Heritage Lab Swallowtails (R, FR, & BC)

[Marshal Olson]

I’d chose based on intended terrain (open vs treed) and visibility (blue bird vs grey bird.)

100% this!

[PeachesNCream]

I’m 6’3 205 lbs and went with the 186 fr110. To echo what others have said, I’d choose based on terrain. I went with the 186 because I spend way more time in the trees than wide open spaces and the 186 feels like the right choice. The 120 is a touch stiffer fwiw

As a comparison, the 186 on3p Jeffery felt way too short


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[Claymore23]

<p>
Thanks for all the feedback. Orders placed!</p>
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[lrn2swim]

Sorry for the noobjong question, but gonna try to mount my own fucking skis this weekend. Should the distance from the tail be measured straight pull or from the end of actual swallowtail on the ski itself along the running length?

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[Upinsmoke]

Measure as you would any other ski. Ignore the swallowtails for mounting purposes

[lrn2swim]

Yeah sorry, I get that part. Thanks though. I guess my question was more about whether you measure from the end of the ski with a straight pull or from the end of the curve on the tip of the ski itself. Probably more of a question for the general mounting thread....

Edit: NVM, got it figured out

[SnowMachine]

I slide my ski up against the wall and measure to the mount point. It has worked fine for me.

I skied my FR120 in a foot of dense snow while it was raining. Interesting conditions for that ski. It handles it well, but it reminds you that it is a substantial ski (heavy). It also had a bit if a tendency to hook up from the front and turn up hill. I really had to be balanced in the center of the ski. I would bet the R120 would be more versatile in those conditions. The FR was also interesting bases flat on the wet, firm groomers. You had to pay attention to what was going on.

The reality that I regularly find is that a 120 is effectively unnecessary in Tahoe (at least at my size). Our snow is generally more consolidated. They are fun to play on, but a 110 waist is much more versatile if you do not have a huge quiver.

I am still looking forward to getting these into their element. We may get some deeper snow this coming week where they will be fun for some untracked laps.

[skinipenem]

Sorry for the noobjong question, but gonna try to mount my own fucking skis this weekend. Should the distance from the tail be measured straight pull or from the end of actual swallowtail on the ski itself along the running length?

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Fwiw i find the center of the ski tip to tail and then mount based off of center. I double check measurements from the tail prior to mounting. Pull the tape or use a metal meter stick from the tail. I don't follow the curve of the tip or tail.

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[lrn2swim]

Mounted these (R) up today on my coffee table while watching football. CAN'T WAIT to get out on them. Should I bring them to Japan or are they too chargy?

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[lrn2swim]

Anyone with a membership wanna give the TL;DR?

https://blisterreview.com/flash-revi...allowtail-r120

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[SnowMachine]

Anyone with a membership wanna give the TL;DR? https://blisterreview.com/flash-revi...allowtail-r120 Sent from my SM-F741U1 using Tapatalk

Yeah... He liked the 193 R120 and did not like the 187 FR120. Too small of a balance point and maybe not stiff enough.

[Conundrum]

I also like the 193 R120.

[SnowMachine]

[QUOTE=Conundrum;7199567]I also like the 193 R120.[/QUOTE

I am not sure I disagree with him. I thought the 187 FR has a small sweet spot. I&#39;m comparing it to my 191 Renegade. I need more time on the FR. I will probably ski it tomorrow.

I love the build. The R may fit my style better. Undecided. Need a bunch more days. I may need some heli days with it.

[SkiLyft]

Fun ass day; 4” over night, snowed hard all day.

Took out the big boy r-one-twenties.

That ski is a hoot; started pretty sharp (standard tune). LVS and I were trading out skis and kept detuning them but got them perfectly butter’d by the end of the day.

Long and short; they are not demanding in the least but are stable/powerful monster trucks. When comparing them to my super goats they have more of the HL big dick energy. Super goats really only come alive when going Mach-shnelll. But with these I could slarve/drift at most speeds. Never really got a slashy vibe but the snow had higher water content so in drier snow might give more of that vibe.

Set them loose to LVS as his hill has bigger open bowels where the ski will shine more; my little hill just doesn’t have the terrain to justify keeping them in the stable.

For big mountains or dudes who ski a ton of heli THESE are the droids!

What a kick ass day




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[SnowMachine]

Can confirm, the FR120 is great in high density pow and somewhat hectic in hard bumps. I'm not even sure we'll get a proper day this year. It's been 5 degrees too warm every storm. I really enjoy the crud busting ability. I predict that they will be crazy surfy fun in lighter snow.

I'm outrageously excited for the AM110 for days like Friday.

[TAFKALVS]

Set them loose to LVS as his hill has bigger open bowels

I think this is what happens when a ski area gets bought by Alterra….


Anyways, I have a confession.

I bought early 187 r120s and never could quite figure them out on packed snow, etc. ended up catch and releasing them.

Got on the production 193 r120s… whoa. Much improved. Definitely some tweaks to the design and they are now $$$. Nice work Marshal.

[SkiLyft]

Hahahah yes, open your bowels… I’m scared to edit it, is the TGR virus still alive?


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[Upinsmoke]

I still love mine dearly, I have betas from the first pressing. I have no issues skiing hardpack with them, love the flat camber with just a small amount of tail rocker. The larger tip splay compared to the current run floats no problem but it’s not too much to throw off balance or have a hinge point. Have skied over lots of rocks here in SW CO(low tide till now) but no durability issues to speak of. It snowed 27” here Friday and folks were struggling everywhere but these things just work. Ski deep snow and be on the balls of your feet, the swallowtails just sink enough to offset any need to lean back. The softer flex(compared to my fl113& r105) makes them more compliant when skiing through powder whoops and chop but still plenty stout to haul the mail. I’d post a pic but tgr is acting up

[Conundrum]

Still really digging the 193 R120. I'm a big feller at 230# and have no trouble in tight spots turning and releasing where I want but can also open them up no problem. I'm finding they don't need to be on untracked. I can motor through chop without getting bounced around too. I've been taking them out more and more even when it's soft, not necessarily deep.

[fool]

Wow. I guess I haven&rsquo;t posted on TGR in a little while. I know the mods posted about it but the inability to quote/etc. has gotten bad.

The reality that I regularly find is that a 120 is effectively unnecessary in Tahoe (at least at my size). Our snow is generally more consolidated. They are fun to play on, but a 110 waist is much more versatile if you do not have a huge quiver.

How big is your quiver, SnowMachine? I&rsquo;m California based as well and have three skis: R120ST (187cm), R87 Comp, and Nordica 104 Enforcer Frees. To me that seems like a well balanced quiver of three but I&rsquo;ve only had a few days on the R120ST.

Long and short; they are not demanding in the least but are stable/powerful monster trucks. When comparing them to my super goats they have more of the HL big dick energy. Super goats really only come alive when going Mach-shnelll. But with these I could slarve/drift at most speeds. Never really got a slashy vibe but the snow had higher water content so in drier snow might give more of that vibe.

Yes, this captures my feeling well. I got them out for skiing at Alta in two days of pow - 12&rdquo; the first night (last Thursday) and 21&rdquo; the second night.
Essentially, I felt the most like Seth Morrison I&rsquo;ve ever felt. (Which still means far away from him) The skis felt like could charge through any of the chopped up powder left over. Their turn radius felt a little big for some of the tigher trees of Supreme Bowl but not terribly so, and out in the open they crushed it. Their weight was definitely noticeable on the groomed areas though - my friend with similar abilities and lighter skis (~105mm underfoot) would be moving twice as fast as me. Perhaps they need a wax? Anyone else have that issue?They might be too big for my Tahoe/Truckee-based quiver, but I&rsquo;m hoping with one or two trips to UT/CO/BC a year, they become worth it. Will have to keep pondering that based on snowfall.
Thanks, Marshall, for making a fun ski!

[SnowMachine]

Fool: probably bigger than it needs to be. K2 Disruption 78Ti, Enforcer 94, Commander 102, Deathwish 104, Deathwish 112, Blade Optic 114, Renegade, HL120FR.

The HL AM110 is going to replace the Blade Optic.

I have really found 110mm, plus or minus, work great in our Tahoe snow. I do live for the days that I can pull out a 120mm ski.

[ptavv]

I did not know there was a swallowtail thread. Here's what I put in the Lotii thread yesterday:

I don't think there's a specific thread for the 120 swallowtails? I have the Rs.

Today was the day that I finally skied them in the right conditions *and* they clicked with me I think. Skiing them on nothing but groomers and chop I've been wondering if I would've been happier mounting them 1-1.5cm back from MO's rec but haven't changed them.

Today at Crystal was weird. Yesterday snowed like 16" but it was also nuking 100+ mph wind so everything was closed. The few days before that were an atmospheric river that poured rain. Then today went warm and bluebird in the morning with greybird and ridge winds by close. So all the snow types were on offer (except blower pow). They did their usual thing in the chop in the morning which was fun with the occasional really good turn in a patch of mostly intact snow.

Once they opened Southback in the afternoon I finally got what everyone's talking about. The snow was a mix of bed surfaces from the *everywhere* avalanches with 2-3' crowns and then the edges that, on N aspects were heavy cascade pow and on all the other aspects were heavy cascade pow with varying amounts of suncrust and rain effect on top. The R120s crushed it all. Finding myself on a giant slope of untouched suncrusted pow I grimaced with the first turn expecting misery but they just… kept going. Anyway, today ruled and these skis made it happen I think.

On groomers they have a really fine margin between railing a turn on edge, slarving, and full on skidding which takes a bit of a learning curve but is pretty fun and adaptable once figured out.

[Rob Stokes]

There are some R120ST in that picture somewhere.

Unreal day at Alta, skis were perfect in the deep untracked stuff, never thought about them at all, just skied. No better compliment than that.

In the afternoon when it got tracked, I must admit I had a bit of a harder time. When transitioning between skied out sections and deep pockets I found my balance a bit off. My balance had to be forward for the harder snow and then instantly more centered/back to keep the tip up when transitioning into the deep (50cm) pockets. Kinda wish they had a bit more tip rocker.

Still loving them, just still working it out.

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[pfluffenmeister]

/\/\:/\ Sick!

I just arrived in SLC with my R120STs!
Skied ALTA last year for the first time (much of the time on my R120STs, which I love).

[The Iron Horse]

There are some R120ST in that picture somewhere. Unreal day at Alta, skis were perfect in the deep untracked stuff, never thought about them at all, just skied. No better compliment than that. In the afternoon when it got tracked, I must admit I had a bit of a harder time. When transitioning between skied out sections and deep pockets I found my balance a bit off. My balance had to be forward for the harder snow and then instantly more centered/back to keep the tip up when transitioning into the deep (50cm) pockets. Kinda wish they had a bit more tip rocker. Still loving them, just still working it out.

Where did you mount them? Mine transition seamlessly between various conditions, but I am back a bit at -8.25.