Water.....

[ötzi]

Got shot down in May.

It was riding high in April. That's life. That's what the people say.

[Danno]

There's an article somewhere on the internetz by a former hydrologist engineer that talked about the amount of energy that would be needed to pump water over the mtns to get the water into the Western CO river watershed. Seems like it would be quite expensive, even if they were to use a combo of solar, and wind and fossil fuels to power the pumps. IIRC, he said that if they had started on a project like that 50 years ago, it probably would have helped mitigate a lot of flooding damage over that time frame, and obviously the time value of money being what it is, would have been cheaper to have built out.

I wasn't actually being serious, was just poking fun at Bmills's post.

Though eventually shit like that will be put on the table.

[ötzi]

Why can't they dump desal salt back in the ocean? Obviously not all in one spot but it wouldn't be that hard to spread it out.

[californiagrown]

I wonder what they do with all the salt from the desalination facilities in Saudi Arabia and other gulf states? When I was there in 90/91 the scale was mind boggling.

Can anyone really tell the difference between salt dunes and sand dunes when its 128F out?

[bodywhomper]

Desal waste is sometimes combined with a wastewater treatment plant outfall.

[riser4]

Let’s rob Peter to pay Paul

Mary feels left out.

[bodywhomper]

Mary feels left out.

But the wind will still cry for her

[Dantheman]

Though eventually shit like that will be put on the table.

The UT legislature has seriously floated the idea of piping water from the Pacific Ocean to the GSL to keep the GSL from drying up.

Why can't they dump desal salt back in the ocean? Obviously not all in one spot but it wouldn't be that hard to spread it out.

The brine is so dense and concentrated that it's surprisingly difficult to get it to mix back into the ocean water. It tends to remain as a separate phase and flow along the bottom. Wherever it flows and finally settles it kills everything inhabiting the seafloor.

[skaredshtles]

<snip> It tends to remain as a separate phase and flow along the bottom. Wherever it flows and finally settles it kills everything inhabiting the seafloor.

Sounds good! Out of sight, out of mind, amirite??

[Danno]

The UT legislature has seriously floated the idea of piping water from the Pacific Ocean to the GSL to keep the GSL from drying up.

I didn't know that one, but getting water from the Missouri River has been floated (see what we both did there) as well. I know these ideas are out there. And eventually they will get more serious.

Heck, Utah has been building the pipeline to St. George, so its willingness to spend exorbitant sums on stupid water ideas should never be doubted.

[Dantheman]

I didn't know that one, but getting water from the Missouri River has been floated (see what we both did there) as well. I know these ideas are out there. And eventually they will get more serious.

Plans way more audacious than diverting the Missouri have been proposed:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_...Power_Alliance
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_...elopment_Canal

[fastfred]

I



That's the optimistic scenario, which depends on people being willing to accept government control and regulation on a massive scale. The more likely scenario is more like Mad Max.

well duh man no one wants their god given rights infringed upon in this country
so eating cows air conditioning and heating and having big houses and having a personal car watering lawns in metro denver and the rest of the "arid" west is right not a luxury we need to make sure of that

[skaredshtles]

Plans way more audacious than diverting the Missouri have been proposed:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_...Power_Alliance
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_...elopment_Canal

Man... talk about a steaming pile of Socialism...

[LongShortLong]

That's the optimistic scenario, which depends on people being willing to accept government control and regulation on a massive scale. The more likely scenario is more like Mad Max.

People are willing. They insist. Try walking naked in the road drinking beer and tell me how it goes. The government will massively control and regulate that, and quickly.

[LongShortLong]

Most desalination projects serve the primary goal of enriching of enriching their developer by fleecing the public. Panic the public about a shortage, then sell a water project at a price 100 times higher than other water. Lie about the cost by averaging the small amount of desal water produced at a very high price with the large amount of cheap surface water. Laugh all the way to the bank.

If you simply raise the water rate, as if you'd built desal, you'd get far more conservation than the desal plant can produce. That's how expensive desal water is. That Santa Catalina "successful desal" example someone cited... "Island-dweller Lori Snell grimaced as she tallied her bill recently at the Avalon Laundry — nearly $50 for three large loads."

Desal makes as much sense as building a ski hill in Dubai.

[altacoup]

The price of water in Utah is stupid cheap. SLC has the cheapest water of any major metro area in the country. My parents live in a rainforest on the Oregon coast and pay more for water than I do in SLC. That’s just plain stupid. For all the talk about free market economics coming from the Utah churchislature, they sure love that residents of Utah pay way bellies market rate for water in a desert.

[muted reborn]

The price of water in Utah is stupid cheap. SLC has the cheapest water of any major metro area in the country. My parents live in a rainforest on the Oregon coast and pay more for water than I do in SLC. That’s just plain stupid. For all the talk about free market economics coming from the Utah churchislature, they sure love that residents of Utah pay way bellies market rate for water in a desert.

For others outside Utah - In July we used 24000 gallons. Bill was $80. It's much cheaper for businesses, they have a different rate. I've said this sotry before but my company building was losing a gallon every 2-3 seconds in a water main leak for weeks (well, it started as a trickle then poured out) and the bill went up from $15 to, fuck I can't remember, maybe $30.

[muted reborn]

Plans way more audacious than diverting the Missouri have been proposed:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_...Power_Alliance
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_...elopment_Canal

You posted in another thread awhile ago an eye opening map of all water pipelines throughout the state - or maybe only to the wastach front - can you post that again? I can't find it on google.

[oldnew_guy]

For others outside Utah - In July we used 24000 gallons. Bill was $80. It's much cheaper for businesses, they have a different rate. I've said this sotry before but my company building was losing a gallon every 2-3 seconds in a water main leak for weeks (well, it started as a trickle then poured out) and the bill went up from $15 to, fuck I can't remember, maybe $30.

Jesus. I think my minimum bill is $100 a month for ~4000 gallons.

[PB]

Uh, we already reclaim waste water pretty much EVERYWHERE. Unless you live in the first stop of the water from from the mountains, you're very likely drinking reclaimed waste water. So I'm gonna go with that being the easier/cheaper one.

I know we do, although I'm not sure it's as high a percentage of our potable water as you seem to imply. My point was that it sounds cheaper to reclaim used waste water than desalinate (may change in the future), so why the rush to desalinate? Perhaps if desalinated water is dedicated to new growth + make-up after we're successful at reclaiming at least 90% per cycle, but we've got a long way to go to come even close to that goal. I just think it makes more sense to really get aggressive about re-using for non-ag water.

[Garbowski]

Just checked my latest bill and I used 6000 gallons and paid $190 for water and sewer in Seattle. That's for 2 months.

[skaredshtles]

The price of water in Utah is stupid cheap.

Denver Water is the same... stupid cheap.

[californiagrown]

Just checked my latest bill and I used 6000 gallons and paid $190 for water and sewer in Seattle. That's for 2 months.

Sewer is the expensive part, FYI. And sewer rates are calculated off domestic water usage.

[skaredshtles]

Sewer is the expensive part, FYI. And sewer rates are calculated off domestic water usage.

Around here sewer is *also* stupid cheap. Just paid my yearly bill - it was $271.

[Garbowski]

Sewer is the expensive part, FYI. And sewer rates are calculated off domestic water usage.

Yeah, the $190 for 6000 gallons is $88 for the water and $102 for the sewer, but I can't get one without the other.