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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
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    Colorado
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    810

    Tommy's boat shop is $500 million in the hole??? How many hoes did that take?

    https://www.law360.com/bankruptcy-au...t-bank-default

    https://www.denver7.com/news/investi...omers-in-limbo

    Seriously, how do you lose that much money running a boat shop? They have huge margin and sell before you get them.

    They made a ton during COVID.

    I asked the guy at the boat show how much negotiating is there on price? None, the boat will sell in two weeks or less at full price. Most likely there will be none at the end of the show.

    What if I pay cash? We make 1.5% more if you finance it.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    panhandle locdog
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    7,858
    Just like the bike industry, overbought boats at peak price and now demand has fallen in the toilet… but boats cost $200k not $2k… my dad works for an online boat marketplace that has seen a 40% drop in traffic/searches.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
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    Colorado
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    810
    They don't really sit on any inventory.

    They take deposits and you wait for them.

  4. #4
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    Aug 2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by exsparky View Post
    They don't really sit on any inventory.

    They take deposits and you wait for them.
    the Malibu lawsuit claims Malibu wanted 25 weeks of inventory in stock on a $155 million floor financing with $110 million unsold.

    I know little about them, but a location in Ventura makes no fucking sense.

  5. #5
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    Jan 2010
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    Colorado
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    25 weeks... Malibu must be in the toilet.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    SW CO
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    1,100
    The story I got was that Malibu sent a pile of their highest end boats to Tommy's to inflate their stock price. The type of boats that they don't sell a whole lot of. After that the CEO of Malibu either resigned or got fired I don't know which. Tommy's defaulted on their loans and creditors came after them. Tommy's also currently has a lawsuit filed against Malibu and from what I've heard Malibu has cut them off. Tommy's filing for bankruptcy though is news to me.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
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    8,959
    The amount of $200k wake boats on Lake Granby has exploded in the last few years. It's as is having a $100k pickup payment doesn't squeeze some people nutz enough. Is their dealer of manufacturer financing for these boats?

    Is there much securitization in the marine financing industry? I though bullshit collateral got exposed in the financial crisis but maybe not. There will always be yield hogs playing with other people money betting heavy.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
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    2,477
    Their interest expense on $500M was probably north of $3M per month at today’s rates. No idea what kind of margin there is on boats, but that’s a shit ton of boats to move every month just to pay interest.

    Guessing the pool of customers wanting to drop $200k+ on a new boat is somewhat limited?

    Also, how much of the pandemic bubble for boats, RV’s, etc, was from PPP loan funds? Guy down the street has a small paving company, he got a new RV trailer, Superduty Tremor and Bronco all back then.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    8,959
    I don't know what "small" is you can look up everyone's PPP loans. But yes, floating rate debt in a rising rate environment can be problematic.

    BRP (Ski Doo, CanAm, Evinrude) are laying people off and I believe Ski Doo is gonna build 30% less sleds than last year.

    Save money, try and keep your job/income stream secure, be strategic and buy shit on sale?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    slc
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    18,141
    Quote Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles View Post
    The amount of $200k wake boats on Lake Granby has exploded in the last few years. It's as is having a $100k pickup payment doesn't squeeze some people nutz enough.
    Same thing on all the reservoirs here, it's fucking insane. Between the diesel and marina gas the fuel bill each weekend must be pretty impressive, too. Wakesurfing is fun but it's not hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of fun (for me at least, no disrespect to el jefe, et al).

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
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    8,959
    Boats have always been a great way to spend money. And lots of people have lots of money. But you don't know who's you.

    That why I asked about boat loans and defaults. It seems specially special around here. It's Memorial Day (Thanksgiving of Summer) and there is a train of $100k plus offits headed to the lake. It's gonna be 55 and raining.

    Oh, E Foil and a pontoon is a better way to have fun.

    Sent from my Turbo 850 Flatbrimed Highhorse

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
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    SW CO
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    1,100
    Quote Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles View Post
    Oh, E Foil and a pontoon is a better way to have fun.
    And will save you at least $150k in purchase price

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
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    I can still smell Poutine.
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    I'd love a pontoon boat. Party in the shade on the broad lake where it's colder swimming.

  14. #14
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    slc
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    Quote Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles View Post

    Oh, E Foil and a pontoon is a better way to have fun.
    I like your style, Chet.

  15. #15
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    Aug 2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dantheman View Post
    Same thing on all the reservoirs here, it's fucking insane. Between the diesel and marina gas the fuel bill each weekend must be pretty impressive, too. Wakesurfing is fun but it's not hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of fun (for me at least, no disrespect to el jefe, et al).
    On an overall fun scale it does make more sense than the people dropping $100k+ on a bass boat though.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    panhandle locdog
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    7,858
    Reverse mortgages, PPP funds, dealer incentive loans… plus real estate agents, contractors, etc made a ton of money during covid… there was a lot of cash sloshing around.

  17. #17
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    Oct 2003
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    slc
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunfree View Post
    On an overall fun scale it does make more sense than the people dropping $100k+ on a bass boat though.
    No argument there.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    Big Sky/Moonlight Basin
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    14,641

    Tommy's boat shop is $500 million in the hole??? How many hoes did that take?

    Quote Originally Posted by riser4 View Post
    I'd love a pontoon boat. Party in the shade on the broad lake where it's colder swimming.
    I used to badmouth pontoon boats, until I bought one. Super versatile, I stripped out the front seats and turned it into a freighter for transporting gear out to my island. When I have passengers I throw a couple of plastic Adirondack chairs up there. Ultimate party boat.


    Island dead ahead.
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    Borrowed my brothers lawnmower and took it out to my island for the day.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Sent from my island using TGR Forums
    "Zee damn fat skis are ruining zee piste !" -Oscar Schevlin

    "Hike up your skirt and grow a dick you fucking crybaby" -what Bunion said to Harry at the top of The Headwaters

  19. #19
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    Jan 2019
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    59715
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    Beer barges FTW

  20. #20
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    Dec 2012
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    I can still smell Poutine.
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    Ed Zachary.

  21. #21
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    Dec 2005
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    11,372
    Pontoon boat to your private island! Harry wins again.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Colorado
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    810
    The word on the private lake this weekend was Tommy's was supposed to sell 300 boats to get their spiff but only sold 200. That was $2.5 m. If the boats were $300k each and they netted $100k each the 100 they were short was only $10 million, $12 million with the spiff.

    I must say I was also at Chatfield and almost every female from 16-30 that wasn't built like a truck must have been issued a thong at the dock. I would love to post pictures if the wife didn't take my phone away.

    But the lawnmower pictures are nice too.

  23. #23
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    Apr 2012
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    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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    Tommy's was aggressively expanding, buying up dealerships all over, so I assume a lot of that was leveraged, and they had a big deal with Malibu due to their size that helped them push out smaller dealers. What I don't get from Malibu, or Tommy's, or some of these "smart" CEO types is how they expected this growth to keep going uncheck like it was during COVID?

    Can't say I feel bad for them...

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    vernon
    Posts
    2,994
    Quote Originally Posted by Dantheman View Post
    Same thing on all the reservoirs here, it's fucking insane. Between the diesel and marina gas the fuel bill each weekend must be pretty impressive, too. Wakesurfing is fun but it's not hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of fun (for me at least, no disrespect to el jefe, et al).
    My boat is a 2009 23 LSV. Bought it for 51k 10 years ago and its now worth more LOL. Still gets the job done and looks good though.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    www.skevikskis.com Check em out!

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    vernon
    Posts
    2,994
    Quote Originally Posted by Dantheman View Post
    Same thing on all the reservoirs here, it's fucking insane. Between the diesel and marina gas the fuel bill each weekend must be pretty impressive, too. Wakesurfing is fun but it's not hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of fun (for me at least, no disrespect to el jefe, et al).
    My boat is a 2009 23 LSV. Bought it for 51k 10 years ago and its now worth more LOL. Still gets the job done and looks good though.
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20210911_135524.jpg 
Views:	43 
Size:	1.45 MB 
ID:	494266
    www.skevikskis.com Check em out!

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