Ortovox/Arcteryx LiTRIC Airbags

[North]

Battery packs are almost universally heavier than canister packs. The motor and fan drives are heavy…although they are rapidly refining them and dialing in the safety factor (which was probably much too high for gen1).

I agree the BCA doesn’t feel super heavy. Although lighter is always nicer…

That may have been true until recently. There are now multiple battery offerings that beat comparable canister packs on weight. Mammut and BCA's canister options look especially heavy now. Granted, most of the competitive battery options are LiTRIC packs which have not been proven. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...FaQ9g/pubhtml#

I need to get to a shop and play around with the new Ortovox and BCA options. On paper the weight savings of LiTRIC is very compelling, but usable capacity and feature set aren't comparable on a spreadsheet. Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised by the BCA.

[bennymac]

I would love to add a custom stash bag to the bottom of my Scott Patrol - something secure I could stash skins and a bike water bottle into. I find accessing the free space inside airbag packs during quick transitions annoying and inefficient.

[jacob_dbu]

I would love to add a custom stash bag to the bottom of my Scott Patrol - something secure I could stash skins and a bike water bottle into. I find accessing the free space inside airbag packs during quick transitions annoying and inefficient.

Yeah the normal top-loading doesn’t really work in an airbag pack because that’s usually where the airbag stuff goes

[bennymac]

Yeah plus the shovel/prove pocket holds that gear right in behind the airbag - so when using either pocket you’re stuffing gear past this stuff down into the open space beneath it. The majority of free space lies deep underneath the airbag and battery/fan - which is fine for food and first aid/repair kit but is annoying for things you move at every transition.

[Ørion]

Took the gamble and my Ortovox Litric Tour 40 showed up today.

Few first impressions:

• Cinches down well enough that it almost makes the zip system redundant.
• Back panel is stiff and very supportive
• Included helmet carry isn't really designed for people that have to use longitudinal degrees to measure their heads. Smith Summit in L is on the outside of the adjustment range.
• Shovel/Probe pocket can only fit a BD Evac 7 if you put the handle in upside down to accommodate the goose-neck shaft, but it does fit. Any straight-shaft shovel of similar or smaller size should have no issue but I have a hard time seeing a larger blade fitting, regardless of shaft design.
• If there's a way to remove the Litric unit, it isn't immediately evident. Ortovox included an "Air Travel Information" pamphlet to keep with it when flying. Their official stance is that it is PPE, not luggage, and falls under category DGR 2.3.A (portable electronic device) with a 100 Wh limit. Worst case scenario, I could see just fully unzipping the circumferential zipper and stuffing it in a normal carry-on.
• My cheapo luggage scale seems to confirm manufacturer's weight.

[gramboh]

Anyone get hands on with the Arcteryx Micon Litric 30? My buddy was told 2100g weight which seems way too light. We are both using Arcteryx Voltair, 3465g, so it's a pretty damn big weight savings if those claimed weights are anywhere near true.

[Jtlange]

Took the gamble and my Ortovox Litric Tour 40 showed up today.

Few first impressions:

• Cinches down well enough that it almost makes the zip system redundant.
• Back panel is stiff and very supportive
• Included helmet carry isn't really designed for people that have to use longitudinal degrees to measure their heads. Smith Summit in L is on the outside of the adjustment range.
• Shovel/Probe pocket can only fit a BD Evac 7 if you put the handle in upside down to accommodate the goose-neck shaft, but it does fit. Any straight-shaft shovel of similar or smaller size should have no issue but I have a hard time seeing a larger blade fitting, regardless of shaft design.
• If there's a way to remove the Litric unit, it isn't immediately evident. Ortovox included an "Air Travel Information" pamphlet to keep with it when flying. Their official stance is that it is PPE, not luggage, and falls under category DGR 2.3.A (portable electronic device) with a 100 Wh limit. Worst case scenario, I could see just fully unzipping the circumferential zipper and stuffing it in a normal carry-on.
• My cheapo luggage scale seems to confirm manufacturer's weight.

I very much agree with all of these. Able to fit a D handle shovel in but just barely.

What's funny is as I read the regulations it seems to allow for it to be checked, but that is contradictory to what all the other information sources say.

[Jonathan S.]

That posted graphic looks like an excerpt from the recommendations of IATA, an industry association that has no bearing on TSA rules (if the concern is travel within the U.S.).

[Ørion]

That posted graphic looks like an excerpt from the recommendations of IATA, an industry association that has no bearing on TSA rules (if the concern is travel within the U.S.).

Weirdly, I haven't found any extra restrictions from the TSA on non-removable lithium batteries.

The entire controversy is that the IATA's description of smart luggage with non-removable batteries is vague enough to also technically cover a Litric bag. AFAIK there's only been one incident in Europe so far though.

[Mokomahonah]

I got my hands on the new dead bird LiTRIC 40L pack through SAR. We ordered maybe 12 or 15 for people of various sizes (5'2" to 6'8").
•I think they only come in large (at least that's what we ordered), which was way too big for some of the shorter people, and feels a little small for those of us 6'2" and taller.
•I am used to Mystery Ranch packs for load carrying and I find this pack to be not as good, but acceptable.
•It is very light.
•No zippered hip pockets, but one side has a stretchy mesh stash pocket. I will likely sew on hip pockets or get some that fit over from 511.
•Other side has a gear loop for things that dangle.
•Like Summit said, the avy gear pocket is clumsy, side access that is hard to efficiently get my 330 BCA probe out of. I wish they put it on the bottom of the pack, like my POC PVD 20L pack.
-There is access through the main compartment, but why?
•Compression straps either go over the avy pocket or just in front of the zipper (with less compression available).
•Haven't played with the helmet carry, but a friend uses one from another pack that is much lighter than the Arc'teryx supplied one.
•Never had to tour with a backpack you need to remember to charge, so that is a learning curve for me but its all in the game.
•I have flown with it. No problems though TSA or Alaska airlines (minus questions about the steel cable in the probe).
•When flying however, I did stuff the pack to the gills. When walking around the airport the zipper for the airbag kept unzipping, which was annoying.
•Main compartment zipper is waterproof, but the bag material is not very stretchy, so while zipping the zipper can get kind of folded - which is annoying.
•Not sure if I am just not transitioning quick enough, but any time I tour during weather everything seems to get wet in the top compartment. Probably user error.
•No A frame carry, but that probably goes without saying for airbag packs. I like A frame for climbing and bike riding, but not really an issue.
•You can string a bladder hose or radio wire through the shoulder strap without the trigger.

I am not a backpack designer, but I think it would make more sense to put the battery fan and air intake at the bottom of the pack. This would necessitate a way to get that air up into the pack, but it would also free up the most usable space and move the mesh air intake from the side (where rain and snow get into the pack) to the bottom.

If I got to choose, I would probably go with the Ortovox pack that you can change out the volume. Or since I am a MR fanboy, they should do the colab with ortovox and make a bomber airbag pack.

[Thesystemsplit]

a raide fl40 pack with airbag would be the cats meow

[bennymac]

Agreed with a lot of what Moko posted above. I’m comparing it to my Scott E1 40L pack

1. Noticeably lighter by a lot.

2. No zippered hip pocket but as mentioned it has a stretchy mesh “pocket” good enough for lip balm and an energy gel packet

3. Avy pocket has both side access and top access but the top access is through the main compartment- so you would open main zipper to expose inside of main pocket where there is a zippered access into top of avi tool pocket.

4. Airbag, inflator, battery are nicely tucked up very high - which is big difference from E1 system where the electronics and fan are smack dab in the middle of your pack which makes it awkward to pack around.

5. Didn’t get to use ski carry system to see if it pulls open the airbag zipper (which can be an issue on my Scott pack)

6. Accessory pocket is on very top of pack and has good volume for snacks, small gloves, goggles/glasses. Way more functional than the 2 interior pockets on the Scott pack.

7. Helmet holder is superior than the junky one that comes on the Scott pack

Is it a perfect airbag pack? No. But it’s more functional than the Scott and is way lighter. I’ll be selling the Scott and moving into it once it’s available to the general public.

[bennymac]

[bennymac]

[bennymac]

[MakersTeleMark]

I've had a dead bird pack with those zippers. They all will fail horribly.

[zion zig zag]

Bump. Anymore thoughts on the Ortovox Litric packs after a season of use? Any word on when and if the ArcTeryx pack will be available to the general public?

[zion zig zag]

I guess some general questions I have about both Arcteryx and Ortovox Litric:
Does the airbag system take up some of the advertised space? Or is a 32L have actual 32L of volume compared to non-airbag packs? How well do they carry and distribute the weight? Any other general thoughts if you’ve been using one of them for a while?

I used a Mammut airbag pack for a few seasons but have gone back to a non-airbag pack the last few, primarily due to weight. Testing the waters again.

[zion zig zag]

I was able to add the ArcTeryx pack to my cart yesterday on their website. A few days ago it said for Pro group purchase only. Maybe it’s released now?

[Ørion]

I guess some general questions I have about both Arcteryx and Ortovox Litric:
Does the airbag system take up some of the advertised space? Or is a 32L have actual 32L of volume compared to non-airbag packs? How well do they carry and distribute the weight? Any other general thoughts if you’ve been using one of them for a while?

I used a Mammut airbag pack for a few seasons but have gone back to a non-airbag pack the last few, primarily due to weight. Testing the waters again.

I picked up the Ortovox Litric Tour 40L last season and have taken it on a half dozen outings so far. My previous bag was a BD Jetforce pro for reference. Never pulled in panic but have tested the airbag function a couple times now.

The fixed back length will somewhat dictate how well it carries but I've personally been extremely impressed, especially compared to my prior bag. Relatively speaking, it practically disappears once adjusted with no flopping or weird center of mass issues at all.

The side compression straps are so effective that I haven't bothered swapping to the 18L zip that I picked up for shorter missions, I just cinch down the 40L. Doing so will pucker the circumferential zipper and make it harder to close if you're fully opening it up, but a quick loosening and retightening of the right side compression strap is quick and painless.

I can only speak very loosely to volume, but it seems true to size when comparing it against the Raide LF 40L pack. Listed volume seems to be gross, not net, so the airbag system eats up a couple liters.



General unsolicited thoughts:


Their burst zipper design is brilliant and won't pop open if you pack too much in the bag like the Jetforce was known to do.

Having the system activate/deactivate via rotating the handle is intuitive and easy.

I hope they switch to a replaceable battery system if/when they create a new version, similar to the E2. Don't know if it's feasible but 3x AAA would be nice since I carry spares for beacons already. I suspect they went with a hardwired system to shave weight and increase durability though.

I wish their avalanche pocket was slightly wider. The venerable BD Evac 7 shovel wouldn't reasonably fit so I switched to a Mammut Alugator Pro Light Hoe, which is about as wide as you can go. I can fit the Mammut shovel, a BCA Stealth 300 probe, and a G3 bonesaw in the pocket without binding it up, though the pocket is stretched enough that all small accessories pockets on that panel are near useless. The avy pocket was clearly designed for Ortovox's narrow but deep shovels.

The hip-belt + leg-loop design is a nice quality of life improvement since it uses a "normal" belt buckle. Wish it had a hipbelt pocket but that's easy enough to fix with a 3rd party add-on.

Integrated helmet and axe carries work well. Haven't had a chance to carry skis or rope with it yet.

[zion zig zag]

^^^Awesome, thanks for the details.

[ianpnw]

Six or seven days with the Ortovox 40L. I agree with the above points. It’s super comfy for me (6’, 175#), my BCA shovel fits just fine. And I found the ski carry system to be balanced and easy on long, steep boot packs.

[Tjaardbreeuwer]

Yeah plus the shovel/prove pocket holds that gear right in behind the airbag - so when using either pocket you’re stuffing gear past this stuff down into the open space beneath it. The majority of free space lies deep underneath the airbag and battery/fan - which is fine for food and first aid/repair kit but is annoying for things you move at every transition.

With my Scott e1 40, I deal with that by putting that stuff on the side , near the bottom of the pack. I then zip the 2 sliders shut next to that stuff.
That way I can get them out by swinging 1 shoulderstrap off, unzipping the zipper partway, and pulling/stuffing them in/out.