for it. That would be worst case scenario as there is no way we could buy out her half or support her portion of the expenses without doing the nuclear option above and move in full time. The school district there sucks and both my wife and I's careers are not present there so it would be a major issue.

Setting that aside, we are enjoying it immensely now but it could easily become a boat anchor. Like with all real estate it is pretty illiquid so you will need to be ready to handle that even if you decide to sell.

[Doremite]

Costs aside, I have no regrets on having a second home. That said, I suggest “vacation” home can be a misnomer. As some have already pointed out, it is a second property to care for and it does not fee like a “vacation” like a rental does. As with home #1, there always seems like there is shit that has to be done. Unless you can also afford a caretaker, which I can’t, it’s managing the realities of home ownership x2. Kids and wife will be kick’n it on the dock while I am off to the hardware store again.

I am only 2 hours away and it gets me to an area of VT that I really enjoy spending time in so it is all worth it but there are so many factors to consider - too big a burden? is not an easy question. I bought in 2015. I couldn’t afford the house in today’s market. Has worked out great for me and the family but that doesn’t mean it is the right decision for everyone that can afford to have the option.

It had more value to me when I lived in Boston since it was a great rural escape from the city. Such a different vibe that I loved. I now live in Burlington, VT so that differential has flattened a bit but I still love going there and use it probably the equivalent of 15-20 weeks a year.

[plugboots]

Yeah, well I’m a fucking maniac and can drive a long way fast w/o stopping. If you like futzing around, taking your time, and like to spend time fixing shit and not skiing biking and fishing, do it.

https://www.amazon.com/Saving-Family.../dp/141331841X

[skaredshtles]

These " cabins " have gone WAY up in value so the taxes are thru the roof, my buddy from colorado said sure its nice but the taxes are 35K

$35K per year in property taxes? This sounds like a bunch of horseshit.

[Shredhead]

$35k/year tax in Colorado is $10 million dollar cabin.

My family and I have owned several second homes on lakes and in the mountains. We've made a lot of memories and a lot of money.
Probably the best investments we've ever made, especially the ones in Aspen.

[nickwm21]

My parents own a second home. Growing up, essentially every holiday + 30% of weekends were spent there. We didn’t have many vacations outside of going to the house, similar to how a family with a boat or an RV spends most free weekends using it…

I live a ~15 hour drive away now, so only get to the house twice a year. Both my sisters and parents are only a ~3 hour drive away and are there all the time… if I was closer, I’d be there often.

Our family has spent years of our lives at that place. It’s a part of our identity, in some ways more-so than our main residences.

However I worry about my dad getting older; he maintains the place, he’s the one that will wake up at 3am to beat traffic to drive up there and shovel the snow after a big storm, he’s the one that does the fire defense clearing every spring, etc. I got that gene but my sisters did not; and their husbands (great guys) are not that type either. I’m too far away to provide the help needed.

When my parents do pass I expect my sisters will have a desire to keep the place but not the capacity to maintain it. The only way I see keeping it around is to carve out a chunk of cash from my parent’s estate (if there even is any…) and set it aside as some sort of trust to maintain the place, cover taxes, etc…


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[NBABUCKS1]

I think the burden of maintenance scales with age, square footage and functions.

I bought 10 acres in 2020 south of Jackson, WY. and built a very small cabin (340 square feet w/ loft) over two summers with my wife. Similar situation to ZZZ, wife is remote and can spend much more time there than I can. Also a lot of our camping and other exploring trips have been replaced by going to the cabin.

Right now there is next to zero maintenance because it's so tiny, well built and 'brand new'. That will/could change in the future. I really enjoyed the building process and fanaticize about building a much bigger house but a full time job makes that not possible right now. In addition I'd love to spend more time there but I'm not remote. Hopefully I'll retire early and afforded that ability but if I were to put down a bunch of money to build a new place I'd have no cash to retire on sooner. I'd like to make it a semi-permanent residence.

[Toadman]

Back in the day when I was living in Purgatory, no, not Durango, Colorado, but Northern NJ, the one thing that kept me sane was the in-laws had a house 2 hours North in, wait for it...upstate NY. At least I'm pretty sure it was considered upstate NY. Columbia county. Nice 20 acre spread built back in the late 1700's, and it was a good spot for outdoor activities. Kayayking, biking, hiking and not too far from a few tiny ski hills. Windam was about an hour away. It got a lot of use and was well maintained by the family members.

The aunt and unlce had a vacation house in Bend, OR. That got a ton of use when I was up in Seattle. Now family has moved into it and it's no longer a vacation house.

So, in conclsuion, if you have some family with a 2nd home, be nice and offer to help out with the upkeep and taking care of the little things when you get a chance to use the place and avoid the mortgage, utilities and property taxes.