Transition Patrol vs. Spire

[Bluebird]

My son is finally at the stage he gets a new bike and one that should last him a while. With the Transition sale going on we are looking at the patrol and spire. He's 14, tall, thin. He and his buddies will be riding all over Vermont including lifts at Sugarbush, Bolton, Killington and Burke. His riding buddy just picked up a norco sight and as said to me last night, "they want to ride hard stuff this summer". He is in great shape and generally has no issues powering up climbs way faster than his parents. For the next few years I'm sure is going to be all about the down.

Anyone have personal experience? I'm leaning toward pushing him to the patrol as the mullet sounds fun.

[Andeh]

Haven't ridden either, but have spent quite a bit of time riding mullets, and can offer one insight on them. Mullets with longer chainstays (~440mm) ride pretty similar to a full 29 in terms of cornering, just with better butt clearance. When they keep a short CS (~430ish), which I believe the Patrol has, the rear end tends to cut in on corners. Like even if you set up the front wheel wide on a corner, the rear tire will track a good 3+" inside. I personally didn't love that feeling, but I could see how that'd be really fun for a teenager who wants to blow up corners, as your rear end will basically square up every corner for you.

[MarcusBrody]

I haven't ridden either of the bikes in question on trail (though I lust after a Spire as a second bike), but how much is he going to be riding park vs. other trail systems? The Spire probably wouldn't by my choice on New England singletrack. It's not so much the minor loss of efficiency, but just that I think I'd rather something a bit shorter in tight and twisty trails and climbs. Of the parks, I've only ridden Burke. I'm sure either would be a blast there and at the others. But if he isn't doing a big chunk of his days at the park, I'd want a Sentinel for an all around bike if I was getting a Transition and I'm sure that it would have no problem holding up to a relatively light rider on park days.

[Bluebird]

Their goal is to burn all of the VMBA freebies they can get their hands on and have a willing parent to drive them. They will also get the Killington midweek kid pass. So I'd imagine riding lifts at least once a week all summer. Afterschool sessions at Perry Hill and then mostly Stowe, MRV and Rochester for pedaling.

His mom has a sentinel and he likes it, but wants something different. Sentinel is slightly more $$ too.

[adrenalated]

I also haven't ridden the current Patrol or the Spire. I own a pre-mullet Patrol and demo'd a Sentinel before buying the Patrol.

The Sentinel had much more of a monster truck, go fast and smash everything kind of feel than the Patrol, which was (is) still super capable, but was a lot quicker and more playful. Given that the Spire is even bigger than the Sentinel, I'd imagine that the Spire is even more of a rocketship.
Go fast and smash everything - Spire
Jump off stuff and play around (but still smash) - Patrol

[vermontana]

Lived in VT for a few years and frequented Bolton, Sugarbush, Killington a fair bit while Perry Hill was my primary after-work riding area, had my spire for last season there and rode a new patrol around a parking lot once. I can echo what others have said that the spire is a rocket ship, just wants to go fast and is super composed over anything you can throw at it, the patrol seems like it could corner a bit faster and be generally a bit more playful, although I never thought the spire was hard to catch air or play around on on. Its definitely a big bike though which can take some creative body movements in tight NE singletrack.

If your son has any racing aspirations I would steer him towards the spire, also the fact that he is tall would also make it seem like a full 29 might fit a bit better. I had it as my only bike for a bit, but ended up building a hardtail last year to ride trails from the house and more mellow ones with the GF, the spire is a bit of monster truck to do pavement transfers on. There's no other bike I'd rather ride Perry on though.

[Bluebird]

Thanks. Definitely not into racing. He's tall for 14 (5'10") but not huge, yet anyway. I showed him this:

Go fast and smash everything - Spire
Jump off stuff and play around (but still smash) - Patrol

he seemed to gravitate to jump off stuff and play around.

[TCNROMPER]

Although you are a-b'ing transitions I would also consider looking at stumpjumper evo expert on sale. I am not sure what build spec you are looking at with the transitions, but the evo expert marked down from 6.5k to 5k has a pretty awesome build and all sizes in stock it looks like. I know, its a specialized...I've wanted to not like them but they do ride really well and would be pretty ideal for what riding he is looking at doing. Also you should have pretty good specialized support out of skirack should anything come up.

[XtrPickels]

Came to mention Stump evo.
Geo adjust can really change the feel of the bike - can also be mulleted.

[Bluebird]

Will take a look at the evo. He is already contributing $$ to break the $4k mark so the extra would be on him.

[MarcusBrody]

Will take a look at the evo. He is already contributing $$ to break the $4k mark so the extra would be on him.

They do have some slightly cheaper models that also look good: the Rockshox version of the expert is $600 less (with select+ level suspension) and the allow with Fox Factory suspension is a few hundred less than the carbon with performance elite.

[TCNROMPER]

They do have some slightly cheaper models that also look good: the Rockshox version of the expert is $600 less (with select+ level suspension) and the allow with Fox Factory suspension is a few hundred less than the carbon with performance elite.

Just came back to say the same thing. The evo comp build spec is on sale at 3.75k to meet that sub 4K threshold. Still carbon, and mechanical shifting, over electronic…which may not be a bad thing for him.

[toast2266]

Having once been a 14 year old that enjoyed jumping off of stuff and playing around on a bike, I would emphasize durability over carbon and extra dials on the suspension.

I think I destroyed more bikes and parts in my teenage years than I did at any other point in my life.

I'd go for an alloy frame and keep some cash in reserve for repairs. Maybe just buy a couple spare wheelsets right from the get-go.

[Andeh]

I'd also caution against any bike/build with a Fox X2. There's a ton of reports of them only lasting 50 miles or so before needing warranty work, and I know 2 buddies who've had the seals on theirs fail prematurely. That's the last thing you want for a teenager's bike.

[east or bust]

I'd also caution against any bike/build with a Fox X2. There's a ton of reports of them only lasting 50 miles or so before needing warranty work, and I know 2 buddies who've had the seals on theirs fail prematurely. That's the last thing you want for a teenager's bike.

The X2 on my 2021 bike lasted about half a season before air got into the damper. Sent it in at the end of the season and it rode fine all last year. Shop took another look a few weeks ago and decided it didn’t need a service yet.

So in short, there were/are some issues with that shock but idk if I’d specifically stay away from builds that spec it. To be completely honest other than the squishy sound after compressing the shock after the bike sat for a day or so, I didn’t really notice any major performance setbacks, it may have rode a bit harsher but bottom line is it was still rideable.

In regards to OPs original question I’d go Patrol over Spire for sure. Tougher decision to make is Patrol vs Stumpy Evo…

[MarcusBrody]

The X2 on my 2021 bike lasted about half a season before air got into the damper. Sent it in at the end of the season and it rode fine all last year. Shop took another look a few weeks ago and decided it didn’t need a service yet.

So in short, there were/are some issues with that shock but idk if I’d specifically stay away from builds that spec it. To be completely honest other than the squishy sound after compressing the shock after the bike sat for a day or so, I didn’t really notice any major performance setbacks, it may have rode a bit harsher but bottom line is it was still rideable.

In regards to OPs original question I’d go Patrol over Spire for sure. Tougher decision to make is Patrol vs Stumpy Evo…

I've also (cross my fingers) had good luck with my X2. It's only been 5-6 months, but I've put probably a few hundred miles on it on some of the rockiest terrain you'll fine and it's held up. I have been tempted to grab a Jade X coil as a backup just because of the stories, but that might be me wanting to buy more bike parts.

[Bluebird]

Trigger pulled on the Patrol. He was more pumped on it based on everything we've looked at, slightly cheaper and I am more familiar working on sram/rockshox stuff.

I'm pumped to watch him ride and take it for a spin myself. Thanks!

[MarcusBrody]

Seems like an awesome bike. Hope he (and you) enjoy it!

[Eluder]

Trigger pulled on the Patrol. He was more pumped on it based on everything we've looked at, slightly cheaper and I am more familiar working on sram/rockshox stuff.

I'm pumped to watch him ride and take it for a spin myself. Thanks!

Should be an awesome bike.

[summit]

You can't go wrong.

Love my Spire.

[frorider]

I'd also caution against any bike/build with a Fox X2. There's a ton of reports of them only lasting 50 miles or so before needing warranty work, and I know 2 buddies who've had the seals on theirs fail prematurely. That's the last thing you want for a teenager's bike.

I refuse to run shocks like the float X2 that don’t enable simple at-home air can seal service. Spending a couple hundred on a full rebuild annually is irritating.

[summit]

FWIW my X2 ran beautifully on my Spire, no service needed. But yea maybe I should get it serviced now

[MarcusBrody]

Now that Bluebird's kid is taken care of, summit, tell me more about your Spire. What sort of use are you putting it through? What size are you on?

[summit]

I probably ride 70/30 trail vs lift

Previously I'd been on various extremely well outfitted Intense Tracer 275s for 7 years (with a brief detour onto the Banshee Rune) and I rode a Large. I was in love with that bike.

Now I love the Spire.

Spire XT build I went Medium which is correct for me (5'10). I put a cascade link on it, allowing me to pull the extra spacer from the X2, run the stock DT Al wheels for park and bought carbon Roost wheels for trail (strong recommend). I swapped out to a bigger OneUp dropper (stock was only 150), Oneup carbon bars, and Magura brakes (4pot front, 2 pot rear).

It climbs better than my Intense did. It climbs better than any 170/180 29er has the right to, and it's on-paper-slackness is not a problem at all, which is great because it is overbiked for a fair amount of trail riding I do out my front door. But it has all the give'r needed for steep tech (Whistler valley trails, Moab unsanctioned, CO shuttle trails) and big parks lines (Keystone and Whistler double blacks). I run out of talent before I run out of bike.

I want to burl up the Factory 38 to a shiney new Zeb 180, but at that point I feel like I should get a trail bike and I've very much wanted a one bike quiver.

[MarcusBrody]

I probably ride 70/30 trail vs lift

Previously I'd been on various extremely well outfitted Intense Tracer 275s for 7 years (with a brief detour onto the Banshee Rune) and I rode a Large. I was in love with that bike.

Now I love the Spire.

Spire XT build I went Medium which is correct for me (5'10). I put a cascade link on it, allowing me to pull the extra spacer from the X2, run the stock DT Al wheels for park and bought carbon Roost wheels for trail (strong recommend). I swapped out to a bigger OneUp dropper (stock was only 150), Oneup carbon bars, and Magura brakes (4pot front, 2 pot rear).

It climbs better than my Intense did. It climbs better than any 170/180 29er has the right to, and it's on-paper-slackness is not a problem at all, which is great because it is overbiked for a fair amount of trail riding I do out my front door. But it has all the give'r needed for steep tech (Whistler valley trails, Moab unsanctioned, CO shuttle trails) and big parks lines (Keystone and Whistler double blacks). I run out of talent before I run out of bike.

I want to burl up the Factory 38 to a shiney new Zeb 180, but at that point I feel like I should get a trail bike and I've very much wanted a one bike quiver.

Thanks, I'm sitting in the other direction. I've got a one bike quiver that I like, but it's more on the perfect to a bit underbiked for where I ride. I've got a Ripmo (V2) that's a pretty great all around bike and I wouldn't want something too much bigger for most of the riding I do (pedaling desert chunk, though sometimes lively desert chunk), but my home trail system also has some steep, rocky, loose DH trails that make me want something bigger and slacker than the Ripmo at times. I just keep hesitating to spend the money as I ride those trails less than others, mostly because they take a good while to pedal up to. A small bike park opened on the other side of the metro area from me last year, but so far it's stuff that my Ripmo (with an X2 and 38) handled just fine, though it was blown out by the end of the season and some braking bumps would have been nicer on a bigger bike.

Had I not gotten the Ripmo, the Spire on sale would probably be on my way now and I'd just deal with getting off at many switchbacks. I'm 6'3" 210 geared up, so on one hand, I think the big 29ers feel somewhat natural, but they also end up being really long bikes in my size.