If only there was something we could do...

[Jong Lafitte]

The artist dated that in ‘17


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[jfost]

any way you cut it people will find guns, so maybe the issue is asking why people want to kill other people and why do they think it would be a good thing ?

Great point, it’s not even worth it to try anything at all to help the children in our country. Kinda like every morning now I stopped even eating my breakfast since I’ll just end up shitting it out sometime later…

Would it be ok to make it more difficult to obtain guns, or is it no deal?

If people are so interested in having guns to defend themselves from our government, why don’t they just stockpile them illegally? Why care about laws during an insurrection?

[mb6f50]

any way you cut it people will find guns, so maybe the issue is asking why people want to kill other people and why do they think it would be a good thing ?

The less guns there are to find the more valuable said guns become and the harder and more expensive they are to get.

If we required all guns to be registered and the owners of those guns to be responsible for them the number of illegal guns would slowly go down.

Also, to get something illegal, like a gun you have to know the sort of people that know the sort of people that sell those things.

Most of these mass shooters are kinda loners, socially inept, weirdos for lack of a better term.

They are going to have a harder time finding illegal things plus lots of criminals that would have no issues shooting an adult for a number of reasons would never sell a gun to someone they thought was going to kill a bunch of little kids.

There is a code.

It wouldn't fix everything overnight but it would be a start.

[jfost]

Maybe just ban weirdos then!?!

[Buster Highmen]

Hey now.

[mb6f50]

Maybe just ban weirdos then!?!

Well identifying kids who struggle socially and helping them learn social skills as well as stopping bullying and promoting inclusion, tolerance and acceptance of differences probably wouldn't hurt.

[The Reverend Floater]

This might be unpopular with both sides but here we go:

The ATF recently changed the requirements (process) for buying a suppressor (silencer for laypeople/movie folks). Note that they make firearms quieter but they are FAR louder than what you hear in the movies, FWIW. But I digress...

I've been interested in them for a while as my hearing isnt what it used to be but it was a giant pain in the ass...fingerprints at the sheriff, giant applications, find a suppressor dealer (special ATF certification), get passport phtos taken, etc., then wait for a year to hear back.... so I never got around to it and didn't care enough to deal.

Recently, the ATF has created a digital process. Essentially, you go to the dealer, pay for the suppressor which they then put in a safe, step over to a digital kiosk that takes your finger prints, photo, all of your information and submits the whole kabab to the ATF digitally. Supposedly, approval for the suppressor "stamp" (approval for YOU and only YOU to use said suppressor) now takes about 90 days, at which point I come back to get that suppressor out of the dealer's safe--all assuming that I pass the FBI/ATF deeper background check.

So...why not leverage this tech for all firearms? It would NOT be an end to firearms violence but would be a meaningful step in prevention and also put in place a delay. Personally I think a 14 day delay would be reasonable for most firearms but that's just me. I've been hunting most of my life and cannot ever remember a time where I needed a new gun inside of 14 days.

In the end, it wouldn't change which firearms you could buy nor infringe upon your right to do so, but the deeper background check combined with delay seems like it would be helpful, no? I mean, the tech is already there.

[North]

This might be unpopular with both sides but here we go:

In the end, it wouldn't change which firearms you could buy nor infringe upon your right to do so, but the deeper background check combined with delay seems like it would be helpful, no? I mean, the tech is already there.

Man, I'm for anything that increases the time period between "want me a gun" and "got me a gun". Inconvenience seems like a small price to pay for a potential decrease in gun violence.

I'm at the point where I'd be pretty stoked on pretty much any move towards more gun control, however insignificant it may seem. Small changes won't solve the problem, but will have an impact IMO.

[MakersTeleMark]

Texas. It earned it.

[Cono Este]

My wife has been a teacher her entire adult life.

Doors have always been locked. Again, it's a deterrent but will absolutely not stop anyone from getting in.

The resource officer at one school made it perfectly clear multiple times to many teachers that he was going home at the end of the day no matter what.

The issue is the guns. Americans and their guns.

The issue is the whack job locking himself in a 4th grade classroom and killing kids. He could have done that with almost any gun and cops have no ability to breech. Hardening schools is the only solution.

The AR kept the cops at bay. And when the cops are out gunned we need to take action. If we’re fair, and rule out suicide by active shooter in their job profile, This is a perfect example of how they were powerless.

* I’ll also add, an AR gives the lunatic confidence. Emboldens him, fills his fantasy. Yes I’ll say a riot gun would have had the same outcome, but maybe he’d never try in the first place.


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[MakersTeleMark]

The issue is the whack job locking himself in a 4th grade classroom and killing kids. He could have done that with almost any gun. Hardening schools is the only solution.

The AR kept the cops at bay. And when the cops are out gunned we need to take action. If we’re fair, and rule out suicide by active shooter in their job profile, This is a perfect example of how they were powerless.


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He was in there for almost an hour. He could have killed with a knife. It doesn't change the problem. Look deeper into psychosis.

Seriously, look at the situation. He went to school there. He blasted rounds outside, he announced it on facebook, he went in, found a classroom and popped rounds for a long time. Simple. Then start asking why. He was in a closet. He just wanted to extract max pain. But why? That is the question. Can you approach it? The kid was hurting, why? Not because of guns. Why was he hurting enough to do that? Do you have an approach for that? We have all felt max pain, but didn't shoot children. Why did he? That is a story that maybe parents can learn from, no?

I don't assume to know when the last time you talked to someone of that age, but the last time I did it scared the fuck out of me.

And as a P.S. you are a fucking asshole, as much as I try to treat you with a modicum of respect as a person. That's just me venting.

[cinnepa]

^^^yes, but why is it only happening here? You have kids with mental problems all over the world ....im not confident anything worthwhile will get done because both sides of the aisle value their egos more than compromising any concessions with guns. Whether background checks or eliminating AR type purchases. Just my 2 cents.

[Bobby Stainless]

This might be unpopular with both sides but here we go:

The ATF recently changed the requirements (process) for buying a suppressor (silencer for laypeople/movie folks). Note that they make firearms quieter but they are FAR louder than what you hear in the movies, FWIW. But I digress...

I've been interested in them for a while as my hearing isnt what it used to be but it was a giant pain in the ass...fingerprints at the sheriff, giant applications, find a suppressor dealer (special ATF certification), get passport phtos taken, etc., then wait for a year to hear back.... so I never got around to it and didn't care enough to deal.

Recently, the ATF has created a digital process. Essentially, you go to the dealer, pay for the suppressor which they then put in a safe, step over to a digital kiosk that takes your finger prints, photo, all of your information and submits the whole kabab to the ATF digitally. Supposedly, approval for the suppressor "stamp" (approval for YOU and only YOU to use said suppressor) now takes about 90 days, at which point I come back to get that suppressor out of the dealer's safe--all assuming that I pass the FBI/ATF deeper background check.

So...why not leverage this tech for all firearms? It would NOT be an end to firearms violence but would be a meaningful step in prevention and also put in place a delay. Personally I think a 14 day delay would be reasonable for most firearms but that's just me. I've been hunting most of my life and cannot ever remember a time where I needed a new gun inside of 14 days.

In the end, it wouldn't change which firearms you could buy nor infringe upon your right to do so, but the deeper background check combined with delay seems like it would be helpful, no? I mean, the tech is already there.

aka Class 3.

The Silencer Shop kiosks work for all Class 3 items.

The fact something that makes a gun less obnoxious is Class 3, is absurd.

Of course this would only work if you require private sales to go through a FFL.

[SumJongGuy]

Hardening schools is the only solution.

And grocery stores, and Walmarts, and shopping malls, and churches, and synagogues, and mosques, and outdoor concert venues, etc....

[TBS]

Beau’s idea here makes a lot of sense to me given the political realities


Coupled with making the waiting period “as long as it fucking takes to make us comfortable that you are not a danger to self and others”

[schuss]

This might be unpopular with both sides but here we go:

The ATF recently changed the requirements (process) for buying a suppressor (silencer for laypeople/movie folks). Note that they make firearms quieter but they are FAR louder than what you hear in the movies, FWIW. But I digress...

I've been interested in them for a while as my hearing isnt what it used to be but it was a giant pain in the ass...fingerprints at the sheriff, giant applications, find a suppressor dealer (special ATF certification), get passport phtos taken, etc., then wait for a year to hear back.... so I never got around to it and didn't care enough to deal.

Recently, the ATF has created a digital process. Essentially, you go to the dealer, pay for the suppressor which they then put in a safe, step over to a digital kiosk that takes your finger prints, photo, all of your information and submits the whole kabab to the ATF digitally. Supposedly, approval for the suppressor "stamp" (approval for YOU and only YOU to use said suppressor) now takes about 90 days, at which point I come back to get that suppressor out of the dealer's safe--all assuming that I pass the FBI/ATF deeper background check.

So...why not leverage this tech for all firearms? It would NOT be an end to firearms violence but would be a meaningful step in prevention and also put in place a delay. Personally I think a 14 day delay would be reasonable for most firearms but that's just me. I've been hunting most of my life and cannot ever remember a time where I needed a new gun inside of 14 days.

In the end, it wouldn't change which firearms you could buy nor infringe upon your right to do so, but the deeper background check combined with delay seems like it would be helpful, no? I mean, the tech is already there.

They aren't allowed to. NRA and others lobby hard to prevent digitization of processes or anything that would eliminate the burden of tracing and data patterning to do things like identify problematic straw purchasers.

Here's an older article, but as far as I know, these laws still stand.
https://www.thetrace.org/2016/08/atf...ble-databases/

[MagnificentUnicorn]

aka Class 3.

The Silencer Shop kiosks work for all Class 3 items.

The fact something that makes a gun less obnoxious is Class 3, is absurd.

Of course this would only work if you require private sales to go through a FFL.

A suppressor shouldn’t be harder to get than an AR and a handful of 30 round magazines that’s for sure


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[MultiVerse]

The cost of gun violence in America is approaching $300 billion annually. Everybody’s taxes are paying for the gun problem and it's yet another reason the National Rifle Association and other influential gun rights advocates don't want anything digitized or studied.

[Cono Este]

He was in there for almost an hour. He could have killed with a knife. It doesn't change the problem. Look deeper into psychosis.

Seriously, look at the situation. He went to school there. He blasted rounds outside, he announced it on facebook, he went in, found a classroom and popped rounds for a long time. Simple. Then start asking why. He was in a closet. He just wanted to extract max pain. But why? That is the question. Can you approach it? The kid was hurting, why? Not because of guns. Why was he hurting enough to do that? Do you have an approach for that? We have all felt max pain, but didn't shoot children. Why did he? That is a story that maybe parents can learn from, no?

I don't assume to know when the last time you talked to someone of that age, but the last time I did it scared the fuck out of me.

And as a P.S. you are a fucking asshole, as much as I try to treat you with a modicum of respect as a person. That's just me venting.

I don’t get your last paragraph. I have two 18 yr olds, twins. I have a harder time than most trying to imagine this.

We ban assault weapons and kids won’t have access to the same weapons they precondition themselves to use playing CD 12 hrs a day. They won’t have confidence to take on the town, and it will save some lives vs a shotgun. And when it happens the police will have a chance.

My GYM is better designed and has more security than my kids school. Jewish center, they stopped waiting for the govt to do something.

Security is a growing industry around the world. Chile is 10x more dangerous than it was in the 80’s. Guns come down from Columbia all my friends sold their houses and move to high rises due to crime.

It’s a fact of life. And it’s a fact of life even democrats will leave the lunatics with an arsenal.


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[MultiVerse]

He was in there for almost an hour. He could have killed with a knife. It doesn't change the problem. Look deeper into psychosis.

I don't assume to know when the last time you talked to someone of that age, but the last time I did it scared the fuck out of me.

- Your first point is just wrong. The cops were inside the school within two minutes of the shooter entering the school. During which time the shooter had already fired a 100 rounds. Two cops immediately received grazing wounds and that's why they backed away. If the shooter had been armed with only a knife then even the incompetent cops of Uvalde would have just shot him.

- Old people complaining about young people is timeless. The bigger the age difference the worse it seems to the olds. In fact, the overall rate of school shootings was higher in the mid 90s than now. For some reason the rise of school shootings coincided with the proliferation of easy-to-buy assault style weapons. Then, shootings started to go down in late 90s and early 00s before ticking back up.

- I think all the school drills, all the security, all the media coverage, combined with easy access to weapons have made school shootings a cultural meme like serial killers were in the past. Serial killers used to imitate other serial killers. Now gunmen are imitating other gunmen.

[ötzi]

It's clear that the mental health system in this country is badly broken. My Dad was a psychiatrist who worked for the state and the Feds (with the VA), and I grew up with this crisis brewing, my Dad talked about it a lot, and predicted it. Unfortunately he was very right.

It's also clear that guns are out of control, and I use that phrase advisedly. There is a lack of control. That's obvious to anyone.

But to say that nothing can be done about guns because the mental health system is broken is just whataboutism. Both things need to be addressed.

[SumJongGuy]

It's clear that the mental health system in this country is badly broken. My Dad was a psychiatrist who worked for the state and the Feds (with the VA), and I grew up with this crisis brewing, my Dad talked about it a lot, and predicted it. Unfortunately he was very right.

It's also clear that guns are out of control, and I use that phrase advisedly. There is a lack of control. That's obvious to anyone.

But to say that nothing can be done about guns because the mental health system is broken is just whataboutism. Both things need to be addressed.

Another offshoot of Reganomics.... shutting down the federally funded system of mental health hospitals. Now the answer is to put the crazy people in their parent's basements and HOPE they take their meds..

This is also a problem that universal healthcare would greatly alleviate.. It would better facilitate annual/periodic psych exams for CCW/CCL holders. And, the people most opposed to those are the paranoid nutjobs (but wut if da gubbermnt just says im insane to tek muy gunz?) that shouldn't have guns in the first place...

[MagnificentUnicorn]

- Your first point is just wrong. The cops were inside the school within two minutes of the shooter entering the school. During which time the shooter had already fired a 100 rounds. Two cops immediately received grazing wounds and that's why they backed away. If the shooter had been armed with only a knife then even the incompetent cops of Uvalde would have just shot him.

- Old people complaining about young people is timeless. The bigger the age difference the worse it seems to the olds. In fact, the overall rate of school shootings was higher in the mid 90s than now. For some reason the rise of school shootings coincided with the proliferation of easy-to-buy assault style weapons. Then, shootings started to go down in late 90s and early 00s before ticking back up.

AWB is put into law 1994 and expired in 2004. Is it coincidental that is the same timeline in your post?


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[MagnificentUnicorn]

It's clear that the mental health system in this country is badly broken. My Dad was a psychiatrist who worked for the state and the Feds (with the VA), and I grew up with this crisis brewing, my Dad talked about it a lot, and predicted it. Unfortunately he was very right.

It's also clear that guns are out of control, and I use that phrase advisedly. There is a lack of control. That's obvious to anyone.

But to say that nothing can be done about guns because the mental health system is broken is just whataboutism. Both things need to be addressed.

This makes too much sense


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[MagnificentUnicorn]

Another offshoot of Reganomics.... shutting down the federally funded system of mental health hospitals. Now the answer is to put the crazy people in their parent's basements and HOPE they take their meds..

This is also a problem that universal healthcare would greatly alleviate.. It would better facilitate annual/periodic psych exams for CCW/CCL holders. And, the people most opposed to those are the paranoid nutjobs (but wut if da gubbermnt just says im insane to tek muy gunz?) that shouldn't have guns in the first place...

Where’s Louise Fletcher when you need her


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